irb
pfm Member
Fair enough. If we're being pedantic (a favourite activity of mine) could we say that when you use your device in that way, it's a network controlled player, rather than a streamer?
Why is a streamer better than a desktop/laptop running e.g. iTunes?
- Thread starter les24preludes
- Start date
John
Rack’em Up!
My response was in regard to YouTube and playing content through a hi-fi setup. Sonos, for example supports AirPlay2 which makes it possible to play YouTube content through your hi-fi via Apple devices. The Sonos control app which I use for streaming Spotify and my turntable uses my iPhone or iPad as a remote in the manner you mention.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
You could you want, but I'm not sure streamer really has a fixed meaning.
More generally..
I appreciate that your post was not in response to mine but as far as I am concerned it is more important to emphasise that any reference to "a computer" is more misleading because of the "a" than the "computer"
It is useful to remember that there are (at least) 4 different functions which may all be done on one device or four separate ones (or somewhere in between)
1) storage of files (at least for local ripped files rather than internet streaming)
2) music player software
3) end point /output (sometimes called renderer)
4) control device.
and that is before we get onto the dac which might be combined with the endpoint or might not. One might even add digital room correction/filtering and/or upsampling too, which in my main rig is done on the same device as the endpoint and dac (but not devices 1) 2) or 4)) , but might more usually be done on device 2). So many permutations.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
If you mean a hifi product especially one which ties you into proprietary software then agreed.
I've a Naim NSC 222 but never use the built in streamer finding it too clunky.
I have a Mac Mini M1 2020 and use it in preference.
No idea if it sounds better or worse but the user experience a flexibility suits me for ALL media types except vinyl.
A reasonably priced LP12 (£15k?) but igital sounds better to my ears.
Active ATC 50s which are generally pushed to 100dB.
irb
pfm Member
Don't agree, sorry. Local streaming surely means playing locally stored files over a network. If we accept what you say, then any system where the dac is separate from the source of the digital data - such as a cd player with digital out - would count as streaming. But nobody refers to a cd transport as a streamer.
Your PC, your phone etc, all become obsolescent in time, with similar poor resale values. Streamers come in a very wide range of prices, some way less than any current computer, so it’s not much of an argument.
There is simply no need to ‘object’, they aren’t some kind of religion or doctrine, just choose what you want one way or another and be done with, I don’t understand why anybody cares if somebody uses a streamer, or not.
TheFlash
Reiki Audio
Priced as disposables like general purpose computers are? Hmmm. Your mileage may vary of course but, in my experience, general purpose computers are actually more prone to obsolescence than the streamers I've used and are hardly priced as disposables!
I've found Windows computers to be the worst, but across all platforms the way software developers keep updating their products on the assumption more computing power will be available today than say 3 years ago can make sticking with the same computer harder and harder. I type this on a 2016 Macbook Pro which is doing fine by the way...
On the other hand, my Bluesound Node 2i lasted a good few years and would have lasted a good few more if I hadn't moved over to Innuos Zen.
Finally, on the resale point, like my the rest of my hifi I have predominantly bought preowned where someone else has taken the bulk of the depreciation hit.
Hope this helps you or someone else deliberating the pros and cons, or both!
Yank
Bulbous Also Tapered
General purpose computers are priced as disposables:
flatpopely
Prog Rock/Moderator
So, for a long time I used a laptop with a Soundblaster XiFI into the K2 DAC on my amp. Really enjoyed it but it was a PITA having to use the laptop interface for various streaming platforms.
Then I was given a Linn Sekrit DSM. The SQ was better than the previous setup and the interface using my iphone to select music from either, Spotify or Quboz using the Linn app is super easy.
And Linn still suport it with regular firmware updates.
Then I was given a Linn Sekrit DSM. The SQ was better than the previous setup and the interface using my iphone to select music from either, Spotify or Quboz using the Linn app is super easy.
And Linn still suport it with regular firmware updates.
Jubal
pfm Member
Besides, they’re all “streamers” really. Just running different hardware, software and interfaces. You pays your money etc…
CageyH
pfm Member
I use an i7-6700k from 2015. It still works fine, and is running Windows 11, even though Microsoft try and stop you running it on this processor. I assume that they want you to buy a newer computer.
In what sense does a computer come obsolete? Mine still does everything I need it to, and fast enough to keep me happy. I think you only need more power if you are gaming or processing video. HQ player may need a bit more grunt, but I don’t use it. Streaming music and video does not need a lot of power. I am using the onboard graphics for video.
Read again - everything becomes obsolete ’in time’. Nobody said what that timeframe is. It applies equally to dedicated streamers as to general computers. Nobody is telling you to change your computer just for the hell of it.
TheFlash
Reiki Audio
If you’re running commercial software like MS Word, Excel and similar, the software typically introduces more “features”, which you may or may not want, and assumes you will have a fast enough processor to run it. That’s the sort of thing I mean.
I think his point is more that a single-purpose device such as a streamer can easily become obsolete as soon as the manufacturer decides they don't want to support it anymore and turns off a remote server, stops releasing software/firmware updates which might matter when someone like Spotify or Tidal change their API, stops updating a required mobile app, things like that.
Computers (as in personal computers) certainly become obsolete but not in the blink of an eye.
Dedicated servers can also have issues. Roon have just had an outage whereby some older servers and NASs running Roon Server lost the ability to connect to Roon, Tidal and Qobuz when Roon updated their product. This happened because:
”What we discovered in this outage is that there are a subset of devices running Roon Server which are woefully out-of-date.
Please keep in mind that the deficiency in these systems will impact any application attempting to apply modern connectivity and security best practices, not just Roon.
The vast majority of these devices are purpose-built music servers, NAS devices, or custom Linux distributions. In all cases these are seen as appliances which typically run a limited suite of applications, and this limited use served to mask the deficiency in their underlying operating system code.
When the updated version of RoonServer started on these devices the new networking code was not able to establish a connection to cloud services due to out-of-date components of the operating system. This resulted in symptoms ranging from update errors, to search failures, to lack of connectivity to streaming services.”
”What we discovered in this outage is that there are a subset of devices running Roon Server which are woefully out-of-date.
Please keep in mind that the deficiency in these systems will impact any application attempting to apply modern connectivity and security best practices, not just Roon.
The vast majority of these devices are purpose-built music servers, NAS devices, or custom Linux distributions. In all cases these are seen as appliances which typically run a limited suite of applications, and this limited use served to mask the deficiency in their underlying operating system code.
When the updated version of RoonServer started on these devices the new networking code was not able to establish a connection to cloud services due to out-of-date components of the operating system. This resulted in symptoms ranging from update errors, to search failures, to lack of connectivity to streaming services.”
tuga
Legal Alien
From MacOS 10.14 Mojave onwards Apple optimised the system for SSD and HDD machines became unusable (e.g. my 2013 iMac).
I was able to work around this on my 2012 MacBook Pro by replacing the HDD with an SSD, but the iMac has the screen glass glued to the shell making access nearly impossible.
HQPlayer 4 requires MacOS 11 Big Sur.
HQPlayer 5 (current) requires MacOS 11 Big Sur on Intel-based and MacOS 12 Monterey on Apple-based equipment.