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Volume matching a myth

I want to enjoy music on my system. If it measures badly, so what? If it measures well, so what? If (as I do) I enjoy it then that will do for me. I am happy with measurement, of course it can tell you a lot about a component/system but it wont tell you absolutely everything about the device under test. Hows that you ask? Well give me every measurement possible and tell me what we need to measure in each of these to get perfect sound. It should be easy if you can measure everything you need to know about components.

Do we need amps with less than 0.1% THD but if we use them with speakers with 1% THD, will it sound worse than an amp with 0.5% with speakers with 0.5%? If I have an amp with a response 1dB down at 20Hz is it worse than one 1dB down at 20KHz (adjust these frequencies to suit) especially if I am using mini monitors? What are the real world measurements we need for perfect sound, I understand we might not reach 0% for everything, so what measurements are good enough for us to hear perfect sound? Then we all just need to buy the components that reach these. Simple.

Then again we still dont know everything about our hearing, until we do can we reserve judgement on its suitability to evaluate sound quality? (I can give you the quotes on this if you think we know absolutely everything about our hearing- just not tonight).

Sorry to be a bit absolute but we have had people telling us how perfect their sound is and providing the measurements to back their claims up for as long as there has been audio. How about B*se 901s or some of the digital compression CODECs?
 
Spacey,

The same old tired reasoning, trotted out, time after time...

[YOUTUBE]mr3clIhHU-Y[/YOUTUBE]

Ok Baz, relax...
 
You know it...


:D


Or as I'm about to be...

'Captain Pedantic'

And I did post some seriously scrummy Beethoven
 
Robert said:
So long as its not just the usual on axis response.
The response testing needs to be comprehensive, and you need to include distortion and decay plots to get a reasonable picture.
You can have a loudspeaker with a beautifully flat on axis response but if, as is sometimes the case, severe driver resonances are not adequately attenuated by the crossover because the slope is too shallow (and/or at the wrong frequency) it can sound nasty. So for example, a loudspeaker can sound subjectively bright even though it doesn't have a rising upper mid or top.

With electronics, and I'm thinking pre, power, dac & adc, there is no need to listen at all when choosing. Transparency and therefore fidelity to the input signal can be determined by a few basic measurements.
People only really need to audition electronics if they 'want' something that lacks fidelity.
Click to expand...

Darth Vader said:
Either this is a troll or you are speaking rubbish. For years labs have tested equipment and produced those lovely graphs and then they listen. At the end of the day the graphs say very little and often mislead.

Cheers,

DV
Click to expand...

I entirely agree with Robert. Good elecyronics are transparent, and there's no need to listen to transparent electronics, whether amplifiers or CD players. Auditioning is necessary when one is deliberately buying something that's not transparent, and one is trying to create a specific sound, not reproduce what's on the CD. Then, it's a case of tone control by amplifier selection.

S.
 
Just had another thought. I accept we might not have perfect audio components, dont we all? But that shouldnt matter if measurements tell us everything. Here is the example: a mini monitor rolls off at 60Hz, 0.5% distortion at this frequency against a larger monitor that rolls off at 30Hz but with 1% distortion at 30 up to 60Hz. The mini monitor has lower distortion so its closer to perfection. Oh no it isnt because it doesnt reproduce the lower frequencies. (I understand about roll offs and the mini monitor might well be playing at 30Hz but for this example it is below audiability). Isnt the best answer here to use your ears to decide which is the best compromise? Or can you give me the measurement that will decide? A "Sin-of-commission-sin-of-ommission-ometer" please.
 
fay spook said:
Just had another thought. I accept we might not have perfect audio components, dont we all? But that shouldnt matter if measurements tell us everything. Here is the example: a mini monitor rolls off at 60Hz, 0.5% distortion at this frequency against a larger monitor that rolls off at 30Hz but with 1% distortion at 30 up to 60Hz. The mini monitor has lower distortion so its closer to perfection. Oh no it isnt because it doesnt reproduce the lower frequencies. (I understand about roll offs and the mini monitor might well be playing at 30Hz but for this example it is below audiability). Isnt the best answer here to use your ears to decide which is the best compromise? Or can you give me the measurement that will decide? A "Sin-of-commission-sin-of-ommission-ometer" please.
Click to expand...

Choosing loudspeakers is a compromise between size, performance envelope and price/looks. One can't compare a mini-monitor with a main monitor for "better" as they are designed for different functions. One can't compare a stylish domestic loudspeaker with a studio monitor as they are designed with different criteria, the former with high WAF, the other purely functional.

What measurements and specifications can tell one, however, is which ones in one's price/size/looks range are more likely to dissatisfy and so eliminate them, leaving the candidates to be finally assessed by listening in one's own room.

S.
 
There is no such thing as an absolutely transparent and dynamic amplifier that would, for example be capable of reproducing faithfully the transients of drums being played in a small room.

Some amplifiers are more transparent than others. None are absolutely transparent.
 
Louder is always better except when it's too loud.......

that's the very reason that loudness matching is vital.
 
Steven Toy said:
There is no such thing as an absolutely transparent and dynamic amplifier that would, for example be capable of reproducing faithfully the transients of drums being played in a small room.

Some amplifiers are more transparent than others. None are absolutely transparent.
Click to expand...

Nonsense. Any amplifier can do drums justice. It's just that no HiFi loudspeaker can! It's nothing to do with dynamics, it's everything to to with maximum uncompressed SPL.

S.
 
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