Have loudspeaker prices gone out of kilter?

[S-Man]

Great, we found a thread topic that everyone agrees on!
(Which of course, will provoke somebody to argue )

On top of the above points, I think we have to accept that here in the UK we have got relatively poorer in the last 10 to 20 years. On my recent trip to the USA I reckon costs were about twice as much as 20 years ago - relative to the UK (excepting energy). I suppose this is more less covered by the exchange rate: used to be $2 = £1, now it's parity (if you take the mandatory 20% tip into account).

 

[kensalriser]

Also the point made about the Veblen effect. This has happened with almost all high end/luxury products. There's a whole new strata of rich people globally that didn't exist a generation ago. When your worth is in the tens or scores of millions and above it doesn't really matter if something you want is a thousand or ten thousand pounds. In fact, you'd probably prefer it to be ten thousand.

 

[Sloop John B]

Reading through my library subscriptions today - radio times and stereophile




Hard to know which is sadder.

.sjb

 

[regafan]

I've seen all hifi component prices increase since 2008 when I got back into hifi. I paid £59 new for a Denon dl110. Look at the price now. Sensible manufacturers are making budget components to cater for young people and first time hifi peeps at the start of their hifi career. This is a very good thing. Most hifi shows Ive been to in UK are largely full of older people- nothing wrong with that- I'm not a youngster myself but you need a constant throughput of age ranges to keep the damn thing going!

 

[Muttley2]

I've just seen the price of PMC speakers new fact upgrade crossovers. Talk about eye opener.

 

[Folkman]

Bought my PMC MB2se about 5 years ago. They were £19,000 then although I did get some discount. They are now £31,000 ! So im glad i bought them then.

 

[Darren]

If the second hand/classic audio market didn’t exist I’d just buy something like a pair of Neumann KH310 and call it a day there.

Even then we are talking virtually four large plus stands!! I get it that power amps are included but even so, these just aren't a cheap option to my mind.

 

[Darren]

The same VFM is still available in audio, it's just not called HiFi anymore. It's called pro audio.

Could you please give a couple of examples, because I just don't see it. Anything larger than teeny desk top actives is bloody expensive The larger Genelecs , Neumann etc are far from cheap.

 

[Tony L]

Even then we are talking virtually four large plus stands!! I get it that power amps are included but even so, these just aren't a cheap option to my mind.

I wasn’t suggesting ‘cheap’, just something a heck of a lot more affordable than trying to find modern equivalents of my current system. Bear in mind the current equivalent to my turntable is £8k (124DD), my speakers £30k+(Canturburys)! I view these as utterly ludicrous prices, prices I’d never pay, but that is just the modern high-end audio market.

 

[Woodface]

Wow, just seen what PMC are charging for the crossover upgrade. But they do come with a pair of white gloves….

 

[Woodface]

£4k for quality active speakers is relatively good value. 2nd hand Benchmark DAC2 & you have the basis of a killer system for a lot less than otherwise.

 

[Monitor Gold 10]

The value's is in used I think, even ex-dem.

Agreed. My Monitor Gold Ten 3LZ were £40 back in 2006.

I have auditioned other loudspeakers since then. To my ears nothing modern touches them.

Same for other vintage gear. There are some bargains to be had, however I reckon there's some snobbery to be overcome with regards to what are considered 'budget' brands.

 

[Pinky]

Wow, just seen what PMC are charging for the crossover upgrade. But they do come with a pair of white gloves….

As did my £79 pair (new) of Q Acoustics 2010i's in 2016

 

[colasblue]

Could you please give a couple of examples, because I just don't see it. Anything larger than teeny desk top actives is bloody expensive The larger Genelecs , Neumann etc are far from cheap.

You need to get over your "form factor" bias and go with a satellites plus sub arrangement.

The entry(ish) level 8020's plus 7040 sub is under two grand and in SQ is "up there" with more traditional setups at 10K+

Further up the chain would be something like the 8341's with 7360 sub at around £6k which is about a much as most people would need and what I'm looking at to replace a Naim 6 pack system in a moderate sized room.

Of course they do have their £50K top of the range 8381 point source monitors but there are going to be very few people who need either that SPL or actually have the space to accommodate them, but even £50K for dac, amps & speakers seems quite reasonable compared with some of the speakers which have been discussed so far on this thread.

 

[gez]

Not only speakers but many things hifi has gone through the roof.

Krell K-300i for example. Around £7k when released, now circa £12k. No way to blame inflation (even with this years hike) to account for that rise!

 

[kensalriser]

I looked up the first pair of serious speakers I owned - Royd Apex. I bought them nearly new in the early 90s, but the new price in 1990 was £495, which is £1164 inflation adjusted today. Scarcely believable, they'd be twice that now.

 

[mikebirtill]

To my eyes, and I now view myself as an outsider with no real connection to new audio, the whole thing has descended into Veblen goods. If the second hand/classic audio market didn’t exist I’d just buy something like a pair of Neumann KH310 and call it a day there. Maybe MEGs if I was feeling especially flush. The two channel audio market is overpriced because it is tiny and chasing an ever-declining and ageing demographic, hence the death spiral of less stuff for more money. Young folk coming through are far better served with computer and pair of Genlecs or whatever, and a SL1200 if they wanted to collect vinyl. Someone charging many £thousands for a simple MDF box with a couple of drivers in it just seems absurd to me, but it is the shape of the modern market. Obviously there is a tier below for kit produced in China etc, and some of that is very good value, e.g. it is hard to knock Kef LS50s, but the “high-end” is pretty ludicrous IMHO. I’m done! My future hi-fi has already been made, likely decades ago, and I own most of it already.

Exactly this - a sl1200 is as much turntable that most people need. I have one in my second system in my dining room and it gets more use than my notts analog in my main system. Do i notice the difference - not really. If i was staring agin, Id go active - loads of really good speakers at all price points from the home and pro studio market. Ive gone down the road of buying old Linn speakers and electronics for my hifi (bar the atc cd/pre/dac in the main room) Its all available at cheap prices and the stuff is really well built and just doesnt go wrong . Yes there may be something that sounds slightly better but the linn stuff is reliable and just works. Just for a different perspective - i love my workshop system - it boogies and sounds great - its a echo dot , into a amazon chip amp powered by an old laptop power supply and a pair of jbl control ones wired in audiophile (not) 1mm2 mains flex. It sounds bloody marvellous playing Spotify or 6music. Cost? £120. I had the cable and laptop power supply. If everything else went due to a fire or other disaster I could live with the £120 system

 

[shug4476]

Hifi is an industry in which price competition is virtually non-existent. It is governed by cartels, price fixing agreements, and restrictive practice. It is little wonder that prices bear no relation to cost.

I buy almost nothing new in this hobby.