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Vinyl grading - the fingernail test?

positive_energy

pfm Member
I have seen several eBay auctions for vinyl LPs with scratches lately (rated VG or less). What struck my eye though was sellers referring to scratch marks as "not feelable with a fingernail". Or scratches referred to as "just scuffs". Apart from the fact that I am loathe to pay for an record that has had someone's grubby fingernails run over it I was wondering it these are standard industry grading terms or are the sellers in questions having a laugh?
 
The RCRRPG grading system (link) is very vague IMO, there is a world of difference between VG (a record you almost certainly don't want) to EX (one you do if it's been accurately graded). As far as I'm concerned anything less than EX/EX unless judged by someone with established audiophile priorities is simply not worth the risk of buying blind. I'll never buy a record off eBay unless it was graded EX/EX or better, and even then I've been disappointed many times, e.g. I've paid damn good money to ship certain jazz titles in from the States that were graded as Mint only to find I'd have graded them VG to VG+ at best.

Tony.
 
The RCRRPG grading system is very vague IMO

Also ridiculously complicated I would suggest. The Goldmine gradings were less woolly, but I prefer the simplicity of the Discogs system. Essentially:

Mint = new

Near Mint = nearly new

VG = shows signs of use, but plays OK

Anything less than this isn't worth playing unless exceptionally rare
 
Seen on a recent online auction:

VINYL grades VG visually under bright and normal light.
Does show moderate scuffing and marks but that is visually only and this baby sounds punchy VG+ like an old Blue Noter should!
Not to say there isn’t any surface noise, there is (it’s a record!) but it’s such a nice sounding record
that any surface noise is certainly placed far back and does not interfere with enjoyment! KILLER!


In plain English what they should have said was:

Its scratched and sound scratched. But if I talk it up a bit then maybe someone will buy it! If you concentrate on the music you cant heat the scratches guv honest you can't. Signed KILLER.
 
In my experience, UK sellers are incapable of grading.

USA and Germany are not quite as bad as the UK.

Japan is where it's at.

There are far too many scally's picking up crap at carboot sales and thinking they can pass it off on EBAY as being EX.
 
I've sold a handful of records on Ebay - I don't give a rating, but rather an accurate description of each flaw, with a note as to whether it sounds when playing. When other sellers do this, I'm much more willing to bid decent money than with a vague grading.
 
I'll never buy a record off eBay unless it was graded EX/EX or better, and even then I've been disappointed many times, e.g. I've paid damn good money to ship certain jazz titles in from the States that were graded as Mint only to find I'd have graded them VG to VG+ at best.

Tony.


Me too, although I was pleasantly surprised recently on receiving a few Atlantic Coltrane white fan LPs that were listed as black fan and were in mint condition for $10 each. Don't know what it is about blue note though but people seem to think they are sitting on a winning lottery ticket and act accordingly! Unfortunately, as most are in the USA and eBay is where they get sold it is hard to avoid....
 
Apparently as many as 2/3 of my records aren't worth playing. I'm a little sad to learn that, as I used to enjoy them. Oh well.
 
Most of the records I bought on eBay Uk, which were categorized with the Ex! What a bunch of garbage! Useless!
 
I too am getting pissed off with record gradings on the Bay! Just received a copy of Sgt. Pepper which was described as excellent condition - sleeve is very good. But three very bad scratched areas which just cannot be ignored. Have asked for a full refund - fingers crossed.

I think I give up with Ebay now - can't beat visually inspecting the records yourself/in person!

- John
 
On the flip side I did recently snag a very nice original NY Blue Note on ebay - still in its shrink wrap and basically like new for a BIN of $10. Basically someone selling inherited items who knew nothing about their value....
 
LOL. Get a load of this for spin:

Vinyl shows an absolute plethora of superficial surface marks on the faces. There are a few small marks I can lightly feel with a fingernail pass.

All in all, this is a great LP at a remarkable starting price.
 
Who can you trust? i have had some dodgy gradings from professional record sellers (who i won't use again) and at the same time picked up some peachy mint collectors records from ebay sellers!! in my experience i have picked up the best graded records from fellow forum users (thanks darren, mark et al). While we are on the subject does anyone know any record sellers who can be absolutely trusted to grade properly (apart from Tony of course!), cosi would pay a bit more to get the proper item.
cheers
paul
 
long post alert:

buying crap records from ebay vendors (and others) seems like it could be an addiction caused by genetic defects, deserving of scientific action - at least in my case.

not sure if kasperhauser is taking the p*** above but I'd say two-thirds of my 'collection' being in too poor a condition to listen to comfortably is a hugely conservative estimate, and, yes, I do give 'em a clean (I've been through the mill on this subject - going as far as buying a loricraft machine at one point, and it still remains a very vexed one for me).

Most of these discs have been from ebay in recent years, and all of these hundreds purchased have been described as exc + or mint - ; most haven't been close to this by a country mile.

and, twit that I am, I never learn my lesson: just received 4 discs for a total of £60 (not inc. p&p) - all described in glowing terms, and mostly as mint / mint-.
well: the covers are indeed excellent, but the discs, apart from one, are not. At all.

of course, I checked out the guy's feedback beforehand, and despite him replying to negative comments with 'I fart in your general direction' (literally, I'm not making this up, maybe Python could sue him), and not allowing returns, I still bought the bloody things.

being a wuss I've never left negative feedback either ... !

And it's not just Ebay: this evening I've been comparing an original island copy of Fotheringay's eponymous (first) album, for which, some time ago, I paid a handsome sum as being 'like new' from the UK's largest professional vendor of used records and memorabilia (guess it's name) against a 'topic' reissue from much later, bought new from Dobell's Jazz and Folk record shop back in the day.

The original is appalling: no highs and crackle galore and doesn't even look 'like new' even if it was claimed that this is just what the first pressing was like (I assume they grade visually).
The topic is superb.

Wish I'd been older and had the cash flow to buy from such as Dobells when they were still around, and pressings were generally ok.


There is a seller on ebay who would appear to be exemplary in approach and presentation - 'one a day records'.
But the very nature of his method (he play tests each lp very carefully, even listing his hifi equipment) results in him dealing largely in highly collectible and expensive discs, so not a great source in general terms.

erm..., my congratulations / commiserations to anyone who's bothered to wade through the above blather, but it's a subject that's been obsessing me of late, as I've geared up to finally rip my vinyl collection to the 'pooter.
 
for those of you hanging on my every word (um, that's me, then ...), the fotheringay reissue was on the Hannibal label. To be fair, it is a much better mix and pressing as far as I can tell. If all the original batch were as muddy as my copy it's no wonder the band struggled...

also: I've just won an auction for a 'one a day' disc from ebay: here's hoping!
 


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