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MDAC First Listen (part 00100110)

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GWM said:
Could an integrated CD mech be used for SACD so sidestepping the proposed opo mod
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GWM,

Nothing would make me happier then to be able to include a SACD drive, but its effectively dead and only avaible to large company who have legacy connections.

Also, the whole idea of the Slot loader is to use a design we have already developed and is available.
 
Rosewind said:
Just went and had a look and listen to the two sets of Carver ALiii. They were dusty and somewhat scruffy looking. One had a dead woofer + a corner of the woofer enclosure had chipped off. The protective foam grilles were in a state of disintegration and were easy to peel off. The foil was generally in fine condition with small marks on one of them, but no punctures. The sound was quite transparent with some bass but I suppose that all woofers need replacement. I had brought a Nap 12 + Snaps + Avondale 260z monoblocks. With the source being my OnePlus One through headphone jack out. Playback was of Flac files: Depeche Mode (Broken), Dylans "Things Have Changed" og Blur from their "Magic Whip".

The seller had changed one woofer, he said but had forgot which one. He would let both sets go for a good price. I have no skills in repair / renovation and my wife hates the look of bulky panel speakers and ML type speakers with a vengeance, so they will not enter my home. And they would of course be too big for my 8 sqmeter -study..

Interesting to listen to Carver ALIIIs under less than ideal circumstances. I had hoped for more bass impact than I got but that could be put down to a lot of causes.

Kind regards Peter
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Peter,

Gosh, these sound very "Dog eared" the last thing you want to purchase is a DIY repaired pair of HiEnd speakers.

I'd imagined a nice tidy pair, avaible for quick sale due to there size!

I bought a pair of Acustats ESL's for under 800Euros and they look almost - the seller wanted a quick sale to make space...
 
PhilCTTE said:
If I recall from the dac bake off at Stevens, his system was very sensitive. We had at one stage the sonos and my Nettop plugged in his front room and it was noted by Steven and others that there was a negative effect to the sound.
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Yes the RF noise injected into the mains circuit of the switching AC PSU's can effect components in an audio system - this not an ideal situation.
 
JohnW said:
GWM,

Nothing would make me happier then to be able to include a SACD drive, but its effectively dead and only avaible to large company who have legacy connections.

Also, the whole idea of the Slot loader is to use a design we have already developed and is available.
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And as used in the Creek is very nice!
 
Some of the latest laptops have very long battery life. I'm fairly certain I've seen 10+ hours quoted. Presumably thats running the screen for 10+ hours too.

So if you were playing music via usb, with the screen off you might get similar duration.

Maybe running without AC power could result in better sound and if you can get 10 hours between charges, might it not be practical to play on battery and charge between listening sessions?
 
These guys live in Mali, when the Islamic fundamentalists moved in ....

Just listening to music results in a public flogging.

So if your belief that Asynch USB is better or worse than SPIDIF or that CD is better or worse than PC.or vinyl. I am sorry but some perspective is required.

There is more to life than the fact that your favourite brand of asparagus is out of stock at Tesco.

Get a grip - enjoy the music, even if your life depends upon it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOValSt7YOY&list=RDBOValSt7YOY&index=1
 
rtrt said:
Some of the latest laptops have very long battery life. I'm fairly certain I've seen 10+ hours quoted. Presumably thats running the screen for 10+ hours too.

So if you were playing music via usb, with the screen off you might get similar duration.

Maybe running without AC power could result in better sound and if you can get 10 hours between charges, might it not be practical to play on battery and charge between listening sessions?
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Battery playback barely seems to improve matters.
 
There have been some terse interchanges recently, but quite frankly I can see why. It is extremely provocative to state something in terms which suggest it is an absolute or incontrovertible truth when in fact it is no more than a matter of personal opinion. It is no surprise that people with a different experience react badly to opinions expressed in this ill considered fashion. Might I suggest that the guilty parties ( you know who you are) reflect on this and moderate their posts accordingly.
( Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if they don't know who they are given that they think it is acceptable to post as I've described in the first place.)
 
And this is my personal experience. I used to have a very well regarded CD player - a Sugden Masterclass and it had been upgraded with a TDA 1541 Double Crown DAC chip, a chip which many still regard as being the most "musical" ever made, especially the Double Crown ones. I sold it because I found that a dedicated audio computer running off a dedicated tri- voltage inear power supply and feeding my Fusion MDAC gave me a significantly better SQ.
 
iansr said:
There have been some terse interchanges recently, but quite frankly I can see why. It is extremely provocative to state something in terms which suggest it is an absolute or incontrovertible truth when in fact it is no more than a matter of personal opinion. It is no surprise that people with a different experience react badly to opinions expressed in this ill considered fashion. Might I suggest that the guilty parties ( you know who you are) reflect on this and moderate their posts accordingly.
( Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if they don't know who they are given that they think it is acceptable to post as I've described in the first place.)
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The tension began when a trade member came along, behaved in an extremely unprofessional manner and started attacking a competitor's products.

My original post on the subject did contain the following disclaimer,

Your mileage may differ. Obvs!
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There are few absolute or incontrovertible truths in audio but my numerous experiences have tended to point in the same direction. Notable exceptions have also been mentioned (Aurender X10, X30). Mark from Item Audio, probably one of the best in the UK for setting up streaming systems, has visited my place twice, including DBO3.

I've compared a lot of options here and I think this gives me enough to express a view based on experimentation. JohnW seems to concur with my findings, at least to a point and has given technical reasons for so doing.

Yours is the only really defensive post apart from our trade member's.

I think a likely explanation for your mileage varying compared to mine would be the TDA 1541 Double Crown DAC chip. I have heard this chip in a couple of well-implemented applications and I would say that it imparts a certain 'character' of its own that isn't really the last word in resolution; to my ears it doesn't seem to resolve percussive actions like plucked strings or brushed cymbals as well as DACS using other chips. It certainly isn't the last word in subtlety as it paints a very big musical picture but with rather broad brush strokes.

The point of all this is that there should be a disc spinning option made available at some stage for those who want it. This should not delay the release of the MDAC2 board as it would be either part of the new chassis to come later or would be in a separate box. I am actually quite surprised by the interest shown in this in the last few pages. Perhaps the novelty of convenience over sound quality is beginning to wear off for some. ;-)

Sugden make some very nice amplifiers.
 
PhilCTTE said:
If I recall from the dac bake off at Stevens, his system was very sensitive. We had at one stage the sonos and my Nettop plugged in his front room and it was noted by Steven and others that there was a negative effect to the sound.

If the opportunity arises I'd like to audition a top CD player against my Auralic Aries.
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Suitable candidates would be the following:

The Creek Evo 50 CD mentioned above. It punches well above its £950 weight.

The Accuphase DP410. This is about the same price as the Resonessence Mirus DAC but you get a top-notch CD transport thrown in for free. It can also be used with streaming devices.

http://www.accuphase.com/model/dp-410.html
 
Seems a waste to spend so much on the internal DAC and output stages of a CD player when using the Mdac. We are seeing more and more dedicated streamers where the build is more hifi like. Better quality components and greater effort to isolate the parts that could cause issues. The main conversation point is how far do you need to take these efforts.

The Auralic streamer bridge solution seems to hit the right market point and fits in my system very nicely. Cost is on the high side , but lots of r&d and work has gone into this product.
 
PhilCTTE said:
If the opportunity arises I'd like to audition a top CD player against my Auralic Aries.
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my Little Dot CDPIII [top end?, I'd not like to comment :)] uses the Philips CD-Pro2LF top loading mech and I have a full Auralic system connected to it, I feel the cd player is better in a musicality sense than the Aries but not by a huge margin.

sorry I don't know all the big words to nail down exactly what's different, but it sounds a bit more involving to me :)
 
JohnW said:
Theoretically when everything has been configured correctly, the data from the PC should be Bit Accurate, identical to the original CD Data.

In reality there are still various facts that can influence the sound, #1 being Clock Jitter.
.......
CD players typically have low noise linear PSU - while PC's etc. have switching power supply's which inject high levels of "RF" energy into the mains circuit, this can find its way into the audio system.

* The HQ full width Chassis with the isolated Digital / Analogue domain PSU will be required for the second galvanic isolation barrier.
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Thanks John for your detail answer. I will give an internal CD a serious thought now.

While I have your attention, I would be grateful of some/any updates on the assembled analogue PCB.

Cheers!
 
jadidih101 said:
Thanks John for your detail answer. I will give an internal CD a serious thought now.

While I have your attention, I would be grateful of some/any updates on the assembled analogue PCB.

Cheers!
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Progress is slow as I'm settling into the new lab, locating components etc, and also as systems are still being brought online, but by the end of this month I'll have the important results.

I split my day between working on the VFET power stage PCB design and working on the testing the MDAC2 PCB, actually I find it helps to split the day as its hard to work non stop in a single project 15/7 its just too taxing on the mind - its "refreshing" to step back and take a break working on something different.

One unexpected problem is that so much of my equipment has gone missing during the shipment back from China, the Chinese Customs seem to have open every single box and many important parts have vanished - its a pain as test fixtures are missing for test equipment rendering them useless etc. It would appear that they forget to load everything back into my container, or re-loaded into someone else's!

E.g I have the Audio precision analysers but the interface cards are missing, or the support shelves for the 19inch Racks... So I can build the Rack frames but have no shelves to support the units!

Also I very carefully package the fragile items, but the customs tock no care during there inspection and items like the display on my Network analyser which I need to measure the Gain and Phase margins of the MDAC2 Analogue stage is smashed...

Just adds delays and stress me as I can ill afford the time, I want to be working on the projects not messing about like this.

Today the 3rd party replacement display has arrive for the Network analyser, so factor 3 to 4 hours lost fitting it and testing etc. (hopefully) not to mention the cost of about US$900! (Which is "Cheap" for Agilent) I feel quite bitter that I'm still paying the "Costs" for working with IAG!

Sorry, I don't often mention the "negative" sides of what I have to battle - its just par of the coarse I guess, the only lasting impact is the project time-scales. I can deal with the problems, it just stress me because of the delays and I'm not happy about the extra unexpected costs.
 
I would like to have cd drive with HQ chasis, I will be ready to pay extra for it. Integrated willl be with best possible connection to dac. Otherwise I need to keep cd player anyway. What is the point of having shelves with cd discs if you dont have a machine where to put them?
 
JohnW said:
Progress is slow as I'm settling into the new lab, locating components etc, and also as systems are still being brought online, but by the end of this month I'll have the important results.
....
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Thanks for the update. Sorry to hear about all the hassle you are facing. I find drinking a good Scotch and an hour or two of good music often helps in these situations. :)

Here's to when you have it all working... Cheers! :)
 
Back from the Lab after installing the replacement display for the analyser - its now up and working once again :)

Today the HDMI Audio extractor arrived, the PCB is surprisingly well designed.

Tomorrow I'm make some quick measurements of its clock jitter just for kicks... this will give me an idea of what we are dealing with. I don't expect too much.

Seeing the positive interest I'll work towards adding the slot loader as an option to the full sized Chassis.

Also, I'll add a second internal digital expansion connector so that we have the option to add HDMI (etc) at a later date to the full sized chassis. I'm thinking of a blanking plate on the rear of the full sized chassis where the user can upgrade there unit as options become available - this way we can add the latest and greatest digital interface 5 years down the line at little extra cost....
 
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