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Equipment supports/racks

W

Woodface

pfm Member
This could turn into another cable thread but here goes; how much difference does ‘proper’ equipment racks/supports make?

All my gear (mostly naim) is on ‘Frame’ which is rather costly. It is so long ago that I splashed out that I cannot really recall what difference it made? I got a pretty good half price deal on a base & four shelves at the outset so it wasn’t completely scary.

It looks like I will be making some changes in the near future & I may look at other options ‘Quadraspire’?
 
I have an expensive stand that was given to me. It looks nice but to be honest I didn’t notice any differences between the expensive stand and a solid Tech link stand I bought years ago. It is another potential cable thread really.
 
Obviously it makes more difference under an LP12 than the rest of the components, but otherwise it's usually quite subtle to my ears.

It was more important to me when I had more expensive and revealing kit. Now I'm quite happy with some Lack tables.

Quadraspire can get very expensive, like the Fraim. I liked the entry level stuff. Not tried their more expensive ranges.

I still like Isoblue but gear on Quadraspire will sound a bit clearer, less muddy.

I tried a glass shelf once that sat on ball bearings on top of my Isoblue rack. Really didn't like the effect with LP12, but I guess I should hear a proper Fraim before drawing and firm conclusion. It was supposed to be the same spec glass that Naim use.
 
My LP12 is on a wall shelf. The fraim does look quite nice but is a dust magnet. I don’t like the isoblue so much. Quadraspire can look quite good; yet more first world problems.
 
Woodface said:
This could turn into another cable thread but here goes; how much difference does ‘proper’ equipment racks/supports make?

All my gear (mostly naim) is on ‘Frame’ which is rather costly. It is so long ago that I splashed out that I cannot really recall what difference it made? I got a pretty good half price deal on a base & four shelves at the outset so it wasn’t completely scary.

It looks like I will be making some changes in the near future & I may look at other options ‘Quadraspire’?
Click to expand...

Easy enough to find out, surely?

Take your kit off the Fraim, try putting it on the floor, an Ecko Hostess Trolley, a shoogley stool and a big sofa. Then put it back on the Fraim and see what you think.

Obviously this should all be done in 30 second blindfolded A/B/X comparisons, but that could get potentially quite expensive in terms of insurance claims, so best just to wing it.
 
LP12s are sensitive to what they stand on. I had a glass shelf on cones, sounded great on that. Then I changed TT, the shelf got broken in a house move, life moved on.

Components with no moving parts, no. However Naim gear in particular is sensitive to amplifiers being physically near bit transformers in power supplies.

It's simple and cheap to experiment with racks. You decide.
 
Would reused apple crates count as quality stands? I like to think that less is more here and the kit weighs more than the support in my example.
 
Paul Mc said:
Stands IMHO can make, or break a system. And then, some people hear it and others don't.
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Agree, and to the OP, I think Quadraspire is a good shout. The reference stuff is excellent but big money, but the regular stuff is a fair bit better than much of the competition, nicely made and finished, and I’d expect it to improve on the Fraim. Don’t overlook the MusicWorks stuff, similar to Quadraspire in execution, but better still IMHO.
 
As mentioned above, have a look at a typical studio set-up where the kit is mounted in racks that sit on desks and ask yourself why no ball bearings etc.?

However, TTs and speakers absolutely will be impacted by the way they connect to walls/floors, so take care there.

For me, what the amp, DAC and streamer sit on is all down to aesthetics and practicalities.

The observant among you will notice I’ve not mentioned CD transports/players. That’s the real “cable thread” fodder here I’d have thought!
 
When I shifted a turntable + phonostage from a Finite to a much cheaper Hi-Fi Rack it sounded better so unless you’re liable to good vibrations I don’t think yer gets wot yer pays for necessarily.
On the other hand the Quadraspire Ref. looks tasty........
 
My lp12 is on Mana phase 3 which is the right height for me (It’s the only exercise I get, good for the knees)but I was really surprised by a set of4 Wills maglev feet I was given as a pressy from Korea where I believe they are made.As a set they were really for heavier weights so I never tried them under my deck and to get them out of the way, I put just 3 of them in a sort of triangle roughly beneath where the toroidal sits inside my Sugden A21SE whose weight is a bit nearer the mark and noticed it wobbled like a jelly. It all looks very strange and I thought no more of it but a few days later was thinking how good the setup was sounding and realised it was the feet. I guess the noise threshold had been lowered somehow. Recently I also changed the MDF shelf they were standing on to an IKEA bamboo chopping board because it was roughly the same size and it seemed also to do its bit but I wouldn’t lose any sleep over that. I find I can’t be bothered to concentrate enough on the changes, if they exist, cos the music gets in the way which if we are honest is probably the case for most forum members having more money than sense but not especially well off if you get my meaning.
 
As long as its sturdy, whether a cabinet or rack, I think your pretty much OK. Turntables require the same though I know their vulnerability to foot falls etc. If people have the money I don't think there's any harm in buying something that looks lovely and is 'crafted' but whether they make much difference to the sound is very debatable, too debatable to be sure.
 
Woodface said:
how much difference does ‘proper’ equipment racks/supports make?
Click to expand...

What does the rack sit 'on'? is it a wooden floor, or a concrete one. Wooden floors, and especially the older suspended ones, can have an effect, IMV. This is why I agree with the comments regarding TT's and speakers.

I recently sold one of my two racks of Fraim, when swapping out from Naim (you mat recall). It does fetch good money if boxed and in A1 condition, but what you'll think of replacing it with might also not be cheap.

I cannot put my LP12 on a wall bracket, because of where I have my rack. I've looked at other stuff, but for now am using my remaining Fraim to support the LP12 and non-Naim kit.

PS one plus of Fraim is its easier to level that a four-footed stand, if you get what I mean.
 
Andrew C! said:
What does the rack sit 'on'? is it a wooden floor, or a concrete one. Wooden floors, and especially the older suspended ones, can have an effect, IMV. This is why I agree with the comments regarding TT's and speakers.

I recently sold one of my two racks of Fraim, when swapping out from Naim (you mat recall). It does fetch good money if boxed and in A1 condition, but what you'll think of replacing it with might also not be cheap.

I cannot put my LP12 on a wall bracket, because of where I have my rack. I've looked at other stuff, but for now am using my remaining Fraim to support the LP12 and non-Naim kit.
Click to expand...
I will have a base & two shelves spare, if I end up buying something like an Innuos Zen then I will need a fourth shelf so could keep back one of them.

I live in a 1940s house so suspended floors etc.
 
For solid state, spend your money on furniture that you like for your room. I prefer stuff that doesn't look like HiFi racks. Too much of a trophy shelf vibe.

Anyway, here's an experiment that shows how little 'microphony' affects solid state devices. They put a Quad 34 preamp (opened up) on top of one speaker, with the other speaker pointed directly at it. They recorded/analyzed the signal output of the pre to see if it was affected by the vibrations. Definitely worth a read through, and might help save some open minded people some money. :)

https://www.audio-forums.com/articles/microphonic-effects-on-solid-state-circuits.17/

Note that they repeated the same setup with high gain phono stages / valves and of course these were more susceptible to vibration.

7-jpg.954
 
Woodface said:
I will have a base & two shelves spare, if I end up buying something like an Innuos Zen then I will need a fourth shelf so could keep back one of them.

I live in a 1940s house so suspended floors etc.
Click to expand...

I factored in my future needs exactly like you are doing. I needed 5 shelves: Lingo 2/Heeds TT PSU on bottom shelf, Heed Qasar and Rega Ear 1 on next shelf, Innuos Zenith III on third, MiniDSPSHD next to top, and LP12 on top etc.

PS I love the Innuos hardware.

Wooden floor - plenty of experience with those. Tried all sorts, especially with speakers. Found the Mana speaker stand worked very well with SBL's and B&W speakers. Soon as I got to my current house - concrete floor - encountered a different problem, that eventually room correction sorted.
 
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