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TT wall shelf > uneven wall.

If you get some 3 x 2 PSE (that's planed up stuff) then cut a piece just longer than the width of the shelf, along with a couple of 'props' to sprag it off the floor so it's level and at the desired height, then blu-tac it in place with the 2in wide face against the wall. Then, use a block and pencil to 'scribe' (i.e. copy) the shape of the wall onto the back upper surface of this block. You can then rough this shape with a saw so it will sit against the wall. Put a couple of holes through (away from the wall shelf fixing positions) and drill through into the wall. Then put some glazing putty around the edges of the back (cut) face and screw into position with say 4in x 12s. You can tap either towards the bottom or top edges to help seat it and keep the front face vertical whilst tightening the screws and when happy, cut the excess putty that has squeezed out with a putty knife or scraper. Then use some 2 1/2" 12s to screw the shelf to the wall block. Pre-drill the wall block with say 2-3mm drill so you don't split it. Fit the shelf frame to the block and use a prop at the front to keep it level and then place a couple of short blocks up to the underside of the bottom of the frame, against the wall and draw along each block where it touches the back of the frame. Cut these and fit between wall and frame and screw into each block through the lower frame fixing holes. These will then sprag against the wall under load. To tidy it up, paint with gloss, or emulsion paint of appropriate colour. It's also worth nipping the fixings into the wall a day or so later just to ensure they are tight if the putty has settled a little.
HTH.
Andy P
 
@Darren L invaluable help Darren, many thanks indeed. Your picture showing stone says you know the score regarding slate: yup indeed it is softer. And yes it's my house not rented.

I just can't renovate the whole main sittingroom walls, even just 'skirting area', as the logistics are too huge for me.. & cost/ thousands to do a proper job: if I were to decide to do this, no point also not tackling the bigger job, of there being no insulation under the crap concete floor (which sits on clay: it's so cold I just feel there to be no PIR put down.. or if so a token 1" max as a camera discovered lurks in my 80's extention walls: this floor seems similar 80's: I bet amateur builder did the old cottage floor, whilst doing the [freezing cold] extension onto it, 1980's).

To redo main room floor, I need to jackhammer up whole 5x6m & skip, dig down 1ft/ skip, hardcore > whacker plate > DPM > 75mm PIR > concrete pour new floor > new underlay/ carpet. Then address 1ft of 'skirting area' strip back/ damp sealer > repaint. In theory I could do the work, but empyting the room alone & storing xyz is a logistical nightmare alone. It does really need it though- it's so fkn cold in my old main room I'm used to sitting listening to my Lp12 seeing my breath in winter, with hat scarf hottie leccy-blanket-seat, & thermals on.

I'll do a ply rectangle anyway & test the water- I could get lucky & the 3 top screws might anchor ok, despite the stone & mud mortar construction.

Grateful- Capt
 
a.palfreyman said:
If you get some 3 x 2 PSE (that's planed up stuff) then cut a piece just longer than the width of the shelf, along with a couple of 'props' to sprag it off the floor so it's level and at the desired height, then blu-tac it in place with the 2in wide face against the wall. Then, use a block and pencil to 'scribe' (i.e. copy) the shape of the wall onto the back upper surface of this block. You can then rough this shape with a saw so it will sit against the wall. Put a couple of holes through (away from the wall shelf fixing positions) and drill through into the wall. Then put some glazing putty around the edges of the back (cut) face and screw into position with say 4in x 12s. You can tap either towards the bottom or top edges to help seat it and keep the front face vertical whilst tightening the screws and when happy, cut the excess putty that has squeezed out with a putty knife or scraper. Then use some 2 1/2" 12s to screw the shelf to the wall block. Pre-drill the wall block with say 2-3mm drill so you don't split it. Fit the shelf frame to the block and use a prop at the front to keep it level and then place a couple of short blocks up to the underside of the bottom of the frame, against the wall and draw along each block where it touches the back of the frame. Cut these and fit between wall and frame and screw into each block through the lower frame fixing holes. These will then sprag against the wall under load. To tidy it up, paint with gloss, or emulsion paint of appropriate colour. It's also worth nipping the fixings into the wall a day or so later just to ensure they are tight if the putty has settled a little.
HTH.
Andy P
Click to expand...

Hiya 'Freyman, greetings to you.

Do you know what, I actually do know what you mean here, IE I scribed my plasterboard edge where a new ('21) extention met the old cottage. The big difference though between that pB job & this, is pB is only 12mm thick- so the scribe is near perfect. 1 dimensional.

Here I have effectively to scribe in 2 dimensions.. cos the thickness of the PSE will be approx 75mm. Now I have a jigsaw, but to shape the block to fit well enough, in 2D, is surely a helluva painstaking job.

I still like the idea though, & you know I trust your judgement. Hmm.. will mull on this approach today. I mean in theory I could spend ages fettling the profile, time's not of the essence.

Grateful again, Capt
 
A good sharp axe would help shaping the PSE, I have started carving two beech bowls from green beech and the speed and amount of wood you can remove with a sharp axe is amazing.

Pete
 
Tell me about it @The Captain what you describe in doing the floor is exactly what's been done here, the only difference being a underfloor heating system and Welsh slate tiling for all of the ground floor except the music room, I decided to stick with wall to wall carpet for that room.
The logistics is the trickiest and most frustrating bit of it, trying to find storage space and do the work whilst living here, I'm very nearly finished now though, alot of snagging to do as yet, but I'm 85-90% done with a complete renovation and refurbishment, from rebuilding chimneys with new lead trays, ventilated ridge, solar panels, completely new insulation that keeps heat in but also let's the building breathe, all exterior walls drylined and insulated, new sash windows, new doors, kitchen, bathrooms, etc, by the time I'm finished I'll probably need to start redecorating again, but like everything else in life you only get out of it what you put into it.
Good luck with it whatever you decide to do and don't hesitate to ask for advice should you wish.
 
@The Captain carve the thickness (45mm) not the width. IF YOU TRUST YOURSELF with a hatchet then that can be used but bl00dy dangerous IME. Fingers don't grow on trees... Doesn't need to be perfect as the putty will do the business.
 
@Darren L Both replies actually reassure me, thanks so much for your time with all this info my way. Your work there over the years is kinda like my journey, but yourself far ahead in ability & knowledge;

I found Build Hub (know of it? Fab forum 'vault' of info & help) & tentatively renovated kitchen, bedroom, then porch with my "merry band of helpers" on BH: fantastic results! You see I couldn't even fix a bit of timber to a wall using frame fixings when I moved here (west Wales, cheapo neglected miner cottage) 7 years ago. Then chanced upon BH.

I had gained so much confidence after my 3 room renovations, I designed & got my local builder build me a timberframe extension ('21) added on t'other end of the cottage. One room above another. He to do all outer stuff & roof, me do ALL inner stuff. So I progressed onto putting ceilings in, PIR, plasterboards, skirting, steps building, a doorframe; & pushed myself onward to building a timber door.. & lastly a sizeable timber balcony to finish the extension off. Most recently built a garden cabin on a tricky slope. Wow. I did all that-? (I say to myself now).

Now for the cherry on the cake, I just need to pop over to Ireland, becon me a fair maiden.. bring her back to coo at the results/ revamped property (a little peach- it really is now) & fall under my spell etc :)

Thanks, Capt
 
The Captain said:
@Darren L invaluable help Darren, many thanks indeed. Your picture showing stone says you know the score regarding slate: yup indeed it is softer. And yes it's my house not rented.

I just can't renovate the whole main sittingroom walls, even just 'skirting area', as the logistics are too huge for me.. & cost/ thousands to do a proper job: if I were to decide to do this, no point also not tackling the bigger job, of there being no insulation under the crap concete floor (which sits on clay: it's so cold I just feel there to be no PIR put down.. or if so a token 1" max as a camera discovered lurks in my 80's extention walls: this floor seems similar 80's: I bet amateur builder did the old cottage floor, whilst doing the [freezing cold] extension onto it, 1980's).

To redo main room floor, I need to jackhammer up whole 5x6m & skip, dig down 1ft/ skip, hardcore > whacker plate > DPM > 75mm PIR > concrete pour new floor > new underlay/ carpet. Then address 1ft of 'skirting area' strip back/ damp sealer > repaint. In theory I could do the work, but empyting the room alone & storing xyz is a logistical nightmare alone. It does really need it though- it's so fkn cold in my old main room I'm used to sitting listening to my Lp12 seeing my breath in winter, with hat scarf hottie leccy-blanket-seat, & thermals on.

I'll do a ply rectangle anyway & test the water- I could get lucky & the 3 top screws might anchor ok, despite the stone & mud mortar construction.

Grateful- Capt
Click to expand...
Good old Welsh houses. Been there, done that, got the T-Shirt. đź‘Ť

Lovely!
 
a.palfreyman said:
@The Captain carve the thickness (45mm) not the width. IF YOU TRUST YOURSELF with a hatchet then that can be used but bl00dy dangerous IME. Fingers don't grow on trees... Doesn't need to be perfect as the putty will do the business.
Click to expand...

Hi 'Freyman, really sorry but I'm obvious not on board with your scribe idea after all. Dang, I thought I was.

Ok my back rectangle of wallshelf, is 6x20". 6x screw mount points. I'm struggling with your suggesting a 3x2 timber, if I need a 6x2 for eg, with the 6" being the height of a timber piece, in order to then screw the TT shelf onto.

Quite clearly I'm missing a trick here. But at least I understand the idea of scribing a wibbly wall line, onto something, to then cut along this line. I have got only this far with imagining your suggestion. I'm still struggling with the 2-D aspect too (but was your hatchet idea somehow related to this-?).

This is reminiscent of my Q's to Build Hub chaps: they describe a building idea/ method, but then for me to understand & visualise what they mean, takes a very long time. By which time many have told me '..idiot!' & 'that's it I'm done'.

In a typical-pickle, Capt
 
Like this:
IMG-20240414-235012-498-2.jpg
 
a.palfreyman said:
Like this:
IMG-20240414-235012-498-2.jpg
Click to expand...

Hiya 'freyman..

super good of you to do this- ok I'm basically on board but still "an idiot" (that's a brand new unit of distance I've just invented) away apologies.

I get the idea of splitting the scribed section, into two rails. Get that. And I can only think that doing one, at a time, is the idea? Is that right? I can't think how to do both, being propped up simultaneously, is possible is it?

You don't mean I should first fix the TT shelf, to both rails, then offer the whole shebang up propped up by something.. do you? You mean concentrate on the top 'rail' as priority (because it's the load bearing set of fixing into this), scribe this, then... erm... you see now I'm stuck again re. the other one.

(If we had a new pfm section entitled 'General Idiocy', I could frequent this with 'gay abandon' & not feel such a clot).
Capt
 
Scribe top rail to fit to wall shape. Use putty, filler or similar to fill gap between rail and wall and fix in place. Make sure it's level along the length and front face is vertical. Put screws through frame into the top rail (pre-drill with a small bit to avoid splitting) and lightly screw into position. Cut a sprag to support the front of the frame and nip the fixings up. Make sure frame is level side to side and back to front. If you make the sprag slightly short, bits of card can be used to trim the front to back level. Place the two short blocks up to the underside of the lower horizontal of the frame and mark them as shown. Cut these and push between frame and wall. Again, card shims can be used to trim the level. Screw through frame into blocks to retain them. Remove sprag from under front of frame. Bobsuruncle.
 
a.palfreyman said:
Scribe top rail to fit to wall shape. Use putty, filler or similar to fill gap between rail and wall and fix in place. Make sure it's level along the length and front face is vertical. Put screws through frame into the top rail (pre-drill with a small bit to avoid splitting) and lightly screw into position. Cut a sprag to support the front of the frame and nip the fixings up. Make sure frame is level side to side and back to front. If you make the sprag slightly short, bits of card can be used to trim the front to back level. Place the two short blocks up to the underside of the lower horizontal of the frame and mark them as shown. Cut these and push between frame and wall. Again, card shims can be used to trim the level. Screw through frame into blocks to retain them. Remove sprag from under front of frame. Bobsuruncle.
Click to expand...

Aha now I'm there. Sorry didn't distinguish 'blocks' in the diagrams, can see them clearly now.

The problem is gonna be getting the top rail vertical I think. Plus I've just offered up an approx straight edge to where I want the TT shelf.. & there's a full 1" wall dip in, across most of the LHS of it. Ooff!

Gonna be a long job this I fear. 'Freyman would you think frame fixings, to attatch the PSE to the wall? I can't really understand why they exist tbh, over a std rawl plug/ timber/ screw. But frame fixings must have an extra purpose.

Most kind again, Capt
 
Drill through the PSE and drill a hole in the wall temporarily screw one end to the wall level the PSE mark the other end hole on the wall swing the PSE out of the way and drill the other hole fix the PSE parallel to the wall.
Now find the largest gap and set a pair of compass to that width and run the point along the wall with the pencil on the PSE, do this for the underside. Remove the PSE and make saw cuts from one side to the other stopping at the lines chip of the block and screw it to the wall. Do the same to the lower PSE making sure it sticks out the same distance as the upper one, some maths might be needed to get them in the same vertical plane.


Pete
 
It's not difficult, just needs a bit of application, thought and effort as you are trying to marry to a heavy curve and you need a solid foundation to fix the TT frame to. Quite simple really. Try moving your straight-edge about if you can as you may find an area that is much less troublesome...
 
I haven’t read the whole thread so don’t know what others have suggested but how about a wooden back plate? get that flat/level and bolt the shelf to that… and I would suggest bolting it and not screwing into the wood. Pre fit bolts from the back and use nuts and washers to attach the shelf.
 
There used to be a wall shelf made (I think CornFlake Shop) that was based on an equilateral triagle of steel tube, with a shelf sat on it.
The single point rear sat on a single small bracket via a short bolt and rubber stop that was screwed to the wall.
The two front corners then had the rope/strong twine (I swapped for S/S wire) going up to two hooks screwed securely into the wall.
The length of these wires can be adjusted via liked adjuster (threaded)
This would prove very useful here I imagine, but I can't find pictures anywhere.
Mine is sat in the loft somewhere, so it was most definitely an item.

Edit, I did find this which gives a better idea - googled 'suspended turtable wall shelf'
picresized_1366725782_AS.jpg


Now imagine the square base as a triangle with a single point going to the rear.
 
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