ITV Breathtaking
- Thread starter Tony L
- Start date
Joe P
Memory Alpha incarnate | mod; Shatner number = 2
Also keep in mind that the virus circulating now is not the one that was circulating when the pandemic was declared. Have people forgotten that at its peak in the US alone COVID was killing more people a day than had died in the 9-11 terrorist attacks?
Joe
Joe
paulfromcamden
Baffled
Joe. Wait. So you mean The Madness Of King George III...
Mike Hughes
pfm Member
Whilst this is an absolutely valid point it’s important to note that we currently have little idea what the virus is doing because we have ended almost all relevant monitoring measures. The virus in its many forms has placed many people into a scenario where reduced immunity is inevitable and thus hospitalisations and deaths from flu etc. may also be causally associated. Undoubtedly we’re anecdotally not where we were 4 years ago but nor are we “out of the woods” or at some kind of end point.
Ponty
pfm Member
It’s a case of people being quick to criticise but without credible alternatives. Easy to do in hindsight and / or when not in the hot seat.
I’ll stop here because we are out of my comfort zone of science and into politics.
In this case though, the credible alternatives would have been:
1. Turn up to COBRA meetings
2. Listen to the experts and follow the advice
3. Don‘t lie about following the advice
Corbyn may or may not have done that, but he couldn’t have been worse….
In this case though, the credible alternatives would have been:
1. Turn up to COBRA meetings
2. Listen to the experts and follow the advice
3. Don‘t lie about following the advice
Corbyn may or may not have done that, but he couldn’t have been worse….
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
There's a 'credible' in that sentence that is a bit of a tell.
Minio
Kind of Sort of Not really...
I don't think people would have listened to him.
Especially as they didn't vote for him.
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
If he'd have been in power, they would voted for him, though. This is what happens when you start with 'what if' scenarios rather than engaging with the argument. And anyway, plenty of people who didn't vote for Johnson or his party, followed the advice despite being convinced he is a rogue and an idiot.
Fatmarley
"It appears my intelligence circuits have melted"
I'm as sure as I can be that Corbyn would have tried his absolute hardest to keep as many people alive as possible. He's almost obsessed with other people's (and animals) well-being. It's been his lifelong mission to reduce suffering and save lives.. There's no way in hell he'd have missed, even a single COBRA meeting.
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Indeed. And I'm pretty confident he'd have produced financial support for the hardest-affected and the self-employed rather than setting arbitrary thresholds so that some had to sink or swim.
Ponty
pfm Member
What would that have translated to in practice? Longer, stricter lockdowns?
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Fewer dead people.
Tony L
Administrator
I know you are only here to troll (do you even have a hi-fi system or any interest in music?), but I’m certainly not calling this in hindsight.
I fully understood the Tories were not following the science (Johnson couldn’t even be arsed turning up to the meetings, let alone listening/researching), and I knew they were lying as I had done the research for myself. Don’t try to paint us all with your ignorance and arrogance. That you didn’t even know what the ‘19’ indicated highlights just how little information you require on a topic before smearing your opinion all across this forum. You are just the same when it comes to politics. Always arrogance and entitlement over actual knowledge.
PS Please don’t waste my time posting again until you’ve made at least 10 fresh posts in the audio and music areas. I’m sick of the endless shitposting.
Mike Hughes
pfm Member
I must confess that I try to avoid name calling with regard to politicians as it tends to distract from more important discussions about policy and process. In this instance though I think you have been gentle. The man is not a rogue or an idiot in any sense. He is a proven recidivist liar and an acute opportunist of the highest order. The deliberate hair ruffles; the bumbling speech patterns etc. His actions may have been idiotic in terms of how they were driven by personal ideology rather than evidence based etc. but let‘s not kid ourselves there is anything of the idiot or rogue about him.
eternumviti
Insufficient privileges to reply.
I don't think I ever caught covid. I went to Venice at the very beginning of January for a 50th birthday party which involved a couple of very tightly packed restaurants and a night club, and got caught in a couple of scrums of masked Chinese tourists. I spent all of lockdown working flat-out in a customer-facing retail shop, running out deliveries and shopping for my vulnerable elderly mother. I lost three close friends in which covid was at least implicated, including the guy whose birthday I attended in Venice. Very odd.
I only recall having a nasty cough that lasted for about a week a few weeks after Venice, but there were no other symptoms.
Joe P
Memory Alpha incarnate | mod; Shatner number = 2
eternumviti,
That’s part of the reason why SARS-CoV-2 was such a public health nightmare. It caused mild symptoms in some — so mild they didn’t even suspect they were infected — but acute respiratory failure in others. The people with mild symptoms often didn’t see the point of lockdowns, while those in hospitals on ventilators wished others had seen the point.
Joe
That’s part of the reason why SARS-CoV-2 was such a public health nightmare. It caused mild symptoms in some — so mild they didn’t even suspect they were infected — but acute respiratory failure in others. The people with mild symptoms often didn’t see the point of lockdowns, while those in hospitals on ventilators wished others had seen the point.
Joe
eternumviti
Insufficient privileges to reply.
Don't get me wrong, Joe, I wasn't anti-lockdown. People I knew and loved were dying. A friend who had retired from a long career in nursing went back to work, and was traumatised by what was happening in the hospital. I was as nervous as hell, but I had to just get on with it. It sounds very cold, and I don't mean it to, but businesswise it was a bonanza.
Joe P
Memory Alpha incarnate | mod; Shatner number = 2
eternumviti,
Same here. I lost a relative and a coworker to COVID and I almost lost my mother. She survived but has damaged lungs and has been on oxygen chronically since.
The lockdowns came with plenty of costs, too. I know lots of young people who didn't do well because of the isolation, not to mention livelihoods that were destroyed. No response was perfect for all, but I think it's fair to say Boris botched it spectacularly.
Joe
Same here. I lost a relative and a coworker to COVID and I almost lost my mother. She survived but has damaged lungs and has been on oxygen chronically since.
The lockdowns came with plenty of costs, too. I know lots of young people who didn't do well because of the isolation, not to mention livelihoods that were destroyed. No response was perfect for all, but I think it's fair to say Boris botched it spectacularly.
Joe
Fatmarley
"It appears my intelligence circuits have melted"
No faffing or spaffing around.