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How do the 'non-subjectivists' choose their hi-fi systems?

From reading the usual suspects on this forum I think the answer to the OP's question is that "nothing matters". Adequate is good enough. I call it the audio nihilist syndrome.

Mains cables, i/c' and speaker cables all sound the same and are irrelevant.
Streamers - any old tat you can knock-up is fully the equal of a purpose built high-end streamer
DAC's - something cheap will do as anything expensive is a con and the marginal benefits are minimal.
Amplifiers - Any competently designed / adequate amplifier is good enough to drive a well designed benign load, and pre-amplifiers, jeez, don't even go there.

It seems all we have left is the speaker and its room interaction (clearly important).

Speakers apart, I disagree with all of the above , but that's just me.

Ive heard a lot of very expensive systems (and lots of cheaper ones too) and the expensively put together high-end system ALWAYS did things that the cheaper ones couldn't do. Scale, density of sound, staging, detail and impact. Many of them were not to my taste.

As an example, I recently bought my end-game speakers and after a couple of months bought the manufacturer recommend i/c's and speaker cables. The difference between them and my well-regarded existing cables was "not subtle".
 
Pete L said:
So, all you engineering minded folk, how do you choose your equipment? Do you believe all equipment sounds the same and do you choose it using some criteria other than sound? Or do you carry out measurements using oscilloscopes etc. to make your choices?
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How people choose equipment will depend on their objectives which will vary from engineering minded folk to engineering minded folk. For example, minimum cost not to intrude on the enjoyment of music, easy to use, not aesthetically offensive is likely to be roughly the criteria for most engineering folk. The few that are interested in a higher sound quality are likely to have differing reasons for being prepared to spend more.

In my case I have a hobby interest in how to achieve a high technical sound quality in the home which means I am prepared to spend a bit more to support one of my hobbies. Nonetheless value for money in terms of what is provided in terms of audible technical performance is an important aspect. Paying more for the same level of audible performance (excepting one or two other things like reliability) is avoided wherever practical.

Most competent electronics have levels of linear and nonlinear distortion below the level of audibility (in the identifying blind from sound alone sense). There is a problem though in that a significant proportion of the products aggressively built down to a price are not audibly neutral (as can be boutique audiophile stuff but I ignore that) and often don't deliver the performance implied in their skimpy spec. The absence of competence and to some degree integrity in the home audio press means there is no easy and reliable way to separate the competent from the incompetent. To address this without wasting time evaluating products I view as commodities I have tended to opt for second hand mid-to-top of the range products from larger established manufacturers with modest audiophile cred but significant engineering teams. Hasn't always been successful with some of the second hand products failing shortly after purchase but I have had no noticeable issues with non-neutral sound. I tend to buy new pro-DACs because I use the microphone inputs as well digital inputs.

I have my collection of records from the 70s and a turntable plus backup and spares which I keep for when the odd record comes my way. Records I like are digitised and listened to across the home network. Cartridge replacements have been something of a lottery over the decades but listening to records is a distant secondary way of listening to music these days. It is funded accordingly.

What dominates sound quality in the home are the speakers and their interaction with the room. I design and build my own speakers to meet technical objectives which evolve as I learn more. I also attend shows and occasionally listen in shops to gain some appreciation of what people consider attractive.
 
Some prioritise the music over systems and measurements. Whether the system is cheap or expensive, measures well or doesn’t measure well or satisfies your love or penchant for DIY or more esoteric machines has no bearing if the system communicates the music you love in a way you are happy with.thats surely the aim.
 
l myself follow strict Audiophile Protocol- and buy blind:)- touch wood the last few purchases have worked out rather well.:)
 
Everyone knows that graphs don’t lie so - yes, but some do it so much better than others...
 
For me it’s easy. I go to a concert of acoustic music. I go home. If the music at home sounds like the live event, then fine. If it doesn’t, time to change something. The only test is whether the hifi sounds like real music, and not like some smoothed down and sweetened studio processed effusion.
 
Colin L said:
Mains cables, i/c' and speaker cables all sound the same and are irrelevant.
Streamers - any old tat you can knock-up is fully the equal of a purpose built high-end streamer
DAC's - something cheap will do as anything expensive is a con and the marginal benefits are minimal.
Amplifiers - Any competently designed / adequate amplifier is good enough to drive a well designed benign load, and pre-amplifiers, jeez, don't even go there.
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This does seem to sum up the attitude of the self-build engineering fraternity rather well. I disagree with it vehemently because my ears tell me a very different story. I suppose that's really why I never got into building my own kit - because I knew that whatever I knocked up wouldn't be a patch on a professionally designed and engineered product.

Pete
 
I think having a thoughtfully put together system is one part of the satisfaction process.Price, apparent reputation and aesthetics do fade into the background as so many other variables come into play;The time of day, your general mood, the room, the choice of music and its production pedigree, the ambient noise etc etc.
Sometimes when I’m in the right place and these variables come together and harmonise I’d swear I was listening to the best system that was ever made.Sometimes I scratch my head in frustration and irritation and sometimes I turn it off and walk away. Ultimately it’s the ability of your system to communicate well the music you love most of the time that really counts.
 
I am by nature and education an objectivist in most things because I know it's the only sensible way. However, I'm also something of a hypocrite. I buy all my hi-fi kit on reputation, appearance, and sound, and almost always second hand. I've never actually bought any hi-fi based on spec alone.
 
I always try to hear the Hi Fi I´m buying. Is not so difficult, just go to a shop and listen for yourself with yours cd´s. But first I decide on a budget,and then try to buy the better product!
 
nbaptista said:
I always try to hear the Hi Fi I´m buying. Is not so difficult, just go to a shop and listen for yourself with yours cd´s. But first I decide on a budget,and then try to buy the better product!
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I am interested in a very short list of two power amplifiers to replace the one I just sold. One is a pair of Icon Audio MB90/II monoblocks. Their facility/listening room is in Leicester. The other is a small manufacture in Hertfordshire. As far as I can tell, there are no other places to hear either, and I live in Plymouth. Also my speakers are Quad 2805s, which have particular requirements in amplifiers.
So not quite so easy.
 
Pete L said:
This does seem to sum up the attitude of the self-build engineering fraternity rather well. I disagree with it vehemently because my ears tell me a very different story. I suppose that's really why I never got into building my own kit - because I knew that whatever I knocked up wouldn't be a patch on a professionally designed and engineered product.

Pete
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Have you not got 5G masts to burn down?
 
I wonder whether this coronavirus lockdown experience will change anything? Mail-order has become the default method of purchase for now, because needs must, but it's a bit soulless and unsatisfying. Consumerism, without joy.

Perhaps, just perhaps, after a few months of enforced isolation, people will appreciate the personal touch of face to face contact and simple personal service. That's the thing a dealer can offer than can't be replicated by the online experience. That, and the audition, which I find much preferable to the 'buy, try, and return it if you don't like it' online option. After all, the audition can compare other alternatives, or offer a third-party perspective, that I find very interesting. And much more social.

Here's hoping...
 
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