Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
I seem to recollect that you considered the original Mdac completely transparent, presumably you feel now it wasn't?
Kr Keith.
Kr Keith.
MDAC First Listen (part XXVI)
- Thread starter Purité Audio
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I somehow suspected this was a gibe:
Lo and behold - yes it was:
A shame, as this seemed to be a perfectly fair and level headed offer:
Lo and behold - yes it was:
A shame, as this seemed to be a perfectly fair and level headed offer:
iansr
pfm Member
Yes, what Mr Purite is conveniently forgetting is that transparent is a relative term in hi fi, not an absolute. When listening to good kit you only become aware of transparency limitations when you hear something even more transparent. eg in my case moving from First Watt amplifiers (which are excellent) to Ncores.
So I wonder, what's your agenda Mr Purite?
So I wonder, what's your agenda Mr Purite?
Best not stoke up the debate on here, otherwise this thread which should be reserved for all things relating to MDAC upgrades, issues, and support, will turn into another bloody Objectivist V Subjectivist waste of electrons...
I honestly couldn't say unless I can re-acquire the ADC I used for the loop test and re-run it. All I can say about this iteration of the MDAC is that, compared side by side with the standard unit I have here, I prefer the quality of the modified one.
What has also wriggled out of the woodwork during this process is an apparently alarming degree of subtle variation between units, and I have no way of knowing how close my original (unmodified) unit was to the newly-acquired (as yet unmodified) unit.
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
Yes quite alarming that a manufacturer cannot guarantee sample quality.
Keith.
Keith.
PhilCTTE
Senior mumbler
Hi Phil,
Thanks for the offer - but I truly hope that I've now cracked the issues at hand... your u nit is near the top of the pile to be upgraded... I'm hoping to get most of the units out by 15 Aug. to start working on MDAC2
Thank you ...great news .
Just breaking in a new pair of AKG q701 headphones.
On hols weekend 17/18 till end of August. Will discuss via pm nearer the time.
Ah so this will prove that it is transparent... And is 100% fool proof ?
Steven Toy
Accuphase newbie
I am sure that Lakewest will be guaranteeing sample quality unlike Audiolab (allegedly.)
Thank you ...great news .
Just breaking in a new pair of AKG q701 headphones.
...no small task if they're anything like my K702s, I had mine on repeat 24*7 before they started sounding anything like
sq225917
Bit of this, bit of that
Obviously that's just not the case Keith. The units shipped from IAG have all obviously passed their QC procedure. The simple fact of the matter is that John is much more demanding in terms of what he defines as acceptable electrical and sound quality variance.
Personally as a discerning customer I'm glad that he is. The Mdac sounds great, as I've stated many times the basic unit is within arse kicking distance of the Weiss 202. So benefiting from Johns mods I'd expect the difference between the two units to be none existent.
I'm sure we could arrange a room at Scalford to demo the two units blind and see if anyone can tell them apart. It should be enlightening to see what the difference between a 5k and 1k dac actually is...
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
Simon post 674
JohnW
' I'm very disappointed with the variance I've heard between "Original" MDAC's... something that will not accepted with MDAC2 units - I'll personally listen to each MDAC2 PCB before shipping out to insure constancy - I'll sign off each unit. This is not to sound "Big Headed" in anyway, but I've been so distressed at some units SQ...'
Doesn't fill me with confidence at Audiolabs QC.
Keith.
JohnW
' I'm very disappointed with the variance I've heard between "Original" MDAC's... something that will not accepted with MDAC2 units - I'll personally listen to each MDAC2 PCB before shipping out to insure constancy - I'll sign off each unit. This is not to sound "Big Headed" in anyway, but I've been so distressed at some units SQ...'
Doesn't fill me with confidence at Audiolabs QC.
Keith.
Ah! another sharp-pointy-stick post
I don't see that John's post actually contradicts Simon's post:
Keith, you'll probably have to spell out what you think the relevance of your last post is to the complete discussion. There are many ways in which it can be interpreted and replied to and I'm not sure that any of them are worth the time and effort
eg.
Quality control procedures at other manufacturers vs. Audiolab
Listening tests as part of QC at other (any) manufacturers
Relevance of listening tests as part of QC
Absolute variability between MDACs
JohnW's interpretation of variability between units vs any typical (or even high-end) QC processes
How bad does the 'worst' production MDAC actually sound
What are the sound differences like with other manufacturers' production runs
- remember all DACs sound the same!
A few posts back you seemed to challenge PhilCCTE to hear any difference between any MDAC units, standard or modified, so on that basis any production variation makes no difference
I don't see that John's post actually contradicts Simon's post:
Keith, you'll probably have to spell out what you think the relevance of your last post is to the complete discussion. There are many ways in which it can be interpreted and replied to and I'm not sure that any of them are worth the time and effort
eg.
Quality control procedures at other manufacturers vs. Audiolab
Listening tests as part of QC at other (any) manufacturers
Relevance of listening tests as part of QC
Absolute variability between MDACs
JohnW's interpretation of variability between units vs any typical (or even high-end) QC processes
How bad does the 'worst' production MDAC actually sound
What are the sound differences like with other manufacturers' production runs
- remember all DACs sound the same!
A few posts back you seemed to challenge PhilCCTE to hear any difference between any MDAC units, standard or modified, so on that basis any production variation makes no difference
Having just spent the best part of a week in John's company, I can confirm that he is, by any rational definition, obsessive about the quality he is coaxing out of these units. The other fact is that, having been 'taught' what to listen for in this particular respect, it has to be said that the characteristic which JW is slaving to eliminate is not a basic difference of sound signature permeating everything to which you listen. These are subtle, particular sonic 'events' which John has identified as useful tests for his purposes but it is quite possible that Joe User could spend an entire lifetime listening to an MDAC and never encounter the conditions that cause JW to shudder.
The other interesting point concerning this 'revelation' about consistency is that very few hi-fi products are sold in sufficient quantities, with the number of users in one forum at one time, that such facts come to the surface. Most products are made, it seems, in ones and twos so the possibility for impartial comparison between specimens is rare indeed.
I wonder how many other products exhibit variances between the designer's prototype and factory production.
JohnW
pfm member
I very much doubt that Audiolab's unit to unit variances is much different from anyone's else's (apart from a couple of odd "butchered" units) - I challenge anyone to manufacture 20K to 30K units and insure every single unit sounds identical - Audio Sound quality is especially sensitive and "subjective"...
I suspect that there is even more variance with speakers systems...
Its not a criticism of Audiolab, but the reality if each unit is not listened to by a single person with the experience, time and peace to critically listen to each unit...
I suspect that there is even more variance with speakers systems...
Its not a criticism of Audiolab, but the reality if each unit is not listened to by a single person with the experience, time and peace to critically listen to each unit...
Mikas
pfm Member
wwhat? MDAC First Listen (part XXV) thread is not in the first page? can't afford to see. bump.
We're on holidays.
...except for John of course.
Someone has to teach him first what that is.
Michael
sq225917
Bit of this, bit of that
Keith a casual reader of this thread might consider that you are just trying to stir things up. After all it must be so galling when threads about competitive products to those that you sell seem to be doing so well, especially if your own threads seemed somewhat lacking in vigour and user interaction.
Obviously I know you're a better man than that, but the casual reader might not get that impression.
Obviously I know you're a better man than that, but the casual reader might not get that impression.
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
Simon I used to recommend the MDAC as a budget option ,but I am dismayed when I read that the designer of the product is disappointed in sample variation.
Keith.
Keith.
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