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Has Rishi lost his marbles?

As it hasn't been noted already: Elgin didn't ship the stuff back to England "for the Nation"; he did so to decorate his house (and there's a lot of vagueness around the import fees that would normally have applied to such a large collection of artworks.. then, as now, it's clearly good for a chap to have chums). It was only when he lost a considerable chunk of his fortune in the Napoleonic Wars that Elgin sold the sculptures to the new British Museum... for a very generous fee (as above: chap, chums).

Unlike other institutions that have done the decent thing recently, the British Museum is hamstrung by legislation: it is legally prohibited from repatriating anything in its collection without permission from the Government, and with the Tories in charge there's no hope.
 
Nero said:
As far as I understand, the deal is for the British Museum to make, not the government. There seems to be a reasonable dialogue between the BM and the Greek parties, and a scheme involving rotating loans and access to other artefacts is being discussed.
Some would say it’s the thin end of the wedge, but shirley, a sensible chat is the way forward.
Only problem is that George Osborne is involved somewhere.

It does seem odd that the Acropolis Museum has all the Greek pieces in a wonderful presentation of the remaining frieze, and the rest is in a very dull gallery in London. It’s not as if they’ll bolt it all back on to the Parthenon itself.
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The British government bought the marbles from Elgin/Bruce then gave them to the BM in trust so it's down to the government to take the decision to return them not the BM.

Elgin defended his actions in a pamphlet Memorandum on the Subject of the Earl of Elgin's Pursuits in Greece, published in 1810.[24] On the recommendation of a British parliamentary select committee, the marbles were purchased by the British government in 1816 for £35,000,[24]considerably below their cost to Elgin (estimated at £75,000), and transferred in trust to the British Museum, where they went on display in 1817.[25]
 
KrisW said:
As it hasn't been noted already: Elgin didn't ship the stuff back to England "for the Nation"; he did so to decorate his house (and there's a lot of vagueness around the import fees that would normally have applied to such a large collection of artworks.. then, as now, it's clearly good for a chap to have chums). It was only when he lost a considerable chunk of his fortune in the Napoleonic Wars that Elgin sold the sculptures to the new British Museum... for a very generous fee (as above: chap, chums).

Unlike other institutions that have done the decent thing recently, the British Museum is hamstrung by legislation: it is legally prohibited from repatriating anything in its collection without permission from the Government, and with the Tories in charge there's no hope.
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The guy was a thief pure and simple also Elgin flogged the marbles to the uk for £35k he walked away from an offer of £30k then went crawling back for the other £5k which I'm sure was a lot of money back then.

£35,000 is worth £4,207,467.81 today.

During 1815 Elgin became embroiled in the Tweddell remains affair, a controversy over the possessions of John Tweddell, a classical scholar who had died in 1799 in Athens. Elgin was accused of having appropriated some of Tweddell's papers after his death, during his term as British ambassador in Constantinople. Some of Tweddell's papers had been destroyed in a fire and others lost at sea. The remaining papers were misplaced when Elgin arranged for them to be sent back to England. The matter was settled in late 1816 with the return of some of the items to Tweddell's family.[33][34][35]
 
Barrymagrec said:
Is it worth pissing of a smallish but generally friendly nation just to big himself up to the tory right wing?

www.bbc.co.uk

Greece denies promising not to raise Parthenon Sculptures on UK visit

No. 10 cancelled a meeting between the UK and Greek PMs after comments to the BBC about the sculptures.
www.bbc.co.uk
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Nope, it’s a smallish nation but with the EU right behind it. Says a lot about global britain and it’s relevance on the world stage nowadays that the Greek PM chose to meet Starmer first.
 
kensalriser said:
How much of Britain's cultural history currently resides in other countries do you think?
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The bloody yanks stole London Bridge, ffs. They should send it back without delay!

The Elgin Marbles are really a rather shabby bunch of old stones, entirely without context and utterly incomprehensible in their vast hall in the BM. I have little doubt that they would be far more interesting and informative back where they belong.

Elgin was a Harrovian. My late headmaster stated that the greatest concentration of old Etonians could be found in the Palace of Westminster, whilst that of Harrovians could be found in Her (late) Majesty's Prison estate.
 
Yeah we should deffo give them back. Imagine the furore here if the Romans had half inched Stonehenge during their occupation and put it on display in Rome.

The episode reminds me of Alexi Sayles take on zoos: people always justify the cruelty of animals in zoos by saying they are for the kids - let’s be clear children in central London have no more right to see a lion or tiger than the offspring of the Massimara have of visiting a Chelsea pensioner.

There are stacks of Easter Island sautés in the BM and a load of things from Abyssinia and of course the Rosetta Stone. All should be repatriated to their native countries and the building used as shelter for the capitals homeless people.
And whilst we are in the zone, the jocks can have the Stone of Scoon back n all if they are still banging on about that.
 
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Spraggons Den said:
Yeah we should deffo give them back. Imagine the furore here if the Romans had half inched Stonehenge during their occupation and put it on display in Rome.

The episode reminds me of Alexi Sayles take on zoos: people always justify the cruelty of animals in zoos by saying they are for the kids - let’s be clear children in central London have no more right to see a lion or tiger than the offspring of the Massimara have of visiting a Chelsea pensioner.

Theres stacks of Easter Island sautés in the BM and a load of things from Abyssinia and of course the Rosetta Stone. All should be repatriated to their native countries and the building used as shelter for the capitals homeless. The jocks can have the Stone of Scoon back n all if they are still banging on about that.
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Oh we've had the real Stone here for decades now. 😉
 
it seems like Rishi may be making some questionable moves. Pissing off a friendly nation just to impress the Tory right wing? That's a bit much, isn't it? Maybe he needs to rethink his strategy.
 
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