Tim Jones
pfm Member
My assumption would be; because lighter things "store less energy", as in the Rega deck designs. The Mana Ref, which was what my LP12 (when I had one long ago) sounded at its best on by a country mile, was hardly light though.
Naim Fraim what a difference
- Thread starter pidge22
- Start date
My assumption would be; because lighter things "store less energy", as in the Rega deck designs. The Mana Ref, which was what my LP12 (when I had one long ago) sounded at its best on by a country mile, was hardly light though.
Whatsisnaim
pfm Member
A low mass shelf will pick up less energy that a heavy one, so the combination of rigidity and low mass is what they mean, I think. This will apply more to the shelf than to its supporting brackets, though, especially if they are decoupled by spikes or whatever.
drummerman
pfm Member
I am well aware of the importance of a good stand and the difference one can make to sound quality.
I also believe a good stand will cost money. You can not get one cheaply.
The materials and craftsmanship are vitally important and will not only provide audible benefits but create proud ownership.
That's why my amp currently resides on a Mavic Pro 2 carton box.
I also believe a good stand will cost money. You can not get one cheaply.
The materials and craftsmanship are vitally important and will not only provide audible benefits but create proud ownership.
That's why my amp currently resides on a Mavic Pro 2 carton box.
Let me know if you ever consider selling.
Alex S
carbon based lifeform
I found John utterly charming and July made a mean curry. The product was a bit rubbish though.
My stuff is all on Hutter and especially now will remain so in memory of Jason.
drummerman
pfm Member
SteveG
pfm Member
The only thing I've definitely, unquestionably heard a difference with when on a decent support is my LP12, on it's Mana wall shelf. That would mainly be due to elimination of vibrations through the floor though, and I'm sure any decent shelf would also have done a good job at that.
For the rest I can see why it would also make a difference with CD players (my main one lives on a Mana table) but for amps etc. I just see racks as a convenient place to put them. My living room system is just on a wooden AV stand thing and doesn't appear to suffer from it.
For the rest I can see why it would also make a difference with CD players (my main one lives on a Mana table) but for amps etc. I just see racks as a convenient place to put them. My living room system is just on a wooden AV stand thing and doesn't appear to suffer from it.
diybry
pfm Member
hmm- So if I have this correct- A very solid support, such as my cast iron wall brackets, ensure a stable, unmoving base. A very light shelf on top of the brackets then allows energy from the LP12 to be absorbed by flexing and damping any vibrations from the deck? If this is correct, then taking it a stage further, the shelf supports cannot be directly underneath he LP12 feet, as the shelf would the be trapped between the two, and able to absorb vibration only through compression of the shelf material rather than flexure?
Whatsisnaim
pfm Member
I won’t claim to be an expert, but my understanding is that the low mass of the shelf helps by not absorbing vibration energy from the room and transferring it to the turntable. I don’t think vibrations from the turntable going to the shelf are the issue.
1964meb
pfm Member
A fishy type who I visited recently has all his system (TTs, amps CD players ) on microwave wall shelves /brackets (from IKEA???) and it sounds great. A fraction of the cost of branded hi fi shelves
(I have an ancient Target shelf unit and a Target TT wall shelf that won't be being changed)
M
joe9407
actress/activist
@booja30 -- i thought this was quite a convincing piece and cause for (major) doubt that racks make any difference, especially with solid-state equipment.
luckily, my wife has prevented me from indulging in any HiFi-stand-related program activities -- she likes the look of the Ikea Corras units that all the kit sits on, including the LP12 (with Trampolin), and has put her foot down against any weird-looking shit in the living room.
I find it very hard to believe that well-designed solid-sate electronics is at all susceptible to the very low levels of vibration likely to be evident on even the cheapest rack.
Very possibly some of the perceived sound difference may come from the physical presence of a substantial piece of heavy furniture (i.e. the rack) in the listening room. Ten years or more ago, I replaced a old MFI wooden cabinet with a fairly pricey rack made by Something Solid, and was convinced the sound was noticeably colder. I suspect the old cabinet was introducing a mildly pleasant "warm" colouration.
Very possibly some of the perceived sound difference may come from the physical presence of a substantial piece of heavy furniture (i.e. the rack) in the listening room. Ten years or more ago, I replaced a old MFI wooden cabinet with a fairly pricey rack made by Something Solid, and was convinced the sound was noticeably colder. I suspect the old cabinet was introducing a mildly pleasant "warm" colouration.
Always has been my conviction also, but science has been chased out of audio for a while now and we are now dealing with a faith based system. Most audiophiles hold that cables and transistor equipment are, somehow, sensitive to minute vibrations causing deleterious effects on the perceived sound. Only golden eared believers are able to perceive such ill effects. So many are out of luck I guess.