HS.2
- Thread starter Roger Adams
- Start date
billo
pfm Member
So why do they keep on talking about the extra 20 min. you can spend in Birmingham?
If BJ really wants to "Level Up" (Christ, I hate that phrase) the north, then how about subsidising the rail travelers up here to the same amount as those in the capital?
NPR, HS3 or whatever you want to call it, is only a concept at the moment, with no actual route or active detailed design in place, or any act of Parliament getting anywhere near being drafted.
There’s a long way to go before it reaches that stage, never mind construction actually starting.
HS2 on the other hand, has been underway for just over 10 years, with the first stage approved by an act of Parliament, full detailed design and specification completed and actual spades in the soil construction and preparatory work, well underway.
It makes no sense whatsoever to pause the work for 10 years or so and waste all the effort and money, while NPR catches up.
The sooner NPR is upgraded from the conceptual stage, to a full, active project, the better; but that shouldn’t be at the expense of the vital upgrade HS2 will bring.
There’s a long way to go before it reaches that stage, never mind construction actually starting.
HS2 on the other hand, has been underway for just over 10 years, with the first stage approved by an act of Parliament, full detailed design and specification completed and actual spades in the soil construction and preparatory work, well underway.
It makes no sense whatsoever to pause the work for 10 years or so and waste all the effort and money, while NPR catches up.
The sooner NPR is upgraded from the conceptual stage, to a full, active project, the better; but that shouldn’t be at the expense of the vital upgrade HS2 will bring.
deanf
pfm Member
The benefits of HS2 is that it deals with capacity and creates a standardised the rail track with mainland Europe, hence the EU funding. It would’ve sent quite a clear message to our ex’s on the mainland if the PM said we don’t now need it, as well as sending another to the Northern Powerhouse.
Now what we’re we saying about extending it to Scotland and building a bridge to Northern Ireland?
Now what we’re we saying about extending it to Scotland and building a bridge to Northern Ireland?
Both.
If nothing is done to significantly increase capacity on the WCML, by moving all the long distance inter-city trains services onto HS2, there won’t be enough seats or even standing room to cope.
It’s bad enough now at the peak times, but with increasing demand, within the next 10 to 15 years they’ll have to restrict the numbers who wish to travel either by limiting ticket availability, making it reservation only, or increasing fares to price control the demand. Probably a combination of all three.
Taking those fast inter-city trains off the classic rail network will free up a significant amount of spare capacity to allow more local, regional and commuter trains to run, as well as freeing up spare paths for more freight trains.
The midlands and the north will benefit from this, as much, if not more than the southern section of the WCML.
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Going on about speed and journey time savings are the result of very poorly informed media and politicians, as well as a badly managed PR effort from HS2 ltd.
Even if they’re going to harp on about the time savings, why only mention the smallest time saving between London and Birmingham?
London to Manchester is expected to save 1 hour, which is almost half the current journey time.
cooky1257
pfm Member
How does freeing up capacity north to south increase capacity east to west?
Barrymagrec
pfm Member
It`s going ahead and there will be a minister in charge - is Grayling available?
Stuart Frazer
pfm Member
That was my first thought when they mentioned a new Minister for HS2, Grayling! Now that would be a disaster....
In part it doesn't and isn't meant to.
They are two separate capacity problems that both have to be addressed; HS2 deals with N-S capacity and NPR is meant to deal with E-W and local northern capacity.
However, by removing the N-S inter-city services from those local lines around Birmingham, Manchester and Leeds, it provides space to increase the number of local and regional trains in their place.
The north of England E-W problem requires a lot of investment, but HS2 will most likely carry some of that cost burden by freeing up capacity and making some sections of the new line available for use by NPR.
Roger Adams
pfm Member
I get the impression that "capacity" will be the least of our problems post Brexit. It is not as if the overwhelming need will be fast and easy access to the EU is it? We got rid of that a fortnight ago.
We have Crossrail, Eurotunnel and now this whilst a large number of our long standing roads are falling to bits and the general maintenance of our existing infrastructure is way below "substandard". I was also under the impression that the NHS was getting a major influx of funds from the British taxpayer as opposed to American Pharmaceutical Companies.
We have Crossrail, Eurotunnel and now this whilst a large number of our long standing roads are falling to bits and the general maintenance of our existing infrastructure is way below "substandard". I was also under the impression that the NHS was getting a major influx of funds from the British taxpayer as opposed to American Pharmaceutical Companies.
Roger Adams
pfm Member
Real cycle lanes or what Westminster determines to count as them? On my way to work I frequently see cyclists having to dodge in and out of the cars parked on the so called cycle lanes.
cutting42
Arrived at B4 Hacker Ergo
Ok, so that makes three maybe even four of us who get it. I have been beating the capacity/paths drum for 10 years and it irritates the crap out of me that HS2 marketing and the politicians have such a low opinion of public intelligence that they have been only taking about speed because they think that is the only statistic that us poor proles can comprehend.
Hopefully now the decision is made they can continue the work at speed.
Roger Adams
pfm Member
Call me selfish by all means but I personally would like to get to see a GP within 72 hours.
thebigfredc
pfm Member
Selfish.
SteveS1
I heard that, pardon?
Crace on Johnson's record with his vanity projects.
"Boris rather skirted over the money. Such a grubby subject. One wholly beneath a man of his substance. Yes, the project was already 11 years late and £80bn over budget before a single mile of track had been laid. But that was a mere detail. He would sack the current board of HS2 Ltd and replace them with himself and Grant Shapps. With Chris Grayling as chief executive. All experts in money management. From now on, the best way to look at HS2 was not as one £110bn and rising project, but three separate £38bn projects. There. He had slashed costs by a third already. Now was the time to make the UK a country fit for the 23rd century. Which was the estimated completion date."
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...detail-stand-in-way-of-latest-vanity-projects
"Boris rather skirted over the money. Such a grubby subject. One wholly beneath a man of his substance. Yes, the project was already 11 years late and £80bn over budget before a single mile of track had been laid. But that was a mere detail. He would sack the current board of HS2 Ltd and replace them with himself and Grant Shapps. With Chris Grayling as chief executive. All experts in money management. From now on, the best way to look at HS2 was not as one £110bn and rising project, but three separate £38bn projects. There. He had slashed costs by a third already. Now was the time to make the UK a country fit for the 23rd century. Which was the estimated completion date."
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...detail-stand-in-way-of-latest-vanity-projects
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Well, if you're in Crewe and your GP is in London, you'll be able to see them 30 minutes faster than at present.