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Naim dac opinions

I've had a nDAC and a DAC V1 in the same system for quite a while. I started with V1 which replaced a rather budget DAC and I was delighted with the results, it was a very significant improvement.

After about 3 years I purchased a nDAC (2nd hand) and had the opportunity to compare it with the V1. To my ears the nDAC was an improvement over the V1. As much as I rate the V1 on comparison I found it a little thin compared to the nDAC. This became even more apparent with the later addition of an Olive XPS.
 
ajm said:
Me neither - I think the Naim DAC is capable of really great performance.

However, I've wrote before, in my experience its performance level is highly dependent on the digital signal fed into it. I've heard the nDac sounding very average and conversely very, very good when different transports were used into it.
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I completely agree. I was able to demo an Innuos Zen Mini MK III into my Ndac/Teddy XPS and it was considerably better in every area than my current CD transport and also the Bluesound Vault 2i. The rest of the system is a Sonneteer Orton into ProAc D20rs for reference.
 
Sorry about the late return to my own thread. Interesting reading folks & thanks for the direct comparison legroschien.
I wouldn't be using a Naim dac with a cd transport, it would be partnered with my Cambridge 851n streamer to hopefully get an even better sound. Any thoughts on this?
 
johnny nocash said:
Sorry about the late return to my own thread. Interesting reading folks & thanks for the direct comparison legroschien.
I wouldn't be using a Naim dac with a cd transport, it would be partnered with my Cambridge 851n streamer to hopefully get an even better sound. Any thoughts on this?
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While I have not tried the 851n to the nDAC, I'd be very surprised if the nDAC did not improve your system. I've had mine for a week and a half, and it makes my Exposure 3010S2 CD noticeably better. I tried a friend's Cambridge CXC CD transport, which was not as good as the Exposure, but it is also something like a quarter of the price.

My experience so far is that the digital cable makes a difference; a Wireworld Starlight 8 (BNC-BNC) was noticeably better than an Audioquest Cinnamon (RCA-RCA). No, not enormously, but the difference is easy to hear.
 
I had a Naim DAC and swapped it for a Teddy DAC. Teddy was quite noticeably better, and cost about half of what the Naim cost me. The point I'd like to make is that there appears to be ways of making better sounding DAC's than Naim for a lot less money.
 
I have the Ndac/Teddy XPS and a Chord Qutest Dac. I have created a thread titled "Picked up a Chord Qutest Dac this weekend" if you are interested in my experience between the two.
 
Thanks for the further input guys. I read your thread with interest Spesh. I heard a chord Hugo a while back and it was very detailed but ultimately wasn't to my taste. Maybe the Qutest is a bit different & of course a lot of things are system dependant. Glad you're happy though.
One thing I have found with modern dacs is that they are mega detailed but lose a bit of the enjoyment factor for me. I've heard an old Wadia, Theta gen5 & Audio synthesis DACs which all sounded better to me. I was hoping the Naim DACs might be similar.
Unless anyone has any of the aforementioned, it looks like I'll be sticking with my trusty Xiang Sheng 05 for the time being:(
 
mjw said:
The V1 sounded thin and insubstantial compared to the CDS3 (I make no claims as to detail retrieval etc., which doesn't particularly interest me, I just didn't like it as much). I discussed this with an old school pal who has a lifetime in music and hifi journalism and his take was that the V1 uses a newer Sharp DAC chip whereas the CDS3 uses the Burr-Brown chip, but the chip is only part of the story.
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The V1 uses the Burr Brown PCM1791A chip with their own 40bit floating point filter, same as nDAC, and a SHARK DSP processor. I doubt Sharp have ever manufactured a DAC chip.
V1 has the same technology as the earlier nDAC, slightly updated. The output stage is the same as in 252 and 552. In my system V1 sounds anything but thin and insubstantial, quite opposite, typical Naim sound. I think it is a good DAC when used with a good source via the asynchronous USB input and DIN output. As a headphone amp I found it OK if you are not a head-fi junkie.
 
@mjw The DAC V1 uses a Burr Brown PCM1791A DAC chip. The SHARC chip is a digital signal processor. As you say though, the chip/s is only part of the story.
 
S-Bar said:
V1 has the same technology as the earlier nDAC, slightly updated
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I'm not sure that this is correct.

As far as I understand it the DAC-V1 uses the PCM1791 DAC chip but the original Naim DAC uses the PCM1704K DAC chip as used in the CDS3 and ND555
 
ajm said:
I'm not sure that this is correct.

.......the original Naim DAC uses the PCM1704K DAC chip as used in the....ND555
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That's my understanding as well, as stated in the Sircom/Steward review in Hifi+ (2010).
 
ajm said:
I'm not sure that this is correct.

As far as I understand it the DAC-V1 uses the PCM1791 DAC chip but the original Naim DAC uses the PCM1704K DAC chip as used in the CDS3 and ND555
Click to expand...

That's correct, even more so ndac uses two BurrBrown chips, one for for each channel, whereas v1 has just one. Still the technology is basically the same when it comes to filtering and processing the signal.
 
The firmware also changed quite a bit over time, the more recent versions improved things over the first iterations substantially. When people say x was better than y, the goalposts were moving at the same time. I had one of the first batch under oath from the dealer not to tell anyone, so lived with one for a long time;) I had both an XPS2 and a Teddy P, they were both very worthwhile additions. I sold my CDS3 with the XPS and kept the Teddy in the end. There was a Naim 'white paper' at one time that was very informative, it don't know if it's still to be found - Yes, here it is
https://www.naimaudio.com/sites/default/files/products/downloads/files/naim_dac_august_2009.pdf
 
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