Which would provide the more engaging listening experience in your view?

[mindlagoon]

Switch it all off, go and sit at your kitchen table with a laptop, some cheapo speakers, and large mug of Yorkshire/rioja, and listen to some of your favourite music on YouTube (without scrolling down into the forbidden zone that is the comments section). It needs to be an old pine table for maximum effect. Or stop listening to jazz.

 

[RJohan]

Do what ever you like, but I knew from experience that you will miss the JBL's eventually. Happened to me with my 4331's. Thankfully, they where just stored, so I could start using them again.

 

[Gervais Cote]

Do what ever you like, but I knew from experience that you will miss the JBL's eventually. Happened to me with my 4331's. Thankfully, they where just stored, so I could start using them again.

There is some kind of wisdom in that statement.............

 

[Frizzy]

I used to have friend who lived with the 250ti, he had lots of juice (class a) and in a huge room with bass traps. It was bass traps that did trick, amps changed but tended to be American ss, though a Mf A1000 was a star.

 

[Whaleblue]

The speaker end:

HiFi 2

The current listening seat:

Hifi 1

Room size is approx: 9m x 3.5m x 5m(ish) max for the ceiling.

*Plan is to put a sofa or chair on the right as you look at the system. Hence the need to have drivers up high. The home office thing is hopefully temporary, but who knows!

Another reason to change is that this is the only place in the house these JBL speakers can go. With a smaller setup it will be easier to accommodate in other rooms.

I think I see the problem. You need a larger CD collection!

Beautiful room. You say you’ve experimented, but have you tried firing across the room at all?

 

[halvis]

Do what ever you like, but I knew from experience that you will miss the JBL's eventually. Happened to me with my 4331's. Thankfully, they where just stored, so I could start using them again.

I am not kidding, I have had these up for sale many times and each time bottled it. Must be 5-6 times now.

The fact that it does need a big amp does frustrate me and is a big part of it. I don't like them - expensive, big, heavy and they all sound so different. So very hard to move on if you don't like them.

MC Audio I have sounds very good and has been in my ownership for a good 7-8 years now, but it is ugly and doesn't really go with any home decor.

That MF 1000 amp does look very interesting though and thanks for the tip. Only 50W of Class A but if that does the job then, yeah.

Problem is, there is a guy that has been after them for a while and I told him yesterday he could have the JBLs and after I have bottled the sale a few times already he was really holding me to it.

Listening again last night, it is the bass that is over powering and kind of shuts down your interest because it is not easy to listen to it. The brain is always trying to filter our the bass and correct for it. I think unknown to yourself, the bass makes listening a little tiresome, not in a bright and offensive way, more of someone just sitting on you rather than repeatedly sticking a fork in your eye kind of way that a hard and brittle sound may do.

The answer to the amp problem would probably be a big whopping integrated, I could budget about £2K for one, but that only gets you about 100 watts generally, it might be enough.

I think at the end of the day, something simpler is called for that sounds free and alive. You see pictures of nice Quad and Rega systems on here that look great fun, I think this system is just gone down a bit of a rabbit hole tbh.

Thanks for all the help and advice, much appreciated. If PFM wasn't such an interesting place that might stop me being so distracted as well ;-)

 

[halvis]

I think I see the problem. You need a larger CD collection!

Beautiful room. You say you’ve experimented, but have you tried firing across the room at all?

The CDs are mainly on shelves behind the left hand speaker (out of view), not just those you see on the floor. Those are just the DigiPak CDs (what to do with them as well, they look naff when shelved with the Jewel cased CDs). Although, they look even worse on the floor.

Thanks for the room compliments but as previously noted, it is very narrow (3.5M) which does make it awkward too. So the speakers would have to be backed right against the wall and as they are rear ported this wouldn't be great. I get a bit more depth to the soundstage when they are position about metre from the back wall as they are now. Also the seating position would need to right against the wall too, It's always good to have a bit of space behind you a think to avoid reflections etc.

To answer your question though, I haven't tried because of the above reasons, but I might give it a go if I keep them.

 

[halvis]

For what it's worth I thought I would mention that I demoed ProAc Response D2D's and Graham Audio speakers the other day with Naim XS3 and the 5si and I was most impressed.

I know we all hear differently but here is what I heard.

I was listening near field, so the stereo image may have been super enhanced compared to how I usually listen. It was excellent, very close to the best I have heard. The bass was right on all tracks I played, although some would have been produced on small monitors anyway. Bass much bigger than expected though and under very good control with the XS3, 5si not quite so much but if you weren't A-B'ing then you wouldn't really know and could save a grand IMO. That said, bass was a bit prominent at first, I think as port is firing straight at you. After putting the D2Ds back into the system after listening to other speakers below, I didn't really notice this again though. Snares sounded incredible, very fast and really got your attention. Midrange really drew you in, overall, the system commanded your full attention, which is what I was looking for.

Sounded like a bigger Naim 72/140 and Epos ES14 system I heard a few weeks back, filled out and polished a little.

Compared them to a few other speakers:

ProAc DT8 floorstanders, which were apparently fully run in but didn't sound like it. Shut in and compressed, with recessed midrange and bass and treble coming to think of it. Didn't audition for long. However, I was listening in the same nearfield position and they are obviously not designed for that. Shop was very small, so no other option to listen further away.

Also PMC 25 23i, didn't impress either, bass sounded disconnected from the mix. I usually like the transmission line speakers I hear, but not on this occasion. Much smaller than expected too, dinky things for the money. Again, should have probably sat further back.

I also really liked the Graham Audio LS5/9f that I went to hear. These did everything the ProAcs did but slightly better, except the bass on some recordings. Electronica mixed with smaller speakers sounded weird at times, just went too deep. Otherwise, a very enjoyable speaker that really drew you in and looks very nice in the flesh. Hard to not listen to full tracks. Easily a last speaker candidate for most I reckon with great pride of ownership.

Nearly £1500 difference between the ProAcs and the Graham's though and I am not sure it can be fully justified, depends on tour wallet I guess. I suspect the ProAcs are probably better across a wider range of genre's as well. Hoping to listen to the Graham LS6/f's, which by the time you have added stands to the Response D2's are a similar kind of money.

I also listened to the Exposure 2510, not for me. Midrange especially felt recessed compared to the Naim amps. Again, perhaps not run in.

Question with anyone with ProAc Response D2's, do you have to stay within the nearfield (within 2 metres) to get good imaging and soundstage? How are they when sitting further back? Oh and what is the difference between the SM100's and the D2's other than finish, does the SM100 driver handle more power or something for studio use?

 

[Tony L]

That size of ProAc is always really good IMO, and the D2 is no exception. They can certainly do more than nearfield and really respond to what is upstream. Superb speakers and certainly what I’d take from that picture!

 

[Rug Doc]

Shame there’s someone after the JBLs.. I’d love to give those a shot!

Have you got Roon available for listening? If so you could use the EQ to see what happens if you tweak the bass down a bit??!

if you’re looking for realism and the system becoming alive then the JBLs aren’t helping though.. they have been reviewed as a bit laid back and boring..

I’d look into starting an AN system, or maybe Shahinians as you’re listening whilst at the desk a bit I presume, and all your hear with the speakers to your LHS is what’s ‘wrong’ you’ll never be able to concentrate on what’s ‘right’ so I’d go for a system that has superb realism.

 

[halvis]

Shame there’s someone after the JBLs.. I’d love to give those a shot!

Have you got Roon available for listening? If so you could use the EQ to see what happens if you tweak the bass down a bit??!

if you’re looking for realism and the system becoming alive then the JBLs aren’t helping though.. they have been reviewed as a bit laid back and boring..

I’d look into starting an AN system, or maybe Shahinians as you’re listening whilst at the desk a bit I presume, and all your hear with the speakers to your LHS is what’s ‘wrong’ you’ll never be able to concentrate on what’s ‘right’ so I’d go for a system that has superb realism.

Thanks for the tips. The JBLs are gone now, to a very nice quiet guy from Dublin. I am in Ireland, chances are that you are not so it would have probably been a logistical nightmare anyway. Of course, when the buyer came to collect them, I fired them up and they sounded bloody brilliant as just sold kit has a habit of doing. He actually stepped back with amazement as the room filled with music. He pulled out the cash very quickly, as if there were a crowd of JBL nuts running up the road for them ;-)

I hadn't read a review that said they were a little boring, but yes I agree. Do I miss them, not really. Plus we have so much more light coming into the room now, only a couple of black holes would suck up more light I think (and be as heavy).

I have enquired about AN systems, but very hard to hear in Ireland and the one I did hear about 10 years ago had bass all over the place. It was in a very awkward room though. Any AN speakers with boxes is going to be over £2K and by the time you have added the new Import tax, it really isn't worth it. I have also looked into Shahinians before, non existent in Ireland and also a big risk in both shipping and not knowing how they will sound.

The desk is my wife's, it was mine, but I was booted upstairs about this time last year when it became obvious I would be working from home on a near permanent basis. So I go in there in the evenings.

There is a cheap pair of ProAc Studio 125's around, I did think about getting both a valve amp and SS amp to have a play with those. This would also save me a bunch of money if it works out. However, that would mean more faffing, I think I just want to get a system sorted and listen at this stage.