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Ortofon's MC Anna and 12" arms

R

Royaloak

pfm Member
Just curious if anyone has experience with this cartridge in both 9 and 12" arms. Seems like 16g, 12" inches from the pivot may be too high a moment of inertia. Wondering if it might work better in a 9"

I ask, as I have just ordered an SME 20/12 with a V12 arm, originally my plan was for a 20/3 and the Anna. Then decided on the bigger table and use my perfectly good Ortofon PW, and upgrade to the Anna down the road.

Thanks.
 
Just buy it. The Anna is probably the best lager in the world. I have the A90, the second-best lager.
 
As one who was/is interested in a V12, I guess you know that its eff. mass is 12 grammes, which is low for a 12" (clever engineering, as the V is 11 g !!!!!)

Although not the whole story, I'd say that a 16 g cart (similar weight to the Benz LPS) is a bit on the heavy side. Worth working out the equations to see if it's a theoretical match, though the plan to stick to what you have is sound. Forget about 9" if you can accommodate a properly designed 12"; I lived with a Five for 13 years, but now have a 12" (N.A. Ace Anna)
 
I heard that the Anna has not been a commercial success plus they have had quite a few failures.
The next flagship Ortofon will be along the lines of an "A95".
I'm very happy with my A90. Not only does it sound quite awesome but it looks like a space age claw-thing.
 
I think you did the sensible thing in choosing the 12inch version of the model 20. To my ears it is an obviously superior deck. I haven't heard the Anna but I know someone who has used it on an SME v12 arm, and he says it sounds great.
I have heard heavier cartridges (stone bodied Koetsus, which are pretty heavy) on the V12 and really liked the sound. When you have the cash, grab an Anna and I'm sure you will be thrilled. Wish I could afford one, but for now.......
As was pointed-out, the mass of the 9inch and 12inch arms is very similar. What works on one seems to work well on the other.
 
Ortofon seem to be developing models with quite short life spans these days, first the A90, and now, from what this thread suggests, the Anna. They are probably the world's most experienced manufacturer of cartridges (certainly one of them) so problems about reliability seem puzzling.
If I had the money to spare, I'd happily buy an Anna....but from a good reliable dealer, just in case problems did develop. I think Ortofon are a pretty decent company, they would do the right thing.
 
The Anna suffers from a bad reputation for reliability which, as far as I can tell, originates with the Stereophile review of the Anna by Michael Fremer. Mike got a sample from the first batch of 10 which did indeed suffer from some problems. This was a beta run, Ortofon claimed, and not intended for release into the wilderness. All problems were rectified in later production, Ortofon says. The German importer has not had any problems with this cartridge.

Apart from that, I don't think the Anna was a sales success for Ortofon. I guess potential buyers didn't appreciate the celebrity tie-in (just as the Per Windfeld never sold in the expected numbers even though Ortofon principals rate it very highly), so they are reverting to the nomenclature and marketing model that has worked for them before. A95 seems a better fit to Nordic sobriety than Anna.
 
Yes, effective mass, cartridge weight and compliance all say good, approx 10hz.

I have always had my doubts about a lot of weight far from the pivot.....makes me nervous. Maybe I should just relax.

Wonder if the A95 is just the usual Internet nonsense.
 
It seems odd they want from a bodiless to an embodied design

Has anyone compared the two in the same set-up?
 
Royaloak said:
I have always had my doubts about a lot of weight far from the pivot.....makes me nervous. Maybe I should just relax.
Click to expand...

I used the SPU for years on a 12" Ortofon arm. Glorious combination.
 
paskinn said:
Ortofon seem to be developing models with quite short life spans these days, first the A90, and now, from what this thread suggests, the Anna. They are probably the world's most experienced manufacturer of cartridges (certainly one of them) so problems about reliability seem puzzling.
If I had the money to spare, I'd happily buy an Anna....but from a good reliable dealer, just in case problems did develop. I think Ortofon are a pretty decent company, they would do the right thing.
Click to expand...

But Peter, won't 16g at a 12" distance give a substantial increase in effective mass/moment of inertia comared with 9" distance. I'm not a mathematician, but intuitively I'd imagine a 33% increase, over and above the 12" arms inherently higher effective mass.

Keith.
 
Covkxw said:
But Peter, won't 16g at a 12" distance give a substantial increase in effective mass/moment of inertia comared with 9" distance. I'm not a mathematician, but intuitively I'd imagine a 33% increase, over and above the 12" arms inherently higher effective mass.

Keith.
Click to expand...

The effective mass is an important parameter since it defines whether warps will excite the resonance of the cartridge/arm combination and it defines its bass response.
The moment of inertia about the pivot only makes a difference on off-center records, which are ruined by wow anyway IME.
 
Royaloak said:
Just curious if anyone has experience with this cartridge in both 9 and 12" arms. Seems like 16g, 12" inches from the pivot may be too high a moment of inertia. Wondering if it might work better in a 9"

I ask, as I have just ordered an SME 20/12 with a V12 arm, originally my plan was for a 20/3 and the Anna. Then decided on the bigger table and use my perfectly good Ortofon PW, and upgrade to the Anna down the road.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Personally I would have recommended a warmer sounding cartridge than the MC Anna on the SME.
 
But thanks anyways GT Audio on your reply regarding inertia. Just getting set-up with two 12" ers. All my previous experience has been with 9 and 10.5" arms.
 
Covkxw said:
But Peter, won't 16g at a 12" distance give a substantial increase in effective mass/moment of inertia comared with 9" distance. I'm not a mathematician, but intuitively I'd imagine a 33% increase, over and above the 12" arms inherently higher effective mass.

Keith.
Click to expand...

My physics isn't good enough to answer accurately. But, in practice, I have often used the v12 with cartridges weighing 16gms, and not noticed any issues. I know someone who uses the v12 with a cartridge weighting 21gms, and his system sounds great. So, whatever the theory, you will be fine.
However, I find that 12inch arms (in general, not just the V12) sound slightly more 'relaxed', less obviously dynamic than the same arm at 9inch. That could be due to the moment of inertia I suppose. I consistently prefer the longer arms, but, as always, its a matter of personal taste. I somehow doubt that the differences can all be explained by slight changes in tracking distortion.
 
Just like a short wheelbase car or motorcycle will be more nimble (dynamic) but less stable (smooth) than a long wheelbase one.
 
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