Supatrac: the world's best tonearm?

[chartz]

Might be worth posting this old comparison while people are discussing price/value/marketing etc.…

This is MF’s prior $200k Continuum with the $30k SAT up against a bog standard $3.5k SL-1200G.

To my ears the Continuum is a little better, it seems a little warmer, weightier and clearer, but whether it is $226k better can only really be answered by an oligarch.

I’m posting this purely to highlight that if someone sticks an absurd $230,000 price tag on something that does not in itself set any absolute level of value or performance, let alone manufacturing cost. To my mind this is audio as Damien Hirst-grade conceptual art. It has absolutely no relation to function or design integrity. Chances are it is just overpriced!

My favourite counter-argument here is Rega with the RB300. That was such a radical piece of thinking when released. A simple one-piece tonearm that outperformed much of the then high-end and was priced for a very low amount. It was an object lesson in design, engineering and really thinking the whole thing through. It sent shockwaves through the industry and Rega could afford to stick it on their Planar 3! One of the real game-changers in analogue replay. It is here I’d be trying to look for lessons. Richard is lucky in that his design is beautifully simple. It works because it is clever. That is a huge advantage when it comes to production.

PS I found this one interesting personally as I did, for a remarkably short time, own a 1200G (I preferred my ancient TD-124!).

This video shows that digital, even compressed, is superior to analogue. What else?
I find amusing that people who want to demonstrate the qualities of their turntable compare it de facto to digital. No?
Nice music, by the way.

 

[Tony L]

This video shows that digital, even compressed, is superior to analogue. What else?

Differences are audible, but both sound pretty poor to me. If my 124 sounded like that in real life I’d never play another record!

 

[sonddek]

Hi Richard, I have been following this saga with great interest (and am sitting patiently in your order queue). Correct me if I'm wrong but I think you have stated that you believe that the turntable is an important determinant of the final sound, similar to the old Ivor Tiefenbrun ethos.

But on reading all the various reviews and owner accounts on a wide variety of decks at hugely different price points I am starting to wonder whether the Supatrac isn't something of a leveller? If so there are (at least) a couple of possible explanations, one substantial and one purely perceptual:

• The unique nature of the suspension of the Supatrac means it interacts with the turntable in a different way to traditional designs conferring some level of immunity to certain turntable differences.
• The fidelity of the Supatrac is so fundamentally high that it somehow diminishes the turntable's perceived contribution to the overall sound in a way that makes turntable differences seem less significant.

Not having heard the arm myself I accept that this may simply be may imagination running away with me. You have probably heard the Supatrac on more decks than anyone else, has a similar thought ever struck you, and if so do you have any theory as to the explanation?

I'm definitely a turntable-first advocate. This said, one of the best decks I've ever heard is my SL-1210 Mk5 bought from Crack Convertors for 200 quid. My Garrards are fabulous decks too, and they were free. I've only heard a couple of Lencos but they can still be had for a song and they do the business (see a customer's Lenco here sounding wonderful when he takes his finger off his smartphone's microphone:

It's not about how much money you spend, necessarily, but I do think it's worth getting a certain standard of deck before splashing out on arms, cartridges and phono stages. The platter speed, and especially speed consistency are fundamental to retrieving tunes and rhythms, the crucial ingredients of music.

This said, I have tried my arm on some more modest decks, for example Rega Planar 3, the belt drive Cambridge Audio Alva, and an Audio Technics LP5X, and in each case it was very satisfying. Don't sniff at those decks, they are each very good, especially for the money, and they can do a pretty good job of keeping speed and flow during ordinary music. The Audio Technica plinth leaves a little to be desired, but look at the price. With its built-in phono stage, bluetooth, and build quality, the Alva is a steal. Go a little higher and you will get more from your records, but I don't see an SL-1200 Mk7 with Blackbird as a mullet. The SL-1200s are a lot of deck for the money and their pricing owes a lot to economies of scale which I can't yet match. There is something to be said for putting a certain tone-arm on such a deck with a view to upgrading the deck when you can in the future. There's a clear upgrade path from Mk7 to 1200G to SL-1000R.

I've tried to make the Blackbird as promiscuous as possible with mount holes for SME, Rega and Linn on every base. The new thrustbox even allows you to switch the arm between Rega and Linn/SME geometries so you can transfer the arm between most 9-inch decks from Michell to Brinkmann to Rega to Pro-ject and so on. It comes with an SME clamp which can double up as a spacer in case you want to switch to a deck with a high platter. It also comes with mass adaptors so you can set it up for any half-inch cartridge. My goal, impossible to achieve but worth striving for, was a universal tone-arm which caters for the widest possible range of decks and cartridges and which you can take to your grave.

Yes, turntable first, but don't be scared of putting a great tone-arm on a relatively modest deck, if only at first. It can save you a lot of money on cartridges too, because the standard of reproduction you can reach with, for example, a humble AT95 is, frankly, breath-taking. I have no cartridge snobbery any more.

 

[YesMan]

Fremer has revealed which the arms are in the audio samples:
C= Supatrac
D= SAT

 

[sonddek]

I emailed MF to say I preferred C and I suspected it was the Blackbird. He congratulated me on sticking my neck out but asked me to keep quiet until the revelation.

There had been a couple of changed minds in the comments over at Trackingangle, so before the revelation I think C was favoured on both sides of the Atlantic. I particularly like the comments of Jerome Sabbagh who is clearly a musician of great taste and judgement ;-)

Two people had contacted me after visiting MF and listening there to say they were blown away and had to don the rubber pants.

Obviously I'm very pleased with this outcome, but I'll be even more pleased when I've fulfilled all orders and am generating stock.

Thanks to everyone who has offered advice and thoughts, and especially those who have bought one, or more.

 

[vesuvian]

I'm surprised by the result - I much preferred the Supatrac in the first test but had an equally strong preference for the SAT in the second test.

I am not a musician but jazz is what I listen to almost all of the time, so consider me perplexed.

Without the knowledge that both arms were set up correctly in both tests, I suppose we have to consider that any discrepancies might have skewed the results, but I am sure that those who voted for Supatrac both times would disagree with me

It's interesting, for instance, that Fremer set the Supatrac's tracking force (1.84g) outside of the very tight recommended range of 1.62 - 1.72g in the most recent test - a bit of a blunder given his analogue guru status.

 

[josst]

I listened to both comparisons before the reveals. While both are fine arms I had a clear preference for the Blackbird. It has an openness, agility and delicacy, with great dynamic resolution, that is more like the ’live’ experience, in the sense of performance being created in the moment, combined with the stability of master tape. The SAT is sure-footed, very detailed, muscular, but comes across as a little bit ‘predictable’. The ability to bring out the differences and idiosyncrasies of different recordings and musical styles is I think the mark of really fine components. When I heard the clips I assumed that A and C must have been the SAT. Amazing achievement Richard. Order on its way!

 

[sonddek]

I don't set too much store by the downforce discrepancy. I'm pretty sure that I personally would still have preferred C even if it had the right downforce ;-)

It was not an easy test and even though I've been listening to SUPAs for four years, I was not very confident in my guess. To be fair, I've never lived with a SAT, so a guess it was. It has been a lot of fun!

 

[vesuvian]

I don't set too much store by the downforce discrepancy.

Assuming that Fremer didn't alter the SAT's setup for the second test (and why would he?), I would have expected the Supatrac to easily outperform it if set up correctly, so, as I say, I am genuinely puzzled.

 

[sonddek]

It is very easy to make errors like that. I do it often. It's always worth checking and rechecking. It's not an issue for me as I thought there was clear water between them anyway.

There are several ways in which I think the Blackbird came closer to the performance. I found that I could understand the context and punctuation of the bass accompaniment more easily. During the bass solo I thought I heard more of a suggestion of the bass player's fingers doing the plucking. At the beginning the initial progression of piano chords is richer and more jarring - I think those particular chords are meant to sound queasy - this is jazz ffs. To me they sound much queasier on the Blackbird.

Then there's the important issue of timing and I think C managed to hang the music on a beautifully symmetrical lattice so that each moment passed exactly when I felt it should. Sometimes complex percussion can seem a bit random, like some sort of chaotic fit, as if the drummer is being paid by the stroke but secretly hates his boss. For me that doesn't happen with the C recording. D is still good but there are moments when I feel that some fusillade of strokes has passed me by without being fully understood or perceived. It's difficult to explain.

There is a certain sweetness in D's very detailed high frequencies, but I suspect that is an effect. Real life sounds rougher, punchier - real life has surface noise (apologies to John Peel Grhs). When you hear drums or piano close up it can be surprising just how hard and piercing their full energy hits you. I think the Blackbird gets very close to revealing those extreme dynamics and that's why it can make other arms seem smooth, mollifying and sophisticated. I wonder if that smoothness is dynamic attenuation, a misrepresentation which surprises less. Such polite effects may be helpful if you want to play background music. I don't.

C just puts me on the edge of my seat and thrills. That's what I set out to achieve. But I still disagree with David Ellwood about D - I think it sounds excellent. I haven't been able to compare a SAT in the flesh but I'm pretty sure that should I do so, I would think it one of the best.

 

[chartz]

Still, judging turntables over the Internet is nonsensical to me. It just proves that digital is perfectly adequate.

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

Still, judging turntables over the Internet is nonsensical to me.

Not so much 'judging' here, as noting that the differences were apparent enough to survive being converted to a format suitable for the internet.

 

[chartz]

Sure but those differences are audible through compressed digital. What does it say? That analogue is inferior to digital, is all. Which is not saying that analogue is poor, obviously.
All the YouTube needledrops just demonstrate how digital is superior.

 

[rn82497]

Fremer has revealed which the arms are in the audio samples:
C= Supatrac
D=

the important issue of timing

Exactly this - for me. For me C made the music more accessible / enjoyable. D was like - "yep this is Jazz" - not interested.

 

[vesuvian]

Just listened again (via my laptop, as before) to see whether my opinion might have changed, but, no, I still prefer D. I think the music swings harder/has greater momentum and the drums and piano are better separated, with the interplay between the 2 instruments more pronounced. IOW, and IMO, that elusive quality "timing" is better represented.

But, hey, we all hear differently and Richard should be very proud of his creation.

 

[rn82497]

Just listened again (via my laptop, as before) to see whether my opinion might have changed, but, no, I still prefer D. I think the music swings harder/has greater momentum and the drums and piano are better separated, with the interplay between the 2 instruments more pronounced. IOW, and IMO, that elusive quality "timing" is better represented.

But, hey, we all hear differently and Richard should be very proud of his creation.

It's weird isn't it? Do you listen to a lot of Jazz - of this type? Wondering if you are more "tuned in" - so the interpretation side of things is easier for you? I don't listen to much Jazz.

 

[vesuvian]

Been listening to jazz in all its wondrous forms since my early teens. I am now 60.

 

[Jazzer]

Jazz still leaves me utterly cold but I still listening to different components.
Maybe one day I will be convinced that they sound different enough to be worth worrying over.

 

[rn82497]

Been listening to jazz in all its wondrous forms since my early teens. I am now 60.

Interesting. When I demo new equipment - I always let the retailer select the music - preferably something I don’t know. The reason being a good system should make the music accessible to me. If I know the music - I already have a mental model - and start dissecting the performance. Wonder if something like this explains our different conclusions? Just one of my many random thoughts

 

[Struts001]

Sorry Richard. Have another question burning a hole in my curiosity. I remember reading somewhere (can't find it now) about a formative experience from engineering school where you had to make a bridge from an under dimensioned sheet of metal. You made (iiic) a sort of telescopic Y-section which proved to be very strong. Made me wonder, why isn't the Blackbird (or any other tonearm for that matter) made with a Y-section. Or indeed an equilateral triangle*? I assume pultrusion doesn't allow tapering but maybe even an untapered triangle would be stiffer than two boxes?

* Sorry, tried to include a link but was prevented from doing so by the anti-spam protection as I have too few posts. Google "Shape of the Strongest Column, Keller, Jospeh B."