Labour Leader: Keir Starmer VII
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Spraggons Den
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“The Labour Party was a broad church coalition from its foundations with trade unionists coming together with socialists, Liberals, and social reformers to found the Labour Party as a voice for labour. It was always a broad church.” John McDonnell
Spraggons Den
pfm Member
I don’t think you will get that slogan past the NEC/marketing department.
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TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Charlie’s a naughty Tory. So is his ex-wife.
Let’s not forget 5 Tory MPs inc his ex-wife were sanctioned, 3 suspended from Parliament, 2 forced to apologise to the Commons for attempting to influence the judiciary in matters relating to Elphicke. They were told by The Lord Chief Justice their actions were improper and flew in the face of the separation of powers between politicians and the judiciary.
This is very serious, going far beyond an individual Tory MP imprisoned for sexual offences. It’s indicative of a prevailing attitude in that party that judges can be utilised for political ends through threats to their independence and threats to break existing laws. Witness the unlawful closure of Parliament, thinly veiled threats to named judges made by Tory newspaper owners and threatening to break international law.
Let’s not forget 5 Tory MPs inc his ex-wife were sanctioned, 3 suspended from Parliament, 2 forced to apologise to the Commons for attempting to influence the judiciary in matters relating to Elphicke. They were told by The Lord Chief Justice their actions were improper and flew in the face of the separation of powers between politicians and the judiciary.
This is very serious, going far beyond an individual Tory MP imprisoned for sexual offences. It’s indicative of a prevailing attitude in that party that judges can be utilised for political ends through threats to their independence and threats to break existing laws. Witness the unlawful closure of Parliament, thinly veiled threats to named judges made by Tory newspaper owners and threatening to break international law.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
The Labour Party has adopted Tory fiscal rules, promised to hold the doors wide open to privatisation, promises spending cuts and austerity, supports genocide, invites far right rape apologists into the party and has a leader who openly admires Thatcher and supposedly educated people on here still vote for them because they believe there is no alternative
No wonder this country is going to shit
No wonder this country is going to shit
notaclue
pfm Member
"The engine room of national renewal is around this table."
I like that. Impressive.
Sir Keir had an unfortunate slip-up over Elfick, but I feel he's back on track by gathering the engine room of national renewal around a table*.
* Whilst technically it does appear to be multiple tables pushed together, we know what he means.
I like that. Impressive.
Sir Keir had an unfortunate slip-up over Elfick, but I feel he's back on track by gathering the engine room of national renewal around a table*.
* Whilst technically it does appear to be multiple tables pushed together, we know what he means.
Seanm
pfm Member
As ever, I don’t understand why you adopt this kind of less-deceived, Isn’t-Keir-Cringe tone towards people and policies you basically approve of and support. I mean is Keir’s team not the engine of renewal? Is this not a smart and good bit of campaigning? What’s your problem here?
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
That puff piece is saying much the same thing as Houchen has been saying to justify funnelling public money into private pockets in his Teesside Delelopment plans
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Labour Friends of Israel Power Delivers. Take it from the people of Gaza
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
Tony L
Administrator
”ANNOUNCEMENT: I am NOT defecting to the Labour Party. I have policies.” Count Binface.
ks.234
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Jubal
pfm Member
You are being deliberately obtuse. There is an alternative, it’s just a wasted vote in many constituencies. The decision is the lesser of two evils, despite what one’s heart might want.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
“Obtuse:: lacking sharpness or quickness of sensibility or intellect : insensitive, stupid”
Another one who can’t engage in an argument without making it personal by using personal jibes, petty insult and snark.
The truth is that at the time of my post, the suggestion on the Neoliberalism thread that there is an alternative to neoliberalism was being met with comments about living in a fairy tale, utopia, stuff about unicorns, castles, Stalin, Scargill, the SWP, Putinism etc etc etc. as well as a straight forward “NO” to the suggestion that there are alternatives to voting for neoliberalism.
Since my post there have been more sensible people who have joined the thread, but at the time it was dominated by very angry personal and aggressive posts against the idea of not voting for more neoliberalism.
I am not the one being, er, obtuse here.
As for the lesser evil argument, it is imo a nonsense from both a logical and a historical perspective and from any analysis of what the Labour party itself now stands for. First, voting for a lesser evil is still voting for evil and that evil, given a 5 year mandate, is still going to do what evil does, which is do more evil. Second, we have had a decline in social and economic justice since the 70’s, a decline that voting for the lesser evil has failed to stop. Anything Blair achieved was offset by further decline, education was improved temporarily, but academisation sowed the seeds of long term decline, health was improved temporarily, but PFI added to the debt burden and long term decline and Blair‘s ideological focus on paying down government debt increased private debt, as it always does, which with Gordon Browns light touch regulation that added to Thatcher’s deregulation of the financial markets, helped deliver 2008
Finally, Labour has spelled out it’s neoliberal intentions quite openly. It has adopted Tory Fiscal rules that constrain public spending as a matter of ideology, but has made them “ironclad”. They will be worse than the Tories. It has said it will hold the doors of the NHS “wide open” to the private sector, promising to take privatisation further than even the Tories would dare. Labour has promised more deregulation and has prioritised paying off government Debt as a priority over public investment. Any promises to help workers, strengthen unions, invest in Green initiatives, immigration and any other pledge Starmer made to get elected have been broken.
In addition there is the small matter of Labour welcoming rape apologist MPs from the far right of the Tory Party with open arms and last, but not least, Labour is a supporter and promoter of genocide. Labour supports the daily massacre of women, children and innocent civilians.
You can vote against your “heart” and for this evil if you like, but it is not me who is the one being “obtuse”.
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Jubal
pfm Member
Err, ok.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
Labour has predicated all it’s spending promises on growth, but as Richard Murphy notes this morning, there is no growth, very little is predicted, and Labour has no plans to create growth
”I am not suggesting that growth is necessarily a good thing. Nor am I commenting on the accuracy of the forecast - although it seems to be consistent with many others. Instead I am noting that if Labour is going to base the whole of its promise to the electorate on growth then it had better start talking fairly quickly about what it is going to do to deliver it, which so far it has totally failed to do.
A wave of euphoria at the Tories leaving office is not going to happen. Nor is that sentiment going to release a pent up desire to invest in the country.
Labour's promise to balance the books is an anti-growth policy.
Its cancellation of its green investment programme undermines its desire for growth.
So too has limitation of its programme to support employee rights limited the growth potential of the economy - because people living in fear do not deliver growth.
Nothing it has said or done suggests how it will change the Tory pattern of economic management that has produced the forecast the OECD has made. In that case there is nothing to any of its promises. I wish it were otherwise”
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
TBF I think we need t consider what it is we are growing, and more to the point, what we are not.
You could in theory close down a hospital (a cost to government) and hand it over to a private concern (a profit) which would count positively in the GDP growth figures, but is that a good thing?
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