A review of 15 high-end speakers on home demo, inc B&W, Boenicke, Magico, ProAc, Sonus Faber& Wilson

[Tony L]

Especially with Boenicke, they are even not good in pair matching.

What magazine is that? It is just dumb beyond comprehension! The W8 is a tiny little floorstander that sits way below ear axis. As such the measurements are even less relevant than usual in that a 1m on axis response bears no resemblance whatsoever to actual intended usage! As is so often the case things are being measured by “experts” without even the slightest understanding of why they are the way they are or the intended usage context. The same logic would apply to these speakers as something like a Klipsch Heresy, i.e. a speaker designed to exist way below ear axis and with some wall reinforcement (ideally corners in the case of the Heresy), so a compensatory treble lift is built in to help them sound balanced despite their small stature. They strike me as a speaker designed with a normal domestic context in mind, which is a sensible way of doing things IMHO.

 

[Colin L]

Very nice. Vitus is good stuff too. I’d been inclined to try the speakers out a bit if poss. I see you have the Townshends under the stand as well. Good man

 

[Robby]

This was John Atkinson's verdict on the results from testing the Croft Integrated:

"Without any circuit board, the three-dimensional, hard-wired layout of the Croft's circuit is a thing of wonder. However, I must admit to being puzzled why Art Dudley liked the sound of the Croft Phono Integrated as much as he did. To me, it seems, at best, inadequately engineered, and at its worst—that nonflat RIAA response, the high levels of harmonic and intermodulation distortion—just plain inadequate."

I think that most who have heard the Croft would agree that it is a superb sounding amplifier.

It would seem that the designer of the Boenicke's voices the speakers by ear which, arguably, is the best measuring tool available. I guess, though, that you either buy into the designers version of the truth or you don't.

 

[kenniGT]

What magazine is that? It is just dumb beyond comprehension! The W8 is a tiny little floorstander that sits way below ear axis. As such the measurements are even less relevant than usual in that a 1m on axis response bears no resemblance whatsoever to actual intended usage! As is so often the case things are being measured by “experts” without even the slightest understanding of why they are the way they are or the intended usage context. The same logic would apply to these speakers as something like a Klipsch Heresy, i.e. a speaker designed to exist way below ear axis and with some wall reinforcement (ideally corners in the case of the Heresy), so a compensatory treble lift is built in to help them sound balanced despite their small stature. They strike me as a speaker designed with a normal domestic context in mind, which is a sensible way of doing things IMHO.

Hifi News.

 

[Old Valve Git]

Here are the W13s. Beauties. Hope the photo works as I have not uploaded one here before.

Look great OP, enjoy! Glad you found something to really float your boat after an extensive search.

 

[MichaelC]

A fantastic write up.

 

[S-Man]

PS, sort those cables out, and nice rug, man

Nice rug, but making the entire floor out of a trampoline is an interesting way of isolating everything

 

[duckworp]

IF you don't mind me asking why go with active bass with such a nice amp?!
And did you try going back to just the SE version?

I went for active bass as the dsp available on the W13 allows for the bass to be tuned down at the frequencies where my room modes lead to a boomy bass (48kHz and 96 kHz). It took me a long while to come around to this as I did not want to by-pass any part of the amp. However I sought the advice of Vitus, and the advice was that as long as the active bass only dealt in frequencies below 120KhZ then the integrity of the Vitus 'sound' from the amp should remain in tact. I also spoke to Hans-Ole Vitus in Munich and he concurred that, assuming I could not treat the room, then a speaker with an active bass may be the best solution. The amp certainly seems to be singing better than ever so I am certain no detrimental affect has occurred, maybe with the amp not on bass duty it can provide more in the mid and tops? I don't know whether technically that is possible. Whatever, it still sounds fabulous.

In answer to your other question I didn't try the SE. Boenicke speakers are all hand-made, and many are made to order, so unless you go pay them a visit in Switzerland I suspect it would be difficult to have the three versions side by side for comparison. Though I am speculating on that. There were no W13s in the UK available for shop or home demo so it would have been impossible to do that kind of comparison over here.

 

[kenniGT]

@duckworp Hz, not kHz

 

[sls4321]

No mention of PMC but I do know why 25.26 harsh mid

Boenicke are similar in shape to PMC Fact. I had the Fact.8. They were the only speakers my wife liked. Pete Thomas of PMC expressly designed the Fact to be cosmetically acceptable, fitting a 6.5" driver in a cabinet not much wider. Market research favoured narrow cabinets. Some reviewers use them as a reference, but I found their low volume performance poor and the midrange is no where near the Harbeth. PMC deals with the bass using a transmission line, Boenicke using side-firing bass drivers.

The W8 hot treble reported above is not uncommon and should result in fatigue. I would consider it faulty.

 

[crimsondonkey]

The W8 hot treble reported above is not uncommon and should result in fatigue. I would consider it faulty.

What hot treble? From the flawed measurements? It’s nonsense.

I can’t tolerate a fatiguing sound and I can listen to my W8s all day long, and that’s with them about 8” from the back wall.

 

[CrazyindianZA]

Great write-up. Thank you. I suspect I wouldn't able to tell the different :/

 

[Foxman50]

In answer to your other question I didn't try the SE. Boenicke speakers are all hand-made, and many are made to order, so unless you go pay them a visit in Switzerland I suspect it would be difficult to have the three versions side by side for comparison. Though I am speculating on that. There were no W13s in the UK available for shop or home demo so it would have been impossible to do that kind of comparison over here.

Where did you audtion them duckworp ?

 

[duckworp]

Where did you audtion them duckworp ?

At home.

Here is a picture of the diminutive W8s on demo. They were not 'toppy' at all, whatever the 'data' says, and no fatigue set in. Quite the opposite. To hear the huge sound such a small speaker makes I think is quite remarkable. Though at Munich Boenike were exhibiting the absolutely tiny W5s which were sat next to the W13s and there were people in the room, me included, who really could not believe that it was the W5s that were wired up, going to look at the back to check.

 

[Marky-Mark]

Boenicke are similar in shape to PMC Fact. I had the Fact.8. They were the only speakers my wife liked. Pete Thomas of PMC expressly designed the Fact to be cosmetically acceptable, fitting a 6.5" driver in a cabinet not much wider. Market research favoured narrow cabinets. Some reviewers use them as a reference, but I found their low volume performance poor ...

The Fact series contain 5.5" mid-bass drivers and the boxes are 6" wide. They're basically stretched and deeper twenty.21/23s. I don't know about their market research, but the slim cabinets exist throughout their entire consumer line. This surely saves them money, but it also helps them disappear both physically and sonically.

Low volume performance suffers from their inefficiency. Some measurements are significantly lower than what PMC publishes; e.g., the 8s are rated 84 by PMC but I recall reading a spec just north of 80 in a review. How that was arrived at I couldn't tell you.

 

[kenniGT]

At home.

Here is a picture of the diminutive W8s on demo. They were not 'toppy' at all, whatever the 'data' says, and no fatigue set in. Quite the opposite. To hear the huge sound such a small speaker makes I think is quite remarkable. Though at Munich Boenike were exhibiting the absolutely tiny W5s which were sat next to the W13s and there were people in the room, me included, who really could not believe that it was the W5s that were wired up, going to look at the back to check.

I have heard them in Munich this year and 2 years ago. Impressive sound indeed from small enclosure.
Do you have in manual how to position them? I have a feeling they would sound much better when nothing between speakers.

 

[duckworp]

I have heard them in Munich this year and 2 years ago. Impressive sound indeed from small enclosure.
Do you have in manual how to position them? I have a feeling they would sound much better when nothing between speakers.

They probably would but sadly day to day living gets in the way. If they came out any further the TV would not be watchable. Most of the speakers in my room sound quite flat, which is often the case when speakers are close to a rear wall. The Boenicke speakers seem to cope with their position very well and have a huge depth of sound, both the W8s and the W13s had this characteristic. Of the other speakers I tried only the Sonus Faber Guarneri Tradition got close to that three dimensional sound image.

 

[sls4321]

The Fact series contain 5.5" mid-bass drivers and the boxes are 6" wide. They're basically stretched and deeper twenty.21/23s. I don't know about their market research, but the slim cabinets exist throughout their entire consumer line. This surely saves them money, but it also helps them disappear both physically and sonically.

Low volume performance suffers from their inefficiency. Some measurements are significantly lower than what PMC publishes; e.g., the 8s are rated 84 by PMC but I recall reading a spec just north of 80 in a review. How that was arrived at I couldn't tell you.

My apologies, you may well be correct on the measurements, I sold the Fact.8 almost 4 years ago. I seem to recall they were 6 inches wide. I also remember they were rated at 90db and were pretty decent with a 25w 300B-XLS SET. My valve period was very short indeed.

The Fact.3 and Fact.8 came before the twenty.2x range of speakers. The twenty.2x followed from the popularity of the Fact. The backward rake was added, presumably to make then seem smaller. The Fact were expensive and superior.

PMC previously made a range of floorstanders that were much appreciated and better than the twenty.2x stuff. However, in my mind their SE range are a reference speaker, basically a no-compromise studio monitor with a nice veneer. My purpose built listening room would have a pair of BB5 SE's, and they're £10,000 less than the W13 SE+.They are huge.

 

[sls4321]

What hot treble? From the flawed measurements? It’s nonsense.

I can’t tolerate a fatiguing sound and I can listen to my W8s all day long, and that’s with them about 8” from the back wall.

That's good news.

For £20k+ I'd go to Basel for a demo. It's an easy drive or a short flight. I had the misfortune to have to spend 10 days in Basel on business. The Kunstmuseum Basel is worth the trip alone. One of the first art galleries in Northern Europe.

 

[Paul Burke]

Thanks for the great write up DW, I’ll be adding the w8’s to a shortlist when it comes time to upgrade my kudos’s.

Lovely looking sia-025 there, wish my ri-100 had that same slim look, won’t complain too much though as it’s a lot smaller than the stack of fraim it replaced and sounds stunning