moffer
pfm Member
Agree. A 20x loupe would be no use to me as I find it difficult enough with 10x, and that's with a good quality Opticron loupe.
Loupes for stylus inspection etc
- Thread starter Tony L
- Start date
Agree. A 20x loupe would be no use to me as I find it difficult enough with 10x, and that's with a good quality Opticron loupe.
Tony L
Administrator
FWIW my earlier post about magnification really is utter bollocks, for some reason I’d misremembered the eyepiece code, its a WF10X, so 10x, and the smallest objective is 4x, so the iPhone pic is 4x10, so 40x magnification total and therefore four times the Belomo loupe. I understand it perfectly now. The picture is not quite that simple though as the iPhone can’t get close enough to the eyepiece to see the full field of view, so the impression from my pic is probably of an even larger magnification, but far less sharp than it is in reality (again I found it very hard to focus for the iPhone, plus it kept hunting for focus itself, so really not an example to be taken seriously here.
I’ve found I have enough room beneath the small objective with the platform wound down to stand the M95 up on its pins and get a nicely focused front-on shot, so this thing has no issue with a typical sized cart. That’s standing it on a glass slide, technically I could lose the pin length by winding the lower condenser lens assembly down (or removing it, it just clips in) and pushing the pins through a piece of card, i.e. it could deal with a longer cart body if need be.
I’ve found I have enough room beneath the small objective with the platform wound down to stand the M95 up on its pins and get a nicely focused front-on shot, so this thing has no issue with a typical sized cart. That’s standing it on a glass slide, technically I could lose the pin length by winding the lower condenser lens assembly down (or removing it, it just clips in) and pushing the pins through a piece of card, i.e. it could deal with a longer cart body if need be.
LOL - that makes better sense Tony - eye-piece and objectives are normally just marked with mag'.
Conventionally, for the unfamiliar, the objective is taken as close as possible to the object, just using your eye, from one side, focus is then achieved by coming back, away from the object, so you avoid collisions. (VERY easily said, not so easy to achieve in practise when concentration drifts to what you are looking at, not what you are doing with the actual lens/focus.)
As far as mounting goes, Blutak is good, although it can be frustrating if you use it so that it relaxes - not obvious by eye, but certainly so when magnified.
Now think of the size of the actual features on the business end of the sylus. How many times mag' would you need to be able to make-out anything on that scale...………………….
Conventional microscopes are very cheap if you are patient. A really good binocular/stereo scope can be had about £90 or so. Ideally try to win a Schott octopus light too, but they come relatively expensive.
Conventionally, for the unfamiliar, the objective is taken as close as possible to the object, just using your eye, from one side, focus is then achieved by coming back, away from the object, so you avoid collisions. (VERY easily said, not so easy to achieve in practise when concentration drifts to what you are looking at, not what you are doing with the actual lens/focus.)
As far as mounting goes, Blutak is good, although it can be frustrating if you use it so that it relaxes - not obvious by eye, but certainly so when magnified.
Now think of the size of the actual features on the business end of the sylus. How many times mag' would you need to be able to make-out anything on that scale...………………….
Conventional microscopes are very cheap if you are patient. A really good binocular/stereo scope can be had about £90 or so. Ideally try to win a Schott octopus light too, but they come relatively expensive.
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+1 for Blutak.
I've just been checking a DL103 on my old Russian(?) copy of Tony's mic and it's surprising what you can do simply holding the cartridge by hand and being VERY slow with your movements whilst resting your hand on the focusing stage.
50 x magnification in my case.
High intensity illumination accurately directed seems to be the key. Oh for 3 hands!
I've just been checking a DL103 on my old Russian(?) copy of Tony's mic and it's surprising what you can do simply holding the cartridge by hand and being VERY slow with your movements whilst resting your hand on the focusing stage.
50 x magnification in my case.
High intensity illumination accurately directed seems to be the key. Oh for 3 hands!
Craig B
Re:trophile
Another way of viewing ones tip for wear is to lay the cartridge on its back and focus on the light reflecting from the flat spots either side of the tip. As the tip is the highest point, it is quite easy to focus even using the highest magnification of a conventional microscope. This visual is much more relatable than trying to observe the flats from front on as straight lines along the slope of the overall tip shape. IOWs, the flats have both length and width, each of which increases with continued wear, and they approach one another toward the tip over time. This is all the more relatable should one have had the opportunity to observe the tip before putting it to use.
With Microridge type tips the flats are long and rectangular, growing in both length (vertically) and width (horizontally) with wear; eventually the ridge wears away completely and they become very broad flats (the onset of this will be quite audible). With elliptical tips the flats are also elliptical and grow in both length and width at different rates, a lovely .2 x .7mil will rapidly become a .3 x .8 mil and eventually something approaching a .4 x .9mil before starting to sound off. If used for long enough the minor radii will catch up to the major one and an elliptical will become the equivalent of a well worn spherical (and quite audibly so). With spherical tips the flats are more or less round, if slightly elliptical, and, as expected, grow in diameter.
Shure VN5MR Microridge tip, unused vs. worn:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkeFH630HNzGgdQUmolEtFPmqb1QhQ
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkeFH630HNzGgdQV9TcOP3CGaB4oaQ
With Microridge type tips the flats are long and rectangular, growing in both length (vertically) and width (horizontally) with wear; eventually the ridge wears away completely and they become very broad flats (the onset of this will be quite audible). With elliptical tips the flats are also elliptical and grow in both length and width at different rates, a lovely .2 x .7mil will rapidly become a .3 x .8 mil and eventually something approaching a .4 x .9mil before starting to sound off. If used for long enough the minor radii will catch up to the major one and an elliptical will become the equivalent of a well worn spherical (and quite audibly so). With spherical tips the flats are more or less round, if slightly elliptical, and, as expected, grow in diameter.
Shure VN5MR Microridge tip, unused vs. worn:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkeFH630HNzGgdQUmolEtFPmqb1QhQ
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkeFH630HNzGgdQV9TcOP3CGaB4oaQ
That's just what I did with an Entre 1 I just got from eBay. It looks like it was retipped quite recently. Raising/lowering the focusing stage brings the full length of the contact patch progressively into focus
It took me quite a while to figure out what I was seeing, my wife said "how can it take so long to look at something so small" !
A stereo mic must be nice!
It took me quite a while to figure out what I was seeing, my wife said "how can it take so long to look at something so small" !
A stereo mic must be nice!
Tony L
Administrator
Just as a giggle I tried the iPhone camera trick with both my Belomo loupes:
10x
20x
After doing this the penny dropped as to why all these pictures are such a pale shadow of actually looking through the loupe or the microscope myself: the iPhone has a wide-angle lens! I post these pics here as much as anything to prove it is possible to get something, anything, however poor, but they all need to be viewed from the perspective that the iPhone is actually losing/negating a heck of lot of magnification. Human vision is usually thought to be around 50mm or so in camera lens terms, 35mm is wide angle, 24mm is very wide, so the iPhone's 29mm equivalent camera is absolutely the wrong tool for this particular job!
In reality the 10x looks much more close/powerful than the 20x pics here, and the Olympus microscope is just amazing! I honestly can't recommend the Belomo 10x highly enough, it is very good and very easy to use.
10x
20x
After doing this the penny dropped as to why all these pictures are such a pale shadow of actually looking through the loupe or the microscope myself: the iPhone has a wide-angle lens! I post these pics here as much as anything to prove it is possible to get something, anything, however poor, but they all need to be viewed from the perspective that the iPhone is actually losing/negating a heck of lot of magnification. Human vision is usually thought to be around 50mm or so in camera lens terms, 35mm is wide angle, 24mm is very wide, so the iPhone's 29mm equivalent camera is absolutely the wrong tool for this particular job!
In reality the 10x looks much more close/powerful than the 20x pics here, and the Olympus microscope is just amazing! I honestly can't recommend the Belomo 10x highly enough, it is very good and very easy to use.
Spike
pfm Member
“The objectives fitted are labelled 4/0.10, 10/0.25, 40/0.65 and 100/1.30. The eyepiece is a WF40X”
Regarding the microscope, that’s a great price for an Olympus.
Magnification is easy. It’s eye piece multiplied by the objective lens, so you have x160, 400, 1600 and 4000! Ideally your eyepiece should only be suitable for the first two. It is a wide field eyepiece which is good.
400x magnification is the limit of a light microscope and would be a normally achieved using a x10 eyepiece and x40 objective lens. Any greater magnification is possible using oil immersion, tiny drop of optical oil between objective lens and slide. Very messy. After x400 a light microscope struggles. This is the limit of the resolution.
I’d look out for a x10 eye piece. This will allow most of the objective lenses to be used.
Did you take the eyepiece out to photograph. It would be possible to use the x100 without it for a good pic. Will take patience.
Regarding the microscope, that’s a great price for an Olympus.
Magnification is easy. It’s eye piece multiplied by the objective lens, so you have x160, 400, 1600 and 4000! Ideally your eyepiece should only be suitable for the first two. It is a wide field eyepiece which is good.
400x magnification is the limit of a light microscope and would be a normally achieved using a x10 eyepiece and x40 objective lens. Any greater magnification is possible using oil immersion, tiny drop of optical oil between objective lens and slide. Very messy. After x400 a light microscope struggles. This is the limit of the resolution.
I’d look out for a x10 eye piece. This will allow most of the objective lenses to be used.
Did you take the eyepiece out to photograph. It would be possible to use the x100 without it for a good pic. Will take patience.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Gosh but you could eat your dinner off that cantilever Tony ! Most impressive pic's, regardless of the fact that they only represent a watered down version of using direct vision. I gather, from my attempts to get a wide-angle digital compact some years ago, that digital and analogue numbers don't represent the same thing. The widest I could get (and, I am told, still is) a 24mm. I wanted to get something close to my 21mm Zuiko.
Had a look on Ebay and Amazon this morning. Amazon want over £50 for the Belomo 10X and Ebay only have the American offering. Could have sworn that there was better U.K. choice way back last year. With my cart's generally on fixed head-shells (therefore hand-held inspection), I think the 10X would better my current Heath Robinson jobbies; and then some.
Had a look on Ebay and Amazon this morning. Amazon want over £50 for the Belomo 10X and Ebay only have the American offering. Could have sworn that there was better U.K. choice way back last year. With my cart's generally on fixed head-shells (therefore hand-held inspection), I think the 10X would better my current Heath Robinson jobbies; and then some.
Tony L
Administrator
As I later admitted upthread the eyepiece actually is a 10X, I don’t quite know how I misread it or confused the numbers in my mind, but by the time I realised the error it was too late to redraft/repost as others had responded! I’m really happy with the two weakest objectives in conjunction with this WF10X eyepiece, it gets noticeably closer than either of the loupes, but is still feasible for stylus inspection etc.
I guess I should find some prepared slides to have a look at too, maybe some plants...
The M95ED was installed on a Technics SL-120/SME3009 I found at the local auction house a couple of years ago for IIRC £30! It looks to be in really nice condition (as is the rest of the deck/arm). I can’t see any wear and I’ve tried it in my TD-124/3009 and it is actually a rather nice cart, so I keep it as a spare (I must think about cashing the SL-120 in at some point as it is just gathering dust at present!).
The 29mm I googled up for the iPhone 6s is its 35mm equivalent value, i.e. it presents the same field of view I’d get mounting a 29mm lens on my ancient Nikkormat FTn film camera. The actual iPhone focal length is 4.15mm! It is f2.2.
Seanm
pfm Member
I got the Belomo 10x and even with everything in situ it's very handy for checking whether the stylus needs a clean.
But the most useful application I've found for it so far is checking whether or not the white specks I find in my children's hair are nits or not. I've tried magnifying glasses before but they're no real use. This really leaves no room for doubt.
If I'd thought about it last night I'd have tried Tony's camera phone trick.
But the most useful application I've found for it so far is checking whether or not the white specks I find in my children's hair are nits or not. I've tried magnifying glasses before but they're no real use. This really leaves no room for doubt.
If I'd thought about it last night I'd have tried Tony's camera phone trick.
Nic Robinson
Moderator
So are they nits?
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Apart from the nitty-gritty, Sean, is the 10X sufficient to safely inspect a stylus/cantilever and provide clear outlines as in Tony's camera pic. of the Shure above?
As I only have fixed head-shell arms, I'm keen to get the right one. My current lash-up lets me see if there's fluff or whatever on the stylus.
Tony L
Administrator
This is a potential issue unless you are prepared to pop the arm off now and again. Loupes always give their best hard against your eye socket with the subject a cm or two in front of the lens. This is fine for me as I use a vintage SME with a detachable shell.
I noticed there are improbably cheap Chinese “microscopes” for iPhone etc, e.g. this one. I’m prepared to guarantee that it isn’t “60x”, but for three quid I’ll buy one just to review here. If there is a more upmarket variant it might be an option as you obviously don’t need to get your eye hard up to the thing. I love the Belomo and my vintage Olympus microscope as the optics are clearly really high quality and make inspection a pleasure, but I realise it will be hard to deal with on fixed shell decks unless the arm comes off easy (e.g. Ittok etc).
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Seanm
pfm Member
Mine's fixed too, and yes I find you can get close enough safely to get a good look - but only to assess cleanliness, probably not wear: I think you'd probably need the flexibility to go in from different angles. Not that I'd know what I was looking for anyway.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Think I might be in the same boat there !
Tony L
Administrator
I got the three quid iPhone “microscope” I link to in post #57. I’m astonished anyone can make, let alone ship anything to me for under £3, let alone a lens with an LED light, batteries, clip and even a cloth carrying pouch, but here it is!
I’d describe it as fun rather than useful. Here’s the best shot I can mange of the Shure M95ED:
That is full-frame out of my iPhone 6S (set to ‘square’). Lots of vignetting/wasted sensor area and as predicted nothing like a ‘60x’ magnification. The pic was taken in natural daylight rather than with the built-in LED which seems to blow highlights in this context. The real issue and why I suspect this is all but useless for stylus inspection is you have to get it really close to the subject, pretty much hard against it, i.e. I kept pushing the cartridge away trying to get it in focus. No real chance of using it on a cart in an non-detachable headshell arm. Definitely worth three quid, but my recommendation remains for the Belomo loupe.
PS The ‘basket case’ 1960s Olympus K microscope I mentioned somewhere upthread turned up and I was able to swap out/harvest the couple of minor pieces I needed to fully restore mine to the condition I wanted. I’m now left with a spare rather tatty and grubby example that has a cosmetically dinged pentaprism housing (prism is intact albeit dusty). It is missing an eyepiece and mirror (not that you need the mirror, LED bike lights etc are better for most uses) but has a full set of four Olympus objectives, optical condenser etc and would actually work perfectly after a good cleaning and finding a new WF10X eyepiece (regularly available on eBay). I’d let it go for £20 plus postage if anyone fancies it as a project (the objectives are worth way more than that!). This one could certainly be made to work perfectly.
I’d describe it as fun rather than useful. Here’s the best shot I can mange of the Shure M95ED:
That is full-frame out of my iPhone 6S (set to ‘square’). Lots of vignetting/wasted sensor area and as predicted nothing like a ‘60x’ magnification. The pic was taken in natural daylight rather than with the built-in LED which seems to blow highlights in this context. The real issue and why I suspect this is all but useless for stylus inspection is you have to get it really close to the subject, pretty much hard against it, i.e. I kept pushing the cartridge away trying to get it in focus. No real chance of using it on a cart in an non-detachable headshell arm. Definitely worth three quid, but my recommendation remains for the Belomo loupe.
PS The ‘basket case’ 1960s Olympus K microscope I mentioned somewhere upthread turned up and I was able to swap out/harvest the couple of minor pieces I needed to fully restore mine to the condition I wanted. I’m now left with a spare rather tatty and grubby example that has a cosmetically dinged pentaprism housing (prism is intact albeit dusty). It is missing an eyepiece and mirror (not that you need the mirror, LED bike lights etc are better for most uses) but has a full set of four Olympus objectives, optical condenser etc and would actually work perfectly after a good cleaning and finding a new WF10X eyepiece (regularly available on eBay). I’d let it go for £20 plus postage if anyone fancies it as a project (the objectives are worth way more than that!). This one could certainly be made to work perfectly.