The Tesla Dilemma

[ff1d1l]

The extra materials and energy involved in manufacturing a lithium-ion battery mean that, at present, the carbon emissions associated with producing an electric car are higher than those for a vehicle running on petrol or diesel – by as much as 38%, according to some calculations. Until the electricity in national grids is entirely renewable, recharging the battery will involve a degree of dependence on coal or gas-fired power stations.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/20...te-oil-electric-vehicles-dirty-secret-lithium

Apparently over the lifetime though emissions are considerably less https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesm...han-fossil-fuel-and-hydrogen/?sh=5ecc2099197d
"Although BEVs do create more CO2 in production than fossil fuel cars, mostly because of the battery, the evidence is that already over a vehicle’s lifetime they produce less, because their “well to wheel” emissions are so much lower. As electricity grids get cleaner, the gap will widen, and no other vehicle type – including hybrids and hydrogen – can deliver the same level of CO2 reduction."

 

[gingermrkettle]

And to run the figures on emissions, 56mpg is equivalent to 120g/Km for a petrol car. The same effective emissions for a BEV would require 600g/kWh when gas averages at 360g/kWh. Unless you have a large element of coal generation, BEV CO2 impact of driving is significantly less, partly due to power station thermal efficiency being much higher than ICE.

 

[Menace]

...because oil, as we all know, is gently dripped into pristine barrels every night by the magical petroleum pixies.

I'm sure the Chilean people are pleased to know that as droughts increase due to the extraction process.

 

[KrisW]

I'm sure the Chilean people are pleased to know that as droughts increase due to the extraction process.

Did I say that Lithium mining does not have environmental consequences? I was responding to your inference that lithium extraction for EVs will be in addition to the current environmental disasters.

Lithium extraction is far less environmentally damaging than that for petroleum, and unlike oil it’s a once-off per vehicle. Reducing oil extraction to fuel passenger cars will thus be more environmentally beneficial, even with the additional environmental load of lithium extraction, than any viable alternative. Also, battery-vehicles create a viable market for renewables, especially wind power, by allowing energy generated at low-demand times to be sold to consumers (e.g., through overnight charging). And there are several ways to extract lithium, and not all are equally damaging, and lithium is not spent by EVs, and can be recycled at end of vehicle life.

EVs aren’t a magic bullet; those don’t exist. What they are, however, is a useful piece of the puzzle to get humanity off its fossil-fuel additiction. (Another piece is greatly increased investment in public transporation, changes to planning to stop building vehicle-dependent suburban communities, etc, etc, etc, but the topic here was “electric cars”...)

 

[AmadeusMozart]

Poor kids not making it to 20 because of the mining for cobalt without any regulations or safety.