errrrrrrrrr

[enjoy_the_music]

This thread is a .lol.

The EMT 927 comes in many variants, in good condition and with its original tube 139 phono stage it can outplay more or less any of the modern turntables...we had it as a dead heat between that and the Rockport Sirius II.

Some dealers and manufacturers just don't get it even now and valiantly try to massage public opinion into buying the latest and greatest, whatever upgrade, that there is a 'sound' difference lol, because the situation IS desperate on the high street at the moment and dealers MUST keep the churn going.....however the mentality of many buyers in the marketplace has changed, that newer isn't necessarily better...when that generational change occurs you just can't stop it.

The rush back to quality is on and we crossed that little rubicon back in 2001 as gold and silver started to 'rise'...and as regards prices paid, you ain't seen nothing yet.

Unrelated, for some people it is not about the pure performance. Take a certain amount of the well known trophyist mentality of audio buyers and mix it with a hint of sentimentalism...add a little bit of free revenue and you have what it takes to drive prices in some older equipment. Just see some of the tables at the recent European Trioded Festival, many tricked out historic Lenco and Commonwealth turntables...JC Morrison doing a talk for Silbatone, one of the current industry leaders.

Admittadley there is also a rubicon which is crossed between utility and antiquity. This fuzzy line is where people should buy things at the lowest cost for the future. Some of the EMT turntables wouldnt be my choice (950 I found not to my taste in a TAD speaker system) and I would opt for a tricked out Technics SP-10mk3 (I've had 6 of them), Voyd Reference or Pioneer P3 for a complete system...among others...the top SME tables are also quite reasonable.

The LP12 is a well proven design with easy to replace parts, easy to renovate and should survive a while. It has it's place in the market but cannot touch a fully greased up 927. For LP12 lovers why not find a minty early version of this turntable, this would be the time to do it.

 

[jcbrum]

Hmmmm, as far as new equipment goes, in the 'audiophile' retail pricing world, I think there is often little correlation between between manufacturing cost, and retail price, and value for money.

Cables are a typical example. But there are many others.

In the second-hand market, scarcity and perceived value are the overriding factors. Whether that perception is misplaced or not is another argument. It certainly changes markedly over seemingly short periods of time.

One moment you can find good stuff in a skip, the next it's on ebay for £10,000.

JC

 

[Cereal Killer]

Spacey, you make a big deal about listening to your active 50s, without prejudice, I would suggest that you do the same for the EMT which I assume you have never heard?whilst the 927 is big money the 930st and other derivatives are superb as was the 950, recently, at Waltham Abbey which, comfortably, stole the show.

Unlike the EMT, my 50's are brand new and current, they represent excellent VFM, as you know they have six drivers, six amps and six active x-overs built into two highly over engineered cabinates. and have a 6 year warranty. ( thats a lot of 6's ) and as you know if you look hard enough you can buy an ex-dem pair for as low as £7-8K. In the bigger picture this is pocket change in comparison to £15K for a knackered/worn out 50's broadcast deck.

FYI, I've re-built and restored many TT's decades ago and have owned many different types by many different manufacturers (I've even built my own from my parts bin, which is still going BTW) , right from mono players from the 30's, to Transcriptors of the 80's - Thanks for asking

I can assure you over engineering in the 50's was only done for a few reasons, one of them being they were guessing at what was the best.

Sorry but this idea of these decks being the holy grail of TT doesn't wash with me, they're just a nice piece of history.

 

[sq225917]

I genuinely don't know how the EMT sounds, I wouldn't want to use Lindsays as a reference for anything. I'm sure they can be made to sound great. But £15k for one that is so badly conditioned as to be almost junk, well that's a piss take, you'd have to be an EMT 'collector' to love that one simply because the cost of renovation and purchase opens up entirely different options where sound quality will be matched of superseded and looks firmly bettered. They are priced as collector items for people with large disposable bank balances who are into such things, not as an item of hifi.

I'd happily take a Bardo and a 10.5 arm over any EMT in any condition, but that's my personal preference for a small, high mass, none suspended deck over parts recovered from a tractor that appear to have been aged in a cardboard box in the back of a wet shed.

 

[jcbrum]

Unlike the EMT, my 50's are brand new and current, they represent excellent VFM,

Well they're useless for playing records, so they're not very relevant .......

I can assure you over engineering in the 50's was only done for a few reasons, one of them being they were guessing at what was the best.

I don't attach any credibility to your assurance. I think EMT knew what they were doing.

JC

 

[Patrick Dixon]

On what basis do you think the EMT is built to last forever and the LP12, 'cos that's what you mean, is not built to the same standard?

On the basis that an EMT927 was built to run all day in a TV studio, and downtime had to be minimal - if at all. I had a top spec (at the time - pre Keel) LP12 and there's absolutely no way the LP12 was made with anything like the same complexity and longevity - although I did love the LP12.

I bet there are more LP12s surviving, pro rata, than EMTs.

I bet that most of them aren't in the same spec that they were originally, and have had one or more of, new PSUs, new hinges, new motors, new bearings, new armboards, new subchassis, new springs, new plinths etc, etc

 

[bob atherton]

..... over parts recovered from a tractor that appear to have been aged in a cardboard box in the back of a wet shed.

I must admit to the casual observer (me) with no axe to grind, this is how it looks....

 

[Patrick Dixon]

you failed to answer my question ..would you pay the asking price for the EMT as shown by the OP. If not what would you pay.

Jon, I didn't answer because it's just not relevant: market price is not set by what I want or would (or could afford to) pay for it, it's set by what something's worth in the marketplace.

 

[Patrick Dixon]

I must admit to the casual observer (me) with no axe to grind, this is how it looks....

Here's a photo of a restored one (with the original Ortofon 16 inch arm). You have to bear in mind that it's not a domestic item and it's designed to sit in a broadcast console, so the chassis would all be out of sight.

 

[Cereal Killer]

Well they're useless for playing records, so they're not very relevant .......

Oh dear, you're even thicker than i first feared.

I don't attach any credibility to your assurance. I think EMT knew what they were doing. JC

Well i suppose your allowed your limited opinions ... you should get out more.

 

[jcbrum]

Having run out of reasoned argument, ...... you resort to insults ........

That seems to be about the limit of your intellect.

JC

 

[Cereal Killer]

Its not an insult, It's just a fact - but you don't understand do you.

 

[flatpopely]

@ Patrick Dixon.

The EMT and LP12 are designed for different applications, as you point out, but I still believe that the LP12 is built as well, within a domestic environment.

I ran mine from '96 to 2006 probably 10 hours a week and it had no mods up to that point. It was still as fresh as the day it left the factory.

The one thing that is missing from this is that IMHO, good though the EMT is, it just does not sound as good as an LP12, among others, in a domestic environment. Plus you have to factor in the total lack of domestic acceptance for most people and that spares cost a fortune. To get one fully restored, just how much would that be?

 

[jcbrum]

Here's a photo of a restored one (with the original Ortofon 16 inch arm). You have to bear in mind that it's not a domestic item and it's designed to sit in a broadcast console, so the chassis would all be out of sight.

It is to my eyes a thing of beauty, ... certainly far in excess of an LP12 for example.

If I had gone to the trouble of getting one into that condition, I would not feel mere money would be enough to compensate me for having it no longer.

I suppose that kind of thing is what attaches value in the market place.

JC

 

[__mark__]

I can't find any indication on eBay of previous auctions ending around £15000, the last EMT was a 930 and it didn't sell at £3500. The seller also has a Quad 34 on at £395 so grab yourself a couple of bargains

 

[jcbrum]

Its not an insult, It's just a fact - but you don't understand do you.

In your dreams, Raj.

 

[flatpopely]

I think this is also a thing of beauty. I like its clean lines:-

 

[Robert]

I think this is also a thing of beauty. I like its clean lines:-

Very nice, but I'd have to have a fluted plinth.
My old LP12 had a wonderful rosewood plinth but they didn't flute those. To me the fluting is pure LP12.

 

[Patrick Dixon]

Yes, but what's it got to do with this thread, Andrew?

 

[flatpopely]

Yes, but what's it got to do with this thread, Andrew?

Er, the LP12 was again being compared to the EMT and its aesthetics.

I think in future I'll leave EMT threads alone as that way danger lies!