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Short but urgent query on Naim 135s - bargain?

NickofWimbledon

NickofWimbledon

pfm Member
Having carefully decided that nothing now stuck out in my system as needing addressing, apart from a cartridge next year (and do I change top plate or anything else at that point or never?), I was tempted.

I have LP12 (Kore, Karousel, Ekos, Krystal, L4) and Superline (from Aux 2), 52, olive SC, 250, NDX2/XPSDR. CDS2 and B&W 804D3s. Cables, mains and supports are all VG. Olives were all serviced between 2016 and 2020.

I do use the volume control liberally, but not enough that my 250 ever cuts.

I have been offered a pair of 1990 135s (serials 63809/63810) for £2700. I believe that they have olive fascias (not brown) and were serviced in 2010.

In the current market, do those who actually own 135s reckon that’s a good price?

Also, do tell if it looks like a silly change.
 
I'd say the price is probably about right, 2k is definitely cheap for such amps, i'd have thought 2.5k would be more likely, and it really depends on condition and service history as servicing is expensive for these.

Would you gain anything over the 250? Well, if you *like* the 250, then the 135s are more of the same, basically the pinnacle of that design approach, so i'd say if it's an itch you want to scratch, there's no harm.

My 135s are the older chrome version, but I believe it really is just a cosmetic change to the olive series, and I find them very capable.
 
Despite I love the 250, a pair of 135 brings a lot more music and muscle so I would go for it.
Price is now dictated by rarity more than value though so I would try to get it a few pounds lower than the asked price, if possible.
 
Overpriced I think. That year would surely be brown olive rather than later green. I think getting the front panel changed was an option though?
Serviced 2010 ! If these have been left on for 12 years or so and/ or have been driving an average sensitivity speaker, played loudly , and frequently- service required to hear at their best.
I've had 3 pairs over the years. Good amps , particularly with my trusty old Nac52. Even serviced though , performance wise , they would overpriced in my opinion at £2700.
However, if having top olive Naim is a must , then £2500 tops - for a nice recently serviced pair. In my opinion of course.
 
Whaleblue said:
If aesthetically matched facials are important, and your current crop do, I’d look to check that the 135s match too before committing.
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Good point, At the margin, I mind.

My Supercap is quite brown and does not match and it annoys, but it was too good a bargain. If only someone sold olive fascias...

I am seeing a set on Tuesday (less than £2,500 but still 10 years since service) that definitely don't look brown in the pictures.
 
PerF said:
I paid nearly half that for mine two decades back.
Should have kept them with these prices.
Greamp amps, prefer anyday over a 300.
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Yup. Got a little bit of the Rolex thing going on. I sold my last pair about 6 years ago. For about £1850 I think. Off to France they went. Due a service now.
Good amps for sure but a head to head with a Densen B330 + did for them . And my Exposure 18 Super monos ( second system)were pretty much as near as damn it close.
 
mbu said:
Overpriced I think
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PerF said:
I paid nearly half that for mine two decades back.
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I agree and I sold my last 2 of 4 for much less that only a decade or so ago. Had a 250 before. The 135 is obv. an improvement in having more heft and authority (though marginally less power, I believe). Whereas these are unlikely to depreciate over time, you'll be facing a service (very?) soon and that ain't cheap, whoever does it.

The only time I (and a Naim friend) have heard B&Ws on the end of 52/135s was the Nautilus (I think; big, anyway) at Doug Brady's (?) over 2 decades ago and everybody (incl. the dealer but it was the only big speaker he had) agreed that Naim and B&W (at the time) didn't gel. Audition-wise, this was obvious as we both had 52/135 set-ups. However, models move on so maybe compatibility moved on.

Add the fact that your aesthetics may not match, I'd say pass on these and keep tabs on future sales of more recently serviced, boxed 135s (or change horses?). Incidentally, I had a pair of C/B with those sought-after trannies and a later pair without. As I bi-amped, I never bothered about the so-called tonal difference but those 1990 ones were on the cusp of trannie change ('89/90) if I remember correctly.

I.m.o., the sonic upgrade will be marginal, albeit audible, though I'd base that on the 3 x big Response ProAcs and the previous Briks I had with the 135s. Dunno about the B&Ws.
 
I can’t imagine putting Nautilus and 135s together.

I have heard Naim classic and Olive kit with several B&W speakers. Many liked the result particularly with DR amps and 8-series speakers, but I never liked them - that tweeter and the pointiness were really not what I wanted. So I didn’t hear any for a decade or so.

That changed 3 years ago for me. Having heard them at dealers, I expected to buy the brilliant Near Xplorers, and rated them much higher than PMCs for example. However, in my system and house the B&Ws won by a decent margin.

I’ll see whether colours match- I’d need a bigger discount to go brown over olive, but if suppose that’s possible. More likely I’ll keep looking.

On service, you are very right. Getting them serviced and recapped makes sense and will cost £798, and I’ll be bearing that in mind. Total cost is still less than half what 300s seem to fetch.

Of course, if the SQ difference is small or zero, I’ll have the bother of selling them again, and probably a net loss overall, but that doesn’t look too high a price to pay to find out once and for all whether they really will be compelling.
 
I think £2,700 is toppy to say the least and I'd expect at the very least fully serviced within the last year or two to go anywhere near that sort of price.

As others have said the sonic improvement is marginal, but you'll certainly get it with the front end you have, and it's not really volume related. The 135's just remove a slight element of "confusion" the 250 has, but some say you can get that same effect by just relocating the star earthing bar to between the caps rather than between the speaker terminals.

They don't go obviously louder than the 250.

Where I think you'd be better off spending some money is on the SC. Either have it "Dragon Newt'ed" if the look is important to you or replace it with a TSC if not.

A completely separate PS for the Superline would also be a sensible investment.
 
I thought 135s were beaten by 250DR

Your milage may very

Why not treat your 250 to some Avondale boards and completely blow 250/135 away for good?

250DR didn't stand a chance against ncc220 never mind ncc300 and I hear the SE range is better still
 
Mynamemynaim said:
I thought 135s were beaten by 250DR

Your milage may very

Why not treat your 250 to some Avondale boards and completely blow 250/135 away for good?

250DR didn't stand a chance against ncc220 never mind ncc300 and I hear the SE range is better still
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Here you go !
An Avondaled Naim will give you the best of the best for reasonable money.
Avondale definitely stopped my upgraditis since I have a fully modded NAP 110 with their boards and power supply.
Can’t recommend this enough.
 
Unless you particularly want to stick with Naim, I’d keep an eye out for Avondale power amps. They will be ahead of 135’s for half the price. I had an serviced Olive 250 and my single box Avondale based amp that I got Zener to build (a ‘Zap 250’) was a lot better!
 
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