Garrard 401/SME3009

[Arkless Electronics]

yer can all keep yer 401's, 301's and ALL idler drives (even Thorens and EMT) as I wouldn't give them houseroom. All come under the same heading as washing machines on spin cycle and rotavators
Roksan Xerxes is probably my fave TT of all time with Logic DM101 a little bit behind it.
Build quality is of little importance so long as something does the job... (yeah yeah I don't want to know about the bits that fell off your Xerxes etc)

 

[wylton]

yer can all keep yer 401's, 301's and ALL idler drives...

OK Jez, I get the message; does that mean you're not interested in my slate bed Lenco 88 / Zeta then?

 

[Arkless Electronics]

OK Jez, I get the message; does that mean you're not interested in my slate bed Lenco 88 / Zeta then?

What a waste of a lovely arm...

I have a good condition GL75 actually... it could make a decent record cleaning machine some day

 

[Beobloke]

Room for all opinion in the world of hi fi... even if you're both wrong
I've turned down FREE 401's several times... that's what I reckon of them... rumble from the jumble.. sale...
And I rate the Xerxes as in the very highest echelons on sound quality... even if longevity is suspect...

Whilst I agree that the Xerxes is a lovely deck, I thought you were an audio repair specialist?

Stopping a Garrard 301/401 from rumbling isn't exactly rocket science!

 

[Arkless Electronics]

Whilst I agree that the Xerxes is a lovely deck, I thought you were an audio repair specialist?

Stopping a Garrard 301/401 from rumbling isn't exactly rocket science!

Yep yer just trade it in against something that was properly designed in the first place and therefore doesn't have idler drive! When you move up from BSR autochangers and Garrard SP25's you leave idler drive behind!

 

[Tony L]

When you move up from BSR autochangers and Garrard SP25's you leave idler drive behind!

...and then, when you’ve owned all the turntables that Jez bloke raves about (including the crappy one with the saggy bits and exploding PSU), and many more, one buys a properly built idler drive and realises it was the right answer after all!

 

[cctaylor]

It makes me weep when I think that my brother in law put my old 401 and SME into a hole in ground with a heap of rubbish

 

[Woodface]

Is a fully sorted 401 better than a 301?

 

[Weekender]

Is a fully sorted 401 better than a 301?

Undecided.
There is a line that a 301 with a 401 motor is the one.
https://positive-feedback.com/Issue79/garrard.htm

 

[Tony L]

There will almost certainly be more difference in condition between two examples than between model! The 401 really is a 301 with a ‘60s modern’ look, the actual construction is remarkably similar, just a couple of very minor changes here and there. Also bear in mind that each model had revisions over its lifespan, and the very last 401s were not especially good having suffered from cost-cutting, worn tools, and a 1970s union work ethic to some degree!

 

[scotty38]

Is a fully sorted 401 better than a 301?

Who cares, the 301 is a thing of beauty so that wins....

 

[divedeepdog]

Is a fully sorted 401 better than a 301?

401 is more refined, better information retrieval device, my (Grey/grease) 301 has more PRAT and more of that unmeasurable quality of emotion.

There are things I've done to calm the PRAT down/increase refinement (Variac/SPH bearing) as the gap to my Sony TTS was quite wide.

The Sony is better in every measurable way, except between the ears

 

[Woodface]

I would like to try a 301 one day but they are quite bulky. To be honest I am far less interested in equipemt than I used to be; my system is pretty good so pointless sweating over every detail

 

[wylton]

Is a fully sorted 401 better than a 301?

Terry O'Sullivan, Loricraft, who used to service the 301's and 401's always said that the 401 was better.

 

[Woodface]

Terry O'Sullivan, Loricraft, who used to service the 301's and 401's always said that the 401 was better.

Interesting. SME have certainly upped the ante with the 'new' 301.

 

[Weekender]

Interesting. SME have certainly upped the ante with the 'new' 301.

By ante I presume you mean price!
https://www.stereophile.com/content/listening-204-new-garrard-301

 

[Woodface]

By ante I presume you mean price!
https://www.stereophile.com/content/listening-204-new-garrard-301

Yes

 

[wylton]

Does this mean that SME are not going to produce a new 401?

 

[Tony L]

Does this mean that SME are not going to produce a new 401?

I very much doubt it. I can’t see them selling that many of the 301s at the price given just how well made and reliable the original is. I just don’t see a reason to spend that much on one given you could rebuild/refurbish an original to the same level for a fraction of the price.

As far as I can tell the 301 sent to Stereophile for review actually is a Garrard 301, i.e. the SME 301 is vapourware at this point. They are planning to put it back into production, but the review sample is just a SME-refurbished 301 built from original Garrard parts acquired from Loricraft. It will be interesting to see what comes next...

 

[wylton]

I very much doubt it. I can’t see them selling that many of the 301s at the price given just how well made and reliable the original is. I just don’t see a reason to spend that much on one given you could rebuild/refurbish an original to the same level for a fraction of the price.

Yes, that's exactly what I was thinking. Interesting to note too, that on the SME/Garrard site, they say they will service old units too, though at heaven knows what price!

...the SME 301 is vapourware at this point.

Yes, I suspected as much. Don't get me wrong, it's great to see an old British marque revived in the spirit of Terry O' Sullivan's Loricraft, but it remains to be seen how successful it is.