Coronavirus - the new strain XXII

[Dave H.]

What’s wrong with Adnams?!
Seriously, anyone, including Witty, is right to urge people to be cautious about socialising. The question is whether this is right for the country as a whole and is that the formal govt message. I’m not sure it is. Of course, vulnerable people need to be cautious but the reality is unless you live in a cave, you’re probably going to catch it. Many will have had it without even knowing. The best thing people can do IMHO is make sure they are fully vaccinated and if they are in good health, get on with life.

Look at your remarks about Whitty from the other end of the telescope, so to speak. What you’re saying amounts to suggesting that actual experts should not be able to tell the truth as they see it to the public until it’s been vetted and approved for release by politicians.

I get that it’s not good to cause panics based on incomplete/poorly understood/alarming facts. But a country where experts have to get the approval of the government before speaking (in this case, a government known and proven to be lying and extraordinarily manipulative - PPE numbers, testing numbers, etc ad nauseam) is not one I’d welcome moving even further towards.

 

[gavreid]

Gav,

The policy is real. The image is what’s doing the rounds on Twitter here as the explanation behind the province’s “evidenced-based” public health guidelines.

Joe

Jesus H

 

[AnilS]

These seem like calm rational people. Good thing they videoed themselves and uploaded it onto the internet so they're all easily identifiable.

Anti-vax wackjobs enter Test and Trace centre in Milton Keynes, shout abuse at staff and steal supplies.

Absolute idiots aren't they.

The team working there are ordinary people trying to do an extraordinary job.

 

[Ponty]

Look at your remarks about Whitty from the other end of the telescope, so to speak. What you’re saying amounts to suggesting that actual experts should not be able to tell the truth as they see it to the public until it’s been vetted and approved for release by politicians.

I get that it’s not good to cause panics based on incomplete/poorly understood/alarming facts. But a country where experts have to get the approval of the government before speaking (in this case, a government known and proven to be lying and extraordinarily manipulative - PPE numbers, testing numbers, etc ad nauseam) is not one I’d welcome moving even further towards.

The issue is the consequences of such comments, particularly on businesses and livelihoods. They are too broad brush. There will be millions of people for whom going down the pub will present no more risk than driving a car for example. Adnams reckon they are 50% down on trade as a result. Guess they just have to suck it up or go bust if their balance sheet isn’t strong enough.

 

[Woodface]

Whitty is an advisor, it is the Government who make the policy decisions. Whitty is an incredibly trusted & learned expert; the general public are giving his words greater weight. Quite right too.

I would now like to see some consistence public service messaging about what a healthy lifestyle looks like; this will massively mitigate against poor habits. We really need a wider cultural change of exercise & eating habits; as a society we need to take responsibility for this.

A proper commitment to active travel would be a start.

 

[gavreid]

No update today until 7.30. It's all the Christmas deaths to sort, there's been nothing since before the holidays

 

[Ponty]

I would now like to see some consistence public service messaging about what a healthy lifestyle looks like; this will massively mitigate against poor habits. We really need a wider cultural change of exercise & eating habits; as a society we need to take responsibility for this.

A proper commitment to active travel would be a start.

Couldn’t agree more. I heard someone senior in the NHS on the radio recently saying type 2 diabetes was going to hit them like a steam train, for example.

 

[SteveS1]

The issue is the consequences of such comments, particularly on businesses and livelihoods. They are too broad brush. There will be millions of people for whom going down the pub will present no more risk than driving a car for example. Adnams reckon they are 50% down on trade as a result. Guess they just have to suck it up or go bust if their balance sheet isn’t strong enough.

So your contention is that for public health advice, we should listen to a bloke who wants to keep his pubs busy? I love a pint of Ghost Ship and wouldn't dream of telling him how to run pubs, but I'll take health advice from Chris Whitty I think.

 

[twotone]

Not really. I want to decorate the living room and dining room having done upstairs earlier this year. I need to see the wallpaper for real.

Fair enough, my wife bought wallpaper earlier on this year online, she took a chance but if would have gone back if it didn't suit.

There's no way I'd go anywhere near B&Q at this time well anytime actually but each to their own.

 

[gavreid]

There's no way I'd go anywhere near B&Q at this time well anytime actually but each to their own.

That's worth a . You have the luxury of a trade account at the decent places though. B&Q is good if you don't know what to ask for but you do get ripped off. I remember being with my uncle as a nipper - he worked as a plumber in the Glasgow hospitals - and he'd just flash his union card to get a big discount.

 

[Ponty]

I'll take health advice from Chris Whitty I think.

So would I, however, if his comments cause greater damage to the country at a macro level, is it the right advice for 100% of people? He’s only looking through one lens.

 

[twotone]

That's worth a . You have the luxury of a trade account at the decent places though. B&Q is good if you don't know what to ask for but you do get ripped off. I remember being with my uncle as a nipper - he worked as a plumber in the Glasgow hospitals - and he'd just flash his union card to get a big discount.

I've a trade card for B&Q Gav which anyone can get but it lets you go in and out another entrance and set of tills but I hate the carpark and the shop much prefer Screwfix you just buy the stuff on your phone and it's ready to pick up within half an hour at most although there are idiots in there too (not the staff who are excellent).

 

[kensalriser]

So would I, however, if his comments cause greater damage to the country at a macro level, is it the right advice for 100% of people? He’s only looking through one lens.

And that's exactly what he should be doing as that's his area of expertise. It's the government's job to look at all the angles and decide on appropriate policy.

 

[MVV]

Looking through one lens is his job.
As for public health education, I doubt anyone does not know that beer, ciggs, chips and being a lazy lard arse is bad for your health.

 

[Ponty]

And that's exactly what he should be doing as that's his area of expertise. It's the government's job to look at all the angles and decide on appropriate policy.

Of course it is, however, it’s blurring from pure medical expertise into behavioural actions which are sending businesses bust when for the vast majority of people, the change in behaviour to reduce the suggested risk is exaggerated and even unnecessary.

 

[gavreid]

Of course it is, however, it’s blurring from pure medical expertise into behavioural actions which are sending businesses bust when for the vast majority of people, the change in behaviour to reduce the suggested risk is exaggerated and even unnecessary.

A lot of businesses have never been pressure tested - they just don't hold enough cash to be responsible for the employment of many people and have been allowed to get away with it for ages. Why should we sacrifice public health for shareholders of these spivs?

 

[flatpopely]

A lot of businesses have never been pressure tested - they just don't hold enough cash to be responsible for the employment of many people and have been allowed to get away with it for ages. Why should we sacrifice public health for shareholders of these spivs?

And what about the people they employ and the effect that redundancy would have on them and their familes mental health?

 

[Ponty]

A lot of businesses have never been pressure tested - they just don't hold enough cash to be responsible for the employment of many people and have been allowed to get away with it for ages. Why should we sacrifice public health for shareholders of these spivs?

If you want to apply survival of the fittest rules, that’s fine but it should apply equally across the board.

 

[gavreid]

And what about the people they employ and the effect that redundancy would have on them and their familes mental health?

That's my point. They'll be demanding protection from the taxpayer again. I'd be surprised if a lot of companies could pay more than a month's payroll because they're just not required to

 

[Woodface]

Looking through one lens is his job.
As for public health education, I doubt anyone does not know that beer, ciggs, chips and being a lazy lard arse is bad for your health.

But the outcomes of being healthier & reaping other benefits is massive. Most people would like to live longer & healthier lives surely? Taking control of your own health is better for everyone. There doesn’t seem to be any public health messaging on this.

Let’s not forget that smoking has massively decreased on the back of consistency of message. People are more aware of the what excessive drinking looks like.

We could just not bother of course & go back to the 70s when people still smoked while pregnant & drove home from the pub after having a few too many.