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Your opinion about Harbeth loudspeakers

33RPM

33RPM

Hifi bug resistant
A friend of mine ran into trouble with his speakers. They are large active Acon affairs. He is now thinking of replacing them with Harbeth speakers, as a local dealer ceases trading them and has some great ex-dem offers.

His living room is narrow and long (4 by 12 m approx) and placing is difficult. Not very far from corners, not against the walls nor far into the room. He uses an audionet preamp and Teac UDH-501 Dac to drive the Acons now.

The question he asked me if Harbeth would be any good for him, as his actual speakers are way to big for his room. He listens exclusively to pop and rock and prefers a somewat darker sound with heavy bass.

Are there any models for him to consider (and ask for a home dem)? he listened to several models at the dealers, but really didn't know what model if any to go for.
 
Should be ideal.

As the local dealer has "ex-demo" your friend should be able to listen and make up his own mind.
 
33RPM said:
A friend of mine ran into trouble with his speakers. They are large active Acon affairs. He is now thinking of replacing them with Harbeth speakers, as a local dealer ceases trading them and has some great ex-dem offers.

His living room is narrow and long (4 by 12 m approx) and placing is difficult. Not very far from corners, not against the walls nor far into the room. He uses an audionet preamp and Teac UDH-501 Dac to drive the Acons now.

The question he asked me if Harbeth would be any good for him, as his actual speakers are way to big for his room. He listens exclusively to pop and rock and prefers a somewat darker sound with heavy bass.

Are there any models for him to consider (and ask for a home dem)? he listened to several models at the dealers, but really didn't know what model if any to go for.
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I own Harbeth HLP3-ESRs and M30s. I've also owned Compact 7s in the past. Based on my experience of those speakers I would not describe Harbeths as dark and/or having 'heavy bass' . I'd say they were neutral and smooth sounding without any undue emphasis. If I listened exclusively to rock and wanted loads of bass, Harbeths would probably not be my first choice. Having said that they are excellent speakers. The only way to be sure is to listen to them with your own kit.
 
They've very nice. I own a pair of P3ESR's and have owned others in the past.

The U.S. importer is asking insane prices for them over here, except for the P3ESR which is pricey but not crazy.
 
He listens exclusively to pop and rock and prefers a somewat darker sound with heavy bass.

Harbeth, heavy bass?
Look elsewhere.
 
I have owned the P3ESR and Monitor 30.1s in the past driven by Naim and Accuphase amplification.

My experience is that they are very impressive at first listen but lack that something extra to keep me engaged over time.

After living with them for about a year, I concluded that they are over-priced and over-rated, not as enjoyable as their competitors from Spendor and ProAc, the latter having the edge when it comes to rock, whilst the former excels in the midrange.

Still, others have had different experiences with Harbeths so best to listen in situ before deciding.

Good luck!
 
I currently have M30.1s, and I find them extremely natural sounding and smooth. I wouldn't say that any part of the frequency response is over emphasised. They have an almost eerie ability to present the human voice realistically. They also have incredible precision when it comes to imagining. Not a super huge sound stage but everything is placed very precisely. They don't go super deep, but you don't feel they are lacking bass either.

I'm pretty happy with them and can't see switching anytime soon.

As others have said, the only way to find out what you feel about their sound is to arrange an audition.
 
Unless I've misread the first post, he's already listened to Harbeth speakers so presumably he already knows what they sound like.
 
d m butcher said:
Neither am I.

Harbeth speakers are prized for their accuracy especially their monitor series.
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The measurements don't look particularly accurate, generally down tilted fr responses and off-axis integration problems:
http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/measurements/speakers/harbeth_30_domestic/
http://www.stereophile.com/content/harbeth-m401-loudspeaker-measurements#tVZ0jQsgOQXtrX2W.97

The ~+7db at 70Hz along with a highly undamped port output (look at the impedance plot) is actually quite likely to give "heavy" bass.

If you take into account the confession that Alan Shaw voices them entirely on his own, I think you will end up with a particular sound signature. Of course if you happen to like what Alan likes then this could provide a good result.
 
S-Man said:
The measurements don't look particularly accurate, generally down tilted fr responses and off-axis integration problems:
http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/measurements/speakers/harbeth_30_domestic/
http://www.stereophile.com/content/harbeth-m401-loudspeaker-measurements#tVZ0jQsgOQXtrX2W.97

The ~+7db at 70Hz along with a highly undamped port output (look at the impedance plot) is actually quite likely to give "heavy" bass.
Click to expand...

The measurements for the M30 are interesting. I had a pair of the earlier M30s in my room recently, along with some C7ES2. The M30 had the same mild upper bass boom as the C7 ES3 that I owned for 3 years. I was surprised at this, but then when I heard the M30.1 in the same room I didn't get this. He has obviously smoothed things out in that region. I also found the M30 too forward in the mid-range in general. This is the case with all Harbeths to a more or less extent, but on the best models it is a well judged emphasis.

Regarding the off-axis presence region dip, this can be easily managed by toe-in. These are, after all, near field Monitors, and they work best in a classic triangular position, with the speakers pointed at the listeners shoulders. Something like 2.5m between the speakers and 2.8 - 3m to the listener works well, for example.

Regarding the bass performance, I would recommend the SHL5+ for rock music. The 7s and 30s are ok, and the M30.1 are adequate for me in my small room, but when I replace them with my pair of HL5s I appreciate the extra weight on kick drums.

The old HL5s that I own are fairly reserved in the bass for such a large cabinet, but I found the bass of the SHL5s very difficult to control. Fortunately, Alan Shaw's continued use of new modelling software for crossover design has paid dividends, and he has really got the bass right with the new SHL5+. I found it surprisingly well extended for a monitor speaker, and it didn't boom in either of my listening rooms, one of which is quite small (14'8" x 12). However I still find the 5 series cabinet a little overwhelming in a room like mine, hence my use of M30.1.

I think you could get the 5s to work well in small to medium room if you treated it like a studio and had treatment at first reflection points, behind the listener, on ceilings etc. Otherwise, they like some breathing space.

The OP should be able to get the 5s to work ok firing across in a near field arrangement, since he will have plenty of space at the sides. This will give him room for the bass and should ameliorate first reflection issues. He might try the previous model of the SHL5.
 
MikeMA said:
I own Harbeth HLP3-ESRs and M30s. I've also owned Compact 7s in the past.
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MikeMa, I'd be interested in your observations between the three models. I currently have the HLP3-ES2s, the model just ahead of the Radial driver being plugged into the smallest Harb. I've come to accept will have no peace until I try either the C7s or the M30.1s in my den for a good stretch. I've had decent auditions of both, and liked them both, but in stores with completely different construction and acoustics. No realistic prospect of home audition; I'll have to buy, then decide whether to keep or trade. Den about 2.5 x 3.5 m, 8ft ceiling, sprung wood floor, drywall interior. music runs to the acoustic, but not exclusive; classical & Latin guitar, singer songwriter, mix of folk, rock, lighter jazz, etc.

Which do you think might please best?

-paul-
 
Thx for all the reactions. Very useful indeed. My friend went to listen at the dealers again today. In the end he found them lacking in bass and he really was put off by the level of detail. His wiife described them as `rough `loudspeakers. He thought in the end these are wonderfull speakers, but not suited to his taste. As I like nearfield monitors maybe I should go and have a listen for myself?
 
I've had real pleasure listening to Harbeth speakers but I find them very Maurice dependant and that is why I could never live with them as my primary speakers, also given the fact they are overpriced means it is unlikely I'll own a pair till I have a decimated room and plenty of disposable income.

They excel with acoustic and female vocal music as well as jazz but I just don't think they have the omph for much of the music I like.
 
Bluedroog said:
...They excel with acoustic and female vocal music as well as jazz but I just don't think they have the omph for much of the music I like.
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There you go; that's what I do like about Harbs; much turns on the music we like best. One man says 'balanced, fatigue free', the other says 'lacking in oomph, lifeless'.

cheers,
-paul-
 
It just depends, they only lack omph because I like electro, dub, rock etc but I love Harbeths with the likes of Rickie Lee Jones. They are lovely speakers but not an all rounder, given I have a wide taste in music not ideal for me as a primary pair.
 
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