Future of CD; A worthless pile of plastic, or ... ?

[Whaleblue]

I should have said most rock & pop,

Well, I guess I only really like a small proportion of new (or old) music, so I could say I don't like most music.

It would be an odd way of looking at things perhaps.

Anyway, my point is that "What I don't like" does not equate to TRASH.

I'm still not a fan of Wagner.

 

[Music freak]

Well there's Bryn Terfel and and there's Bryn Terfel.

If you can find his met Ring cycle for 50p do let me know (don't think it's ever come out on cd has it?)

IMHO the big question is ..."In any case, who would want it?"
After collecting about 15 Wagner Ring Cycles,I consider the performances recorded at the Met's most recent try at producing Wagner's Ring, released on DVD and Blu -ray...is . best left forgotten . Terfel's attempt at Wotan, was lacking in stature , both regarding his 'half- baked character acting and vocally . To actually see as well as hear a hailed singer, taking cheap short cuts in vocal technique to get through a role ; is quite alarming. Seeming to appear vocally "tired" at certain points as well producing sound "physically-out the side of his mouth" thereby causing lack of vocal focus. Leaving people with a firm belief, the character of Wotan and its particular vocal demands 'are one size -just too big' for Terfel's own voice qualities and range.' Here - one hears constantly from Terfel - the lack of expected proper central axis & gravity , especially with such a particular role as Wotan ( a operatic Mt Everest point) demands.

Plus The entire production is coupled "or crippled" with a soprano as Brunnhilde that was 'essaying ' her role which extend across 3 of the 4 parts of the Ring - for the first time.
In the relative short time span, since that Ring was actually produced on stage...little wonder...she is now doing Annie Oakley in musical comedy productions of things like Annie Get Your Gun". With what 'that suggests'
I do not need to say any more....

 

[awkwardbydesign]

I do not listen to TRASH music i.e rock ,pop.

What has that to do with downloading?

 

[Music freak]

To trust anything related to computers for your music collections in a total reliance - (non physical) way....is walking a insecure tight rope ..
Just this afternoon , for instance...playing with a TV storage hard drive, I accidently pressed the wrong button.....and wiped a few programs I had recorded, to watch.
Nothing serious!

Already in the past , we have seen computer- retrieval cataloguing and storage programs gradually get changed , modified or made obsolete . Causing groups of providers to admit apologetic to others , the situation had been misjudged...when they used some particular program and information once available in 'physical copy 'is now forever gone.

Imagine appealing to some computer programming company by saying : "Hey Mister, can you find a way to get my missing stored and brought downloaded music collection- back?"

 

[Tony L]

To trust anything related to computers for your music collections in a total reliance - (non physical) way....is walking a insecure tight rope ..
Just this afternoon , for instance...playing with a TV storage hard drive, I accidently pressed the wrong button.....and wiped a few programs I had recorded, to watch.
Nothing serious!

Already in the past , we have seen computer- retrieval cataloguing and storage programs gradually get changed , modified or made obsolete . Causing groups of providers to admit apologetic to others , the situation had been misjudged...when they used some particular program and information once available in 'physical copy 'is now forever gone.

Imagine appealing to some computer programming company by saying : "Hey Mister, can you find a way to get my missing stored and brought downloaded music collection- back?"

Anyone with a computer should have a good tested backup strategy, arguably they should have two. As such deletion shouldn't be an issue as you just grab your backup and restore the missing data.

The format thing is safe as long as you stick to lossess compression and open-source formats such as Apple Lossless or FLAC. There will always be software available from a whole range of sources able to decode these files back to the original uncompressed .wav or to any other format that may emerge. They are as safe as say .pdf files or .jpg etc, an industry standard.

The real risk as I see it is the potential as the major labels continue to fail due to the rise of music theft and bad copyright legislation that a lot of the world's most significant music finds itself without a real long-term custodian. The rise of the 50 year EU copyright "public domain" CDs and vinyl highlights perfectly how quality falls through the floor when anyone and their pet hamster are aloud to release anything. The sound quality of the majority of these releases is just terrible be they needledrops, copies of cassettes or just rips of the official CD with the EQ idiot-mangled to disguise the source. This is my main fear and why IMHO any serious fan of jazz or classical should be buying their lifetime supply of classic-era music now. I'm sure in the future it will always be possible to find a nice mastering of the big ticket stuff like Kind Of Blue, Time Out, A Love Supreme etc, but if you want to pick around at say the lesser known albums from Lou Donaldson, Sonny Criss, Paul Chambers or whoever then once the majors are no more you may find all that is available is some shit quality public domain pirate that hasn't been within 200 miles of a master tape, if that. The last time I looked at Spotify, which is admittedly years ago (I refuse to support it as it pays musos so badly) it was riddled with "public domain" pirates, so definitely don't assume streaming fees buys good mastering or legitimacy.

 

[Lee T]

I do not listen to TRASH music i.e rock ,pop.

Love a bit of trashy rock me

This will really grate (my troll of the day)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xd-q6xIUMjg

Remember, play it loud & proud, air guitar is essential

 

[davidsrsb]

One thing about CDs and locally stored files is that you can generally move around the world with them. Depending on streaming can make for surprises when you try to listen in a different country, with conflicting licence agreements.

 

[Tony L]

One thing about CDs and locally stored files is that you can generally move around the world with them. Depending on streaming can make for surprises when you try to listen in a different country, with conflicting licence agreements.

Indeed. As technology advances this just gets better and better. I have a 128GB iPhone which means I tend to have a pretty large subset of my favourite masterings in lossless format in my pocket wherever I go. Once we get to phone or tablet technology capable of storing terabytes being able to carry ones entire music collection everywhere becomes a possibility. I'm really pleased this technology is emerging whilst I'm still in my early 50s as by the time I get to sit dribbling in an old folks home I can have every piece of music I give a damn about with me in superb quality as long as I hunt it all down now whilst it is still easily available. I'm convinced buying and ripping the best CD masterings now is the best future music strategy.

My only concern as someone who loves actually playing the CDs themselves, I just like the items, is how long CD transports will be available. I suspect they have many years ahead yet, but they are not like turntables or tube amos in that some enthusiast can't knit them in a garden shed for a niche market. Optical transports are way beyond the capability of even companies such as Rega, Naim, Rotel etc which is why so many machines these days regardless of cost are fitted with cheap computer-grade transports until you get to the real top-end Teac Esoteric range and maybe some of the better Yamahas etc. Buying a seriously good transport is definitely on my 'to do' list, I'd very much like to own something that has a 20+ year lifespan. I'd like SACD capabilities too as I've accumulated a surprising number so far!

PS Currently listening to a 1986 Japanese Verve home market CD of Bill Evans Trio 65 via the Leak and 149s and it sounds absolutely superb!

 

[mercalia]

One thing about CDs and locally stored files is that you can generally move around the world with them. Depending on streaming can make for surprises when you try to listen in a different country, with conflicting licence agreements.

well a very heavy box you will need to take. When I condensed my 8 boxes of dvds into 2 ( dvds into simple poly sleeves ) they weighed quite a bit. Not practical to incl the library cases - Put them in recycle bags and they weighed A LOT

 

[pqpq]

Like many, a squeezebox put paid to my CD listening days, and I can't imagine ever going back. My 5000 or so CDs are all boxed up and in the loft, but they'll come out again when I get my listening room sorted, but that's not going to be anytime soon as it's currently a derelict outbuilding...

Most of my CDs are essentially worthless, and since storage is no problem for me I won't be getting rid.

However I do have quite a number which are worth more than buttons, and I have toyed with the idea of selling them on the basis that I'll probably never play them again. I suspect that sloth will get the better of me though..

I don't buy the analogy with vinyl though. Unlike vinyl, the content of a CD can be perfectly and easily stored and accessed, and while some of my CDs are quite nice as artifacts, most of them are horrible. My vinyl on the other hand is a joy to use, and I do still play it.

 

[Disbeliever]

Well, I guess I only really like a small proportion of new (or old) music, so I could say I don't like most music.

It would be an odd way of looking at things perhaps.

Anyway, my point is that "What I don't like" does not equate to TRASH.

I'm still not a fan of Wagner.

Nor am I ,much too long

 

[mercalia]

Well, I guess I only really like a small proportion of new (or old) music, so I could say I don't like most music.

It would be an odd way of looking at things perhaps.

Anyway, my point is that "What I don't like" does not equate to TRASH.

I'm still not a fan of Wagner.

The trouble with some opera and Wagner is that the singers dont sing the good tune but warble around it like a big jelly and the tune is left to the orchestra? I would be happy with listening to opera if they didn't have any singers in them

 

[Vinniemac]

This is the cd which opened the door to Wagner for me 20 years ago - George Szell and the Ckeveland Orchestra playing orchestral excerpts only. Was only five quid when I bought it, though.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000026UP0/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21

 

[Whaleblue]

This is the cd which opened the door to Wagner for me 20 years ago - George Szell and the Ckeveland Orchestra playing orchestral excerpts only. Was only five quid when I bought it, though.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000026UP0/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21

Thanks. I actually bought this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0000042H4/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21

...over a year ago. I do plan to give it a real go sometime.

Honestly.

 

[Vinniemac]

Try the Szell and the CLEVELAND Orchestra (d'oh!) on Tidal if it's on. One hour as opposed to fifteen, plus there's no Hans Hotter (well past his best by the time he sang Walkure for Solti).

 

[Whaleblue]

Thanks, I'll try to remember to do so.

 

[Minio]

It's still easier to buy a cd than do a download!

 

[Robert]

Lots of cheap CDs around and it's a great time for buying.

I echo Tony's point about the focus on finding good masters and that the streaming services cannot be relied upon here. Much of the content is clearly inferior because they've used a dodgy source file.

I'm certainly not against streaming, but if I like something a lot I tend to seek out a good quality CD or LP copy.

 

[Music freak]

The trouble with some opera and Wagner is that the singers dont sing the good tune but warble around it like a big jelly and the tune is left to the orchestra? I would be happy with listening to opera if they didn't have any singers in them

Your comment is like saying "I like to hear an orchestra playing ....as long as no musical instruments are used."

As a fierce opera lover, I must say though, you are correct in some aspects.

It is a accepted axiom :that ... in the likes of French or Italian Opera, the singer appears to be dictating to the orchestra' next step /or the next bar of music etc.
In Wagner for example, it is the orchestra not the singer(s) that is reflecting and registering the plot / its situation at that point of the opera/ and suggesting just exactly where it is finally heading.

Some people forget a properly trained human voice -( a musical instrument, in itself) within its proscribed range- is more capable of a wider tonal inflection range than any physically made musical instrument- object..

I am not surprised at Tony L's comments regarding the dross material which he also came across and found in shop bargain bins etc as he travel- hunts , looking to fill parts and gaps in his CD collection with quality material that will stand the 'test of time'.
The mention of Bryn Terfel - finally is a classic example of artists -only too ready to not "knuckle down and stay completely a serious artist" -with some of the content he releases ,...which , is now causing devaluation of his artistry,

Some of the great mirthful moments at friends' music gatherings sharing vinyl & cd material - is to play bad decisions of such operatic artists attempting to do 'crossover' and Broadway etc. Usually denoted by 'stiff as a board' vocal delivery and continual monotony, if one surf- samples : jumping across various tracks on such discs.
P.S Luciano Pavarotti's soundtrack recording for the film flop "Yes Georgio" he made . The male classic - equivalent ( almost akin to the famous Florence Foster Jenkins' misconceived notions) To top it off, it was a pity back then .... Pavarotti could not call on the syrupy violin of Andre Rieu and perhaps 'do duets' with Susan Boyle to help.

 

[adamdea]

IMHO the big question is ..."In any case, who would want it?"
After collecting about 15 Wagner Ring Cycles,I consider the performances recorded at the Met's most recent try at producing Wagner's Ring, released on DVD and Blu -ray...is . best left forgotten . Terfel's attempt at Wotan, was lacking in stature , both regarding his 'half- baked character acting and vocally . To actually see as well as hear a hailed singer, taking cheap short cuts in vocal technique to get through a role ; is quite alarming. Seeming to appear vocally "tired" at certain points as well producing sound "physically-out the side of his mouth" thereby causing lack of vocal focus. Leaving people with a firm belief, the character of Wotan and its particular vocal demands 'are one size -just too big' for Terfel's own voice qualities and range.' Here - one hears constantly from Terfel - the lack of expected proper central axis & gravity , especially with such a particular role as Wotan ( a operatic Mt Everest point) demands.

Plus The entire production is coupled "or crippled" with a soprano as Brunnhilde that was 'essaying ' her role which extend across 3 of the 4 parts of the Ring - for the first time.
In the relative short time span, since that Ring was actually produced on stage...little wonder...she is now doing Annie Oakley in musical comedy productions of things like Annie Get Your Gun". With what 'that suggests'
I do not need to say any more....

I've seen Terfel live doing the Ring many times (or at least many parts of it before he pulls out) and I have to say I think his Wotan is excellent. I confess I've never been to Bayreuth. Of course he isn't Hans Hotter, but who is? I feel the lack of a great living Brunnhilde and Siegfried more keenly.