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Oh Britain, what have you done (part ∞+21)?

Discussion in 'off topic' started by ff1d1l, Apr 21, 2019.

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  1. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    Hey, you're the one wailing and gnashing your teeth about the coming fire. For me Brexit is a morbid symptom of a senescent conservatism based on wealth extraction and compensatory sadism, a press culture built on telling people that a corrupt lefty elite is perversely withholding simple common sense solutions to everything, and of Labour's decision, a lifetime ago, to model itself on all this instead of opposing it. And now...
    ...why, it looks like that old lefty bastard is perversely withholding a simple solution to all the problems! Corbyn! Get that toothpaste back in the tube this minute!

    Labour's been trying damp down the flames on this phony war so that it can get into government and deal with its causes. Doesn't look like it's going to be possible now, and maybe it never was: it'll have to start wetting itself and shouting at people if it wants to rally the progressives. But the best chance of taking the heat out of it long term is still radical reform, and that means a Labour government. Maybe you'll be alright in Scotland.
     
  2. Brian

    Brian Eating fat, staying slim

    :D Back to business as usual.

    Fact is, hard though it is for you to accept, you are implicit in brexit by enabling a tory government. Me? It's nowt to do with me. I haven't done anything that enabled a tory government, I do not support their ideology or their policies. Not only are you implicit in brexit, you wish to inflict economic damage on Scotland. Unicorns are alive and well in your world, it seems.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2019
  3. Joe

    Joe pfm Member


    The first, and in many ways only . radical reform needed to to do away with the First Past The Post electoral system that we use. It is ridiculously outmoded and anti-democratic.
     
  4. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    This time, and last time, and the time before that...Face facts: there is a long term decline of centrism across Europe and no plan for dealing with it. Centrist parties are still aping the right and talking about borders and camps despite having been shown multiple times that this only fuels the right.
     
  5. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    So, to recap: Tories & Labour dead in the water/moving backwards. Lib Dems, Greens, SNP all substantially up. As PSB says this ties in with Europe too; self-identifying ‘socialists’ are taking a beating from the alt-right, but the centre is hanging in there.

    Labour are clearly dead in the water with ‘70s ideologues Corbyn and McCluskey in control, why not just admit it?
     
  6. gassor

    gassor There may be more posts after this.

    Anyone can take a stance on anything. When you look at the way he has dealt with the two biggest issues facing Labour you see how inept he is. The polls indicate that just 18% of the public now holding a favourable view of him, compared to nearly four times that number (71%) who have an unfavourable view. And this at a time when the Tories are going down the toilet. Maybe the moon people swirling around his gonads will vote for him, very few others are impressed.
     
    ff1d1l likes this.
  7. Joe

    Joe pfm Member

    What all this noise about Brexit has done is to blow a smokescreen over the fact that the EU as a construct is deeply flawed , undemocratic and fundamentally a power grab by the old Empires of Europe. There is increasing discontent in European states over the structure of the EU. People are voting accordingly and the old centrist powers will be the losers in that movement. Britain rather went overboard when it was asked what it thought of the EU but the general trend is the same in Europe. Time will tell.
     
    eternumviti likes this.
  8. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    [Shakes fist] Seumas Milne, you old lefty bastard!

    "The centre" here just means "common sense stuff I believe." When we stop to ask what actually existing centrism really means, substantively, there's nothing common sense about it: it means continued support for austerity, ongoing privatisation, arms sales to Saudi Arabia, constant belligerence in the Middle East to keep everything ticking over, bit of immigrant bashing to keep the papers happy. That is not where most people sit politically, and if it were Change UK would be 20 points ahead in the polls right now.
     
  9. lordsummit

    lordsummit Moderator

    Ooh, seems we’ve touched a nerve! You are though a champagne socialist aren’t you, a house worth a fortune, bikes and hi-fi likewise, always telling us how well you did out of working for a right wing rag...

    Do as I say not do as I do springs to mind!!
     
  10. flatpopely

    flatpopely Prog Rock/Moderator

    Claire, pfm is litted with anti police statements, like the above, from your goodself.
    As someone who has had many dealings with the police through work and once sadly under investigation, with one exception I have found them professional and polite.
    How have your dealings differed?
     
  11. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    This is the tragedy- a leader like May, exceptional in political misjudgment, can lead an insubordinate government with 30 odd ministerial firings and resignations and take the country down with her, and yet the official opposition is incapable of laying a glove on her. It falls to her own party to attack itself. The worst Prime Minister in living memory married to the most incompetent and divided official opposition and now the far right are taking control of the mob.
     
    PsB, Colin L and gassor like this.
  12. notaclue

    notaclue pfm Member

    I find it's best to assume that HarryB is a natural, money-loving, boasting Tory. That is how his posts comes across to me. I think the hating Tory stuff is classic 'doth protest too much' cover. I know nothing of other people's wealth, houses, jobs, etc on pfm. Never noticed. Only HarryB (probably cos he likes people to notice).
     
  13. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    You’re not a Special Constable by any chance?
     
  14. ff1d1l

    ff1d1l pfm Member

    Milne a lefty? Interesting POV. Not a disaster National Socialist labour equivalent of, and co worker with, the disaster capitalist ERG?

    Because that's a better fit with the facts...
     
  15. Seanm

    Seanm pfm Member

    [shakes fist] Corbyn and McCluskey, get out of the way!

    I honestly don't know where PSB gets his resurgent centre story from! It's f___ed! Lots of reasons why the left isn't making headway in Europe but it's not just them that getting worn down by the right. The question is: who has the answers, and what might they be? Because mostly what I'm seeing is more talk about defending borders, as if the problem were not being too right wing economically, but failing to be right wing enough culturally.
     
  16. flatpopely

    flatpopely Prog Rock/Moderator

    Nope. Never served for or with the police.
     
  17. ff1d1l

    ff1d1l pfm Member

    My partners cousin was wheeling his pushbike home from central Edinburgh late one night. Was then set upon by a bunch of men. "Help, Police" , he shouted. "We are the Police", came the answer.

    A complaint produced little in the way of results, except his Ducati moterbike was mysteriously burned out on the drive in front of the house.
     
  18. Joe

    Joe pfm Member

    I have no dog in this race but he was questioning your principles and went on to ask a question impinging directly upon those principles. Where is that argumentum ad hominem ?

    Maybe a true Socialist would have stayed within the party and fought for new better and more representative leadership. You left over one issue ?

    Didn't take much then did it ?

    Others stayed and got a shiny new leader much more aligned with their own thinking.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2019
  19. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    Should have done what my friend did when the police stopped her for a traffic violation cycling back from mine one night (drink had been taken) in Edinburgh about 25 years ago. Name? Fanny. Fanny What? Fanny Price. Address? Mansfield Park. What number? Eh, 53. Right, you’ll be hearing from us.
     
  20. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    I think you’d be good at it.
     
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