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Housing market

just had a tenant ring me today as they are moving out , they pay 750 for a fairly big 3 bed house [ well below market rent ] moving to a rented house nearby at slightly under double that for 3-4 near better schools . now got to decide whether to sell up and pay massive CGT !! enough to but a brand new VW polo !! or keep it and continue to rent . bit of a shock really just before christmas !!!
 
There’s no point in bringing housing to the market if prospective buyers can’t afford it!
The only way existing property will depreciate sufficiently to be 'affordable' is in a housing recession as of old. New-builds have fixed or increasing costs. Unfortunately, the situation required for this property price depreciation is complete mayhem, both financially and socially. As was the practice in the sixties, councils should re-evaluate building relatively cheap flats/maisonettes on 3 or 4 storey blocks of, say 20 and selling the leases. However, they also need them for social housing, so catch 22, it appears.

My fairly spacious 3 bed maisonette with garden and courtyard on decently long lease would at least double in price if it were even a semi-detached (as it's E/S/W/ facing end block, it is in effect semi-detached !) Crazy !

being a landlord at 83 !!
To be fair, Phil, most of this and other landlordships (!!!???) was before I was 83. :D
 
just had a tenant ring me today as they are moving out , they pay 750 for a fairly big 3 bed house [ well below market rent ] moving to a rented house nearby at slightly under double that for 3-4 near better schools . now got to decide whether to sell up and pay massive CGT !! enough to but a brand new VW polo !! or keep it and continue to rent . bit of a shock really just before christmas !!!
What a bummer! Not the best season to sell and I'd imagine a £3K CGT allowance carrying on beyond April. Surely best practice is to re-let quickly at a small rent premium to mitigate void costs and retain your equity in property. It's a temptation to get out with potential legislation foreboding but maybe not sufficient grounds to do so. Besides, At £85K FSA covered savings, you'll have a bit of work to spread the proceeds AND pay tax on those. Life used to be so simple !
 
Wack the rent up to the max and watch the legislation like a hawk, only take ultra-safe tenants, think that you may be tied to them for years, make sure you‘re s21 compliant in case you need to jump ship before RR comes into force, in London the demand is really hot now, even in the lead up to Xmas - I’ve got one coming available on Jan 1. Apparently there is a real shortage here. I feel real positive about it all at the moment - I’ve spent all day planning the refurbishment when the tenant leaves, and talking to the photographer about the ad on the wonderful Openrent.
 
Indeed. My father sold his parents' property out of probate in 1996 for a measly 60k, now worth 340k ish. My brother and I opposed the sale but it wasn't our call. He didn't need the money but didn't want the bother. Crazy decision as we'd now have both the property and over 25 years' rent.
Wow.
We?
self entitled or what?
 
That's top class "wise after the event " financial planning. These "unsustainably low" interest rates lasted for 20 years plus. If you had taken out a mortgage in 2000 the most profitable route was to borrow as much as you possibly could on a house or houses and pay it over 25 years, instead of borrowing less and getting it done in half the time.

Yes. Many people assumed that. We didn't, however. We bought a house on the basis that it was of a size, etc, that was "OK for us". Then when rates fell we went on paying the original amount per month. Thus lowering the outstanding amount. Result was that we paid off the mortgage *years* before the inevitable.

It was obvious for decades that low - and dropping - interest rates couldn't last forever. Particularly given the combination of Tory Governments who forced social housing to be sold off cheap *and* prevented Councils from replacing it. Add in a building sector that is dominated by big firms that "only build for a 20% or more profit" and brown stuff eventually becoming co-incident with rotating items was clearly on the horizon. Alas, people fell for neo-liberalism... and weirdly, still do!
 
There is always an element of luck involved. Anyone who says they can time the market is talking nonsense

Agreed. But given a many-decades timescale and the interactions involved it was clear enough *what* would happen 'if this goes on' and plan accordingly. The problem was that people were bamboozled by the flim-flam the wizards deploy to mislead the marks.

Knowing "this can't go on forever" and acting accordingly is different from "knowing exactly when". Given decades as a time scale allows room to use this difference if you know.
 
Fortunately, I didn't want 'millions'. :) However my point is that it was pretty obvious that it *would* happen. Since I didn't know when, I let the changes in rate (as it dropped) and prices (rose) happened. Rather than cut my payments/month i kept them where the were - and thus either paid up early or would have been ready if they went up again. Thing is that we didn't buy assuming we'd keep 'moving up to something better', etc. We just stayed and thus paid up early. No "insider knowledge" just long term thinking.

The problem which I think clouded the view of many was to regard a home primarily as an 'asset'. The standard idea back then was people would keep 'moving up' though a series of ever bigger houses, etc. For some who timed that right, it worked. But for others, the music stopped at the wrong time. For us, a house was a place to live, not an asset.

The problem now is the lack of social housing and the grip of the big housebuilders on the supply. Hence we get gerrybuilt houses, and not enough of them in order to give the housebuilders the levels of profit they want. Government conspires with this. Leading to 'features' like flammable cladding, huge 'snags' rates on new builds, RAAC, etc, etc.
 
Hopefully not too much Raac being built now . I always recall the time i bought a barret house which are normally ok , however the kitchen wall was not attached to the floor so it moved . I had to take all the plaster off and screw the bottom wood piece to the concrete floor . they also used plywood for floorboards which is a total ball ache !!! and to cap it all that plastic pipe for central heating all the way through !!
 
In part this is down to the sheer greed + power of the big housebuilders. But also in part due to Governments who trashed the UK's system for apprenticeships and FE Colleges. Not just the Tories this time. Also the delusions of Blair, leading to FE being pushed into becoming 'me too' Universities. Class distinction that somehow 'Trades' were less important than 'Graduates'.

Hence also why I am having one visit after another to sort out our immersion heater.
 
The problem which I think clouded the view of many was to regard a home primarily as an 'asset'.
Not at all sure that's true of many first/second time buyers for their own habitation. For BTL purchasers, this may have been an element (although not with me, despite it turning out as such).. It has only been the market/financial situations and gov't interference which have accelerated the rising asset syndrome. If you bought now, would you place a large bet on a guaranteed appreciating asset ? In the past, many have suffered depreciating housing assets (booms and busts). However, bricks and mortar are, and always will be in this country at least, an asset because it meets two important criteria; habitation and collateral. One of those is enough but to get both, as most have, is the icing.
 
Yes, owning a home (as distinct from 'owning a mortgage') is an asset. This is then sometimes offset by the debt committment tied to it.

In essence the rise in prices was driven by a created limitation of supply. Partly via the big housebuilders working to max their prodfits, not the number of homes. Partly by government arranging for social housing to evaporate.

We're still not building sufficient social housing. Nor are the builders building enough for the demand. So you get the classic case of an 'essential' product rising in price again because of the engineered scarcity.

FWIW many people over many years said to us we should 'trade up' to buy ever bigger p;aces if we could. The (encouraged by the builders and politicians) was that home ownership was a rising asset, so 'get in now' and maximise your 'return'.
 
Partly by government arranging for social housing to evaporate.

We're still not building sufficient social housing.
Agreed, of course, but to me, social housing is not available for purchase by the general public (unless a tenant), so a dearth of this doesn't really impact upon ordinary housing available to buy, which also has been inadequate for a long time.

With rentals, the situation changes, as more social housing means more renting opportunities. Some of the current situation has been exacerbated by gradually changing societal norms and the increase in our population. Given all these accommodation headwinds, it seems unlikely that (a) we'll have a price crash and (b) there will ever be sufficient housing for the demand.
 
just had a tenant ring me today as they are moving out , they pay 750 for a fairly big 3 bed house [ well below market rent ] moving to a rented house nearby at slightly under double that for 3-4 near better schools . now got to decide whether to sell up and pay massive CGT !! enough to but a brand new VW polo !! or keep it and continue to rent . bit of a shock really just before christmas !!!

Not great news considering the time of year but demand is still there. Considering the current sales market, I'd go for a re-let at a reasonably higher rent.
 
Agreed, of course, but to me, social housing is not available for purchase by the general public (unless a tenant), so a dearth of this doesn't really impact upon ordinary housing available to buy, which also has been inadequate for a long time.

It does have a general impact. The point is that adequate levels of social housing 'competes' against the poorer quality private rent. AND it increases the supply overall by preventing house builders from hiking price to their preferred profit level. Instead they have to genuinely compete against the social building which in-house Council building used to provide.

As things are rhe supply of social housing is still lower than the need (in terms of analysed incomes, etc). i.e. We still have a situation where the number of new cases of people who need social housing is bigger than the number of new builds for social housing purposes.

The problem is that the private 'market' in house building is rigged to generate a chosen profit level with minimum production and the use of 'land banking'. They can buy up land and prevent smaller scale builders from having that. Plus use their own economies of scale (and ability to manipulate planning) to out-compete smaller builders.
 
I occasionally check Zoopla values out of curiosity. One of mine is saying +4% this month. I personally don’t believe it but there must be some data points driving these numbers?
 


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