Rockmeister
pfm Member
The teachers unions can be effective enough...the workforce by and large are educated and left leaning. It went to strike action in the 80's to great effect. NAS, and NASUWT in '85 forced through the pay increases. I was there 
Militant Teacher Unions
- Thread starter Simon Vess
- Start date
Yes but exposure to the danger can be mitigated with good decision makers making good decisions. I've served under good leaders who make good decisions and bad leaders (,often graduates) who make unfathomable decisions. There is a right to question orders but an union it isn't and generally troops will have to enact those orders and make some small changes to ensure they don't get their heads chopped off/legs blown off/inhale noxious gases etc etc.
Nou union means 'get on with it airman'. Should it be like this?
mandryka
pfm Member
I don’t think it can happen because teachers are not militant. The workforce is chosen partly for its lack of militancy.
Rockmeister
pfm Member
And of course, your other care, as a teacher, will be the health and safety of your pupils.
misterdog
Not the canine kind
In 1999/2000 somewhere between 20,000 and 48,0000 died from the flu virus, did the education system close down due to the risk.
Did we choose to stay at home waiting for a safe and effective vaccine.
It's easy to choose when you are on the public payroll and your bank balance is topped up whatever is happening.
I don't see many teachers risking bankruptcy and loosing their homes as many in the private sector will/have.
Rockmeister
pfm Member
? I don't recal the interview where my politics were questioned at Uni. Did I miss it?
If you are happy to trot this line out to cover off any ills that a soldier/sailor/airman might have to endure then there is not much more I can say.
Simon Vess
pfm Member
The government has rightly banned smoking in enclosed spaces and one of the main arguments used was to protect the health and safety of staff employed in said spaces
Surely this same argument is valid in the case of the covid -19?
simon
Surely this same argument is valid in the case of the covid -19?
simon
mandryka
pfm Member
When teachers are hired their flexibility and willingness to conform is a major factor. Teachers who aren’t willing or able to do what management demands get pushed into the reserve army of supply staff. That threat is sufficient to keep most of them in line whatever qualms they have about the nature of the job.
From a human resource management point of view it’s an extremely good system. It will be hard to change. Other professions have a similar structure, it has become quite widespread since the days of Regan and Thatcher, one of their most important legacies.
My daughter is a primary school teacher age 26 with no underlying health issues. She has been teaching pretty much full time on Zoom throughout the lockdown. She would far rather teach in person as would most of her colleagues. She works in a private school so it was expected they carried on working so that the school fees still came in and they will have the advantage of smaller class sizes. He fiancé who is a teacher in the state system is less inclined to teach in person but I suspect this is down to liking the easier life over the last few months.
Tony L
Administrator
This disease is orders of magnitude more deadly than flu and spreads in a whole different way. Just look at the statistics. Sadly we’ll almost certainly get to see this distinction play out soon as the UK has lost control of things pretty much entirely now. I’ll be amazed if a heck of a lot more people don’t die in the next months/year, i.e. far, far more than the estimated 65,000+ (excess death figure, which is hugely more reliable than the government’s botched stats) who have died so far. We will be following the USA and Brazil back into exponential spread within weeks.
misterdog
Not the canine kind
Though if half the world hides behind the settee until the virus 'goes away', (it may never do like the flu). Then the bankruptcy of the world economy will preclude the ability to pay for an education system.
I wonder how many teachers were in Bournemouth the other day in those half a million avoiding risk.
I wonder how many teachers were in Bournemouth the other day in those half a million avoiding risk.
Rockmeister
pfm Member
That's true of 90% of all jobs.
Q. Well Mr X, we like your resume, but we must ask, will you be happy to go along with company policy and do the work we ask?
Ans. Get F*****d, ofc not.
OK Mr X, you have the job. Well done.
I did a good teaching job for 40 years but when needed, I allowed my politics free flow. In 6different schools, the management never once suggested I was not free to do as I wished, and most were openly supportive. So were the unions.
In cases of policy, we were always consulted, represented and heard. Most often these consultations resulted in the changes we wanted.
I don't know where you teach, but it isn't my experience at all.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
NAS, and NASUWT in '85 forced through the pay increases. I was there
Didn't know you were at the chalk-face, Rocky. '85 was when I started supply teaching, so wasn't aware of a hike in salaries. When I was a regular teacher, the NUT were the left-leaning, strike-prone lot and the NASUWT were not. Unfortunately, even then, the threat of parent/pupil action etc. was strong at secondary level, and one took a career chance without a backing union. I resisted for most of my years but finally caved in; can't even remember now which one got my patronage for a short while. Small schools, including mine, were closing at a rate of knots so things were a bit chaotic from around '1980 to '84 or so.
Strangely, despite supply teaching probably being more fraught with danger (kids like their regular teacher), I was never approached by a union rep. or contacted otherwise. Chalk under the bridge now, I'm happy to say. In my EFL career, I was never made aware of ANY union, yet we taught children as well as adults, and some of those rich Russian kids could be problematic !
Rockmeister
pfm Member
Unplanned really, but never regretted it (except when I needed serious money, for a home or etc
). Started in Wales comprehensives, then London, then I.O.W comp and switched to Indi for a HOD job around 1990. Big hike in pay and got given a flat to boot. Then boarding housemaster and finally another Indi in the midlands, housemaster and H of Art.Did once get asked to apply for deputy head, but nil interest in that, even tho money was good.
mandryka
pfm Member
Yes
Excellent. You found some good places to work, by the sound of it, or at least, places where you could fit in.
mandryka
pfm Member
One place where I think teachers are militant, but maybe not in the way we intend, is in academy schools, Harris Academy is an example. There the ethos seems like a fight to bring outstanding education to the poor working classes, a sector which they think has been failed by Local Authority education, whatever the cost to the staff personally. Harris teachers are warrior heroes.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
You seem to be looking for a fight when there isn’t one. I haven’t made any mention of the ills facing any soldier sailor or airman, this thread is t about the ills of soldiers sailors or airman. It isn’t even about the wider ills facing teachers. It about the attack on teaching unions from the Daily Mail.
Bob McC
Living the life of Riley
Bollocks.
No one ever asked me my politics when I started teaching 46 years ago or at any subsequent interview as I progressed through the profession.
Six, this was for everyone. Reading back it was focussed wrongly.