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MDAC First Listen (part 00111010)

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sq225917 said:
Console them via pm then
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Thanks for the glib response sq225917 situation engineer, appreciated. I take it you think everything is in order and acceptable then? One final question before my holiday. Who calls the time when enough is enough and the early Mdac2 purchasers/er sponsors either get their money back or an Mdac2 as promised?

And what about these scrap £300 donor Mdacs that got snapped up? Do they still stand a chance of being turned in to the Holy Grail?

Pride must now come in to this. give the guys their money back or give them a Dac.
 
kennyh said:
I don't think so. Some of us have friends who have put money in to this, friends made via PFM. In fact I feel aggrieved for all the guys who put money in the fund expecting to get a product many years before now.
I class it as supporting the victims of this and keeping it in the limelight, nothing amusing at all I can see with the situation.
We support guys who lose money via ebay mishaps on here, even though we can do not a lot to help, I think a bit of support for these blokes hundreds of pounds out of pocket should not be classed as a crime. Surely to god this has now dragged on long enough, especially for the blokes who only wanted an Upgrade on the old Mdac. These guys are not interested in files being released in 60 days or 30 days or poor finishes on billet cases and the rest. They just wanted an upgraded Mdac, although one bloke has gone and bought a new DAC anyway now.
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To be hones I really hope that John will offer the DevDaC2 to those people you are referring to.
Preferably sooner than later.
The wait and additional cost of the MDAC2 DD2A is not for them.

But don't forget that you should not feel sorry for all of us. I am definitely going to wait for the MDAC2 DD2A.
 
Thanks Rune, appreciate you realise what I meant. One point though, John has already offered the Mdac2 or whatever it's called now to them. That was many, many years ago, and took money for it. Then the goal posts changed, then changed again, and many times again since.

I also appreciate I needn't feel sorry for all of you, I'm sure will get the device of your dreams, and I genuinely hope you do, I really mean that too.
 
Part of the problem here is a failure to address criticism.

Some of us have to live with regular anonymized criticism of our work. It takes a bit of getting used to. You have to develop a thick skin and an ability to make balanced judgements about the validity of the criticism. And whether you like it or not, you have to respond to the criticism sensibly and productively. You certainly can’t just run away from it. If I refused to address criticism of my work, I’d be sacked.

I wish John were able to say: ‘Yes, some of the criticism I’ve received is justified, and this is what I’m going to do about it.’

I really do think he owes it to us. When you take people’s money, you enter into a moral contract with them. (Whether there’s any legal contract here is irrelevant.)

By failing to address the criticism here, John has breached that moral contract. I think that’s the main reason why the atmosphere here has become a bit toxic.
 
Yep. Quite right. John is not daft, he has known he has subverted and mislead along the way which is why he chooses not to acknowledge the criticism and hides instead.

I would tolerate the whole thing otherwise, as soon as I parted with the cash I parted with any sense of ownership of it but it’s the casting away of good people and deliberate obfuscation that offends me. We have basically bank rolled his ultimate hobby kit, and his obsession has gotten out of control to our expense.

I’m sure he’s a lovely bloke but it doesn’t change any of the stuff that has happened. I can see why he’s not employed.
 
Sibbers said:
I can see why he’s not employed.
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Some of your post is agreeable, but that is maybe a wee bit below the belt. Running one's own venture is entirely different to being on the payroll of an employer.

I would, however, welcome any actual acknowledgement of the problems from John himself. I, too, despair at all the side culs-de-sac developments and distractions. I just want an MDAC2 board as originally promised/proposed.
 
JTC said:
I would, however, welcome any actual acknowledgement of the problems from John himself. I, too, despair at all the side culs-de-sac developments and distractions. I just want an MDAC2 board as originally promised/proposed.
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I totally agree with you - I like many other pfm members have contributed towards this is good faith and would very much like to see a product actually delivered.
Facebook and I don't get on so this is the only place to keep track of what if anything is going on.
 
JTC said:
Some of your post is agreeable, but that is maybe a wee bit below the belt. Running one's own venture is entirely different to being on the payroll of an employer.

I would, however, welcome any actual acknowledgement of the problems from John himself. I, too, despair at all the side culs-de-sac developments and distractions. I just want an MDAC2 board as originally promised/proposed.
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Yeah, that was an unnecessary comment by me. I apologise. For me, more than the gear, I want the dissatisfaction to be properly acknowledged and addressed with some honest answers about what’s happened, and what will happen going forward.
 
StephenB said:
give it time...………..

PFM thread was a much happier place 5 years ago till the rot started

If I was just invested in the fdac then this might be tolerable, but to take my deposit on VFETS and deliver zilch is bordering on criminal
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I’m only in for the MDAC (it’s the FDAC really, but there’s no way I’m going to wait for that to appear, I’m in my 60s).

What I find surprising, and disappointing, is that John’s still working on the design. I’d have thought after four, or five years the design would be nailed down long ago and we’d have moved on to getting the actual production process sorted out. I think all, or most, were happy enough when John first changed the design for something that he thought was better, but by now the novelty of a constantly changing design has worn off - for me at least.

At this stage I’m not even sure if I’ll buy the board when it eventually becomes available (I’m actually still confident that something will eventually appear). If I’d have know originally that after four years there’d be nothing to show for my investment there’s no way I’d have participated in the development.

I think it all shows that while John is a highly talented designer he’s not cut out to be a manufacturer. At this stage I’d settle for one of the Project DACs that he designed, but didn’t manufacture. That’s not going to be an option though.
 
Stunsworth said:
No.
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I wonder if that's because more information is shared there, or because for some reason people are more timid when it's a bit closer to their "identity".

Either way, I personally have been able to take anything from John in the way of delays and redesigns, but the thing that's really bothered me is him vanishing off to Facebook. We are either customers, or we're sponsors. You shouldn't treat customers or sponsors like that IMHO. He isn't seeing it from other people's point of view, or he is but he doesn't give a damn.
 
wintoid said:
I wonder if that's because more information is shared there, or because for some reason people are more timid when it's a bit closer to their "identity".
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I don’t know. It’s very low volume in terms of posts. I think by this stage people are waiting for updates.
 
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