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MDAC first listen (part XVIII)

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Richard Kimber

Richard Kimber

pfm Member
JohnW said:
The problem with classical music is more often then not the atrocious recording quality - Deutsche Gramophone DDD recordings where just grating - for me if you where to ask for an example of why I dislike "Digital" Deutsche Gramophone DDD recordings are the first to spring to mind (And some PolyGram – not sure if they used the same recording equipment).
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Hi John:

I agree that there's a lot of poorly record stuff out there, but IMHO some of the Reference Recordings, MDG, Linn, Harmonia Mundi (for example) discs sound pretty good to me.

- Richard.
 
Richard Kimber said:
Hi John:

I agree that there's a lot of poorly record stuff out there, but IMHO some of the Reference Recordings, MDG, Linn, Harmonia Mundi (for example) discs sound pretty good to me.

- Richard.
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Hi Richard,

I hear you - the virtues I seek (especially the ability to keep vocals and instruments well spaced even when the recording gets complex) apply equally important (if not more so) for complex classical Music passages.

John
 
JohnW said:
Hi Michael,

They are different, I’ve tried to develop a solution that was easier to implement while still offer a significant improvement (I use this word hesitantly - as one mans "step change" is another’s inaudioable difference).

The issue is that the we are talking about the last 5% / 10% improvement, reaping these improvements stretch any definition of Value For Money…

Still people spend crazy money on cables and other accessories; I can put hand on heart and say that by comparisons these MDAC modifications do bring real improvement – and therefore good VFM!

Lets see what JTC and SQ think if they would have happily paid GBP200 for the modifications…

John
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Well, I would have paid GBP200 for the Sovereign+ modifications...

If both solutions are comparable, I can just wait for the MPAX and swap the PSU PCB myself.
 
fusion5 said:
Well, I would have paid GBP200 for the Sovereign+ modifications...

If both solutions are comparable, I can just wait for the MPAX and swap the PSU PCB myself.
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Would be interesting to compare both variants one day :)

Yes, now that I've loosened the screws in your unit its a much simpler task to upgrade the PSU board - I can even talk you trough the procedure over the phone - should take lessthen 10 minutes when you know how :)

Its the PCB updates that take time...

John
 
I'm used to handle computer PCBs and you've already explained the process here on PFM. Besides that there is a nice exploded drawing in the MDAC Service Manual.
 
Plutox said:
John, how about a system of exchange PCBs for those able to DIY that part of it, rather than the difficulties of sending the entire unit to CZ?
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It would then pose the problem that an owner might feel that there original PCB sounded better.... or have some random issue as the sticky relay or some such...

Better to work on a customers "known" good unit...

John
 
fusion5 said:
I'm used to handle computer PCBs and you've already explained the process here on PFM. Besides that there is a nice exploded drawing in the MDAC Service Manual.
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Yes its not hard, only the screws could pose a real issue - then next in "difficulty" ranking would be removing (and reinserting) the front panel Flat-Foil cable (not hard, but could be intimidating for a first time encounter).

John
 
Richard Kimber said:
..... but I believe that if some kit reproduces a complex classical sound well, it will automatically do well with pop/folk/jazz, but not necessarily the other way round.
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I used mdac over 95% of the time playing classical music of all genres and periods, what I found most challenging for hifi equipments is the brass section of an orchestra, when played loud together it is very difficult to maintain the naturalness, a lucid airy metallic sound with warmth in it. The second most challenging is violin solo, particularly the new DDD very analytical recordings, even the equipments are detail enough sometimes it is still difficult to maintain natural and musical (togetherness of hi and lo). :)

I'm not sure whether the statement as quoted above is right or wrong, but I did encounter similar comments every now and then. :)
 
JohnW said:
Hi Richard,

The problem with classical music is more often then not the atrocious recording quality - Deutsche Gramophone DDD recordings where just grating - for me if you where to ask for an example of why I dislike "Digital" Deutsche Gramophone DDD recordings are the first to spring to mind (And some PolyGram – not sure if they used the same recording equipment).

I can remember how Deutsche Gramophone DDD with typical “German” engineering based instance argued about the superiority of there all Digital recording process and suggested that ADD or AAD recordings where somehow inferior – while even a cloth eared 70 year old recording engineer should have been able to hear something was clearly wrong.

I have some "Simple" small scale classical recordings which are stunning - but I'm so fed up with clearly overloading Microphones with clear IMD that I've stayed away from classical recordings accept a select few...

There’s no reason that if well recorded Classical should be any different from music such as the Wailin Jennys I mention earlier.

John
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A large proportion of DG's DDD are indeed rubbish, their 4D series (a variant of DDD) if anyone could still remember is a laughing stock, but a few of their first generation DDD (early 80's made in West Germany) are actually very good albeit very expensive and difficult to find now. As to exemplars of good classical recording, I think most of them (>70%) are ADD, particularly recording of the 60's and 70's, and EMI and DECCA generally has done better than DG. :)
 
JohnW said:
Still people spend crazy money on cables and other accessories;
John
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I was saved by 'The Forum' and bought some studio XLR cables, Van Damme cable -silver plated OFC with Neutric plugs £ 30 for 5M . rather than the £700 boutique ones.
Should be half decent ?
All will be revealed when I get a pair of MIMP'S :D
 
Anybody tried connecting MDAC directly to a QNAP NAS using usb and successfully got it to work with the Music Station application? Would love to know :)
 
ridney said:
Anybody tried connecting MDAC directly to a QNAP NAS using usb and successfully got it to work with the Music Station application? Would love to know :)
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I connected mine to a Synology NAS but the Synology music player was limited.

Now using Windows 7 with JRiver as music player which is much better.

You could route your NAS through a Squeezebox Touch using the NAS as a library- using Triode's app.

http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com is a good resource.
 
Hello John,

JohnW said:
Apparently the latest ASIO Driver has the issues you mentioned (not sure if its not been resolved by now) - however you can rollback to an earlier driver with no issue.

WMP works at any sampling Bit Depth / Frequency normally... But if the MDAC indicates 16 Bits during your tests then that's the reason for your elevated noise floor in your measurements.
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Took me some time. Now with stationary PC on Windows 7 and Samplitude X to produce real 24bit/96kHz test-tones I got quite different results! I think I can sleep better now :). Doesn't look so bad! Seems almost exactly like your graphs, doesn't it?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ff2j9mjlnk15jvg/MDac to Focusrite -60db to -12db.png
As you proposed the much worse results before was most likely the dithering of the signal itself, perhaps plus some noise from power source. Remarkable is that I had then even a USB isolator between MDac and notebook and here on the "big" PC results where much better without it. As you said learning is fun - and it's quite funny that it's possible to measure this low noise with the Focusrite which has more noise inherent itself - just because its mic pre-amp can amplify the -60db signal to -12db.
This is the same procedure with Focusrite looped back to itself - almost 20db louder noise!
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ikney45ai2lhmfw/Focusrite PS-powered loop -60db to -12db.png
So I can conclude that your MDac really is an amazing piece of hardware and must apologize for creating any irritation about that.

Have a good time!
Asphaltradler
 
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