Chord Qutest question ...
- Thread starter beammeup
- Start date
I should now expect you to have the same experience as 99% of people that have tried it and now try and understand just exactly what Mr Watts was going on about and come to the conclusion he is wrong. That seems to be my experience and pretty much everyone I have spoke to to try one. The Dave owners also go to great lengths to upgrade their power. Surely if Mr Watts was right no one would. All I can say is try it yourself and just sent it back.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
So, to recap, the great thing about Chord dacs is that they are designed by a designer who is right but also wrong about everything. His genius,/wrongness is particuarly exhibited by the following aspects which make it essential to buy one of his dacs and also bypass or replace his flawed design
1) the WTA filter which applies a secret and yet entirely orthodox filter. best bypassed in software by upsampling until you can afford another one of his dacs with this years iteration of the filter (the same but a bit longer). repeat.
2) his careful design and specification of switchmode power supplies which should be replaced by somethign a retired BT engineer makes in his shed, largely specified by weight of transformer
3) his preference for use of toslink (?), best ignored so you can then buy something else because galavanic isolation is irrelevant (but don't forget to buy lots of additonal components network/power/isolation devices becaue of possible mains inteference)
4) his unique and yet completely wrong 3v RCA output.
Do any of you people want a dac or hobby of dicking around with stuff aimlessly?
1) the WTA filter which applies a secret and yet entirely orthodox filter. best bypassed in software by upsampling until you can afford another one of his dacs with this years iteration of the filter (the same but a bit longer). repeat.
2) his careful design and specification of switchmode power supplies which should be replaced by somethign a retired BT engineer makes in his shed, largely specified by weight of transformer
3) his preference for use of toslink (?), best ignored so you can then buy something else because galavanic isolation is irrelevant (but don't forget to buy lots of additonal components network/power/isolation devices becaue of possible mains inteference)
4) his unique and yet completely wrong 3v RCA output.
Do any of you people want a dac or hobby of dicking around with stuff aimlessly?
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camverton
pfm Member
That’s a good point. It is very difficult to get away from smps these days; just count up all the devices in our homes that use these - routers, switches, chargers etc etc. It soils be interesting to know if those swapping their Qutest power supply have culled all the other smps in their homes and whether it made any difference. Perhaps an important quality of modern equipment is that it should be resistant to such interference and should so called review sites run their suites of tests both with and without switch mode power supplies plugged in nearby?
I have tried the isotek filters plugged next to a smps and it cleaned the sound. Ive tried oneby my fridge/freezer also and it improved again. However I could tell a difference/improvement without then, A clear difference in switiching the original smps with a Sbooster. Which i then bought the Ultra Add on, enjoyed it. Then changed the power cable in the Sbooster for improvement again , then I experimented with the fuse in the Sbooster for futher gains to my ears and anyone elses for that matter.
Mike Hanson
Trying to understand...
I'll start another thread next week. Too busy today and over the weekend.
camverton
pfm Member
1) If it is secret how do you know that it is entirely orthodox? TAP length? The problem is that the iterations as you go up the model range only make a small difference and ime and imho aren’t really worth bothering with until you either go from bottom to top of range or add an m scaler.
2) Good point; there is a fashion for LPS at the moment, but not so much chat about the drawbacks of them.
3) Last time I compared inputs into TT2 I preferred toslink, but by a very small margin in that there was slightly less “hash or “noise”. Might have been what I was expecting but in any case the difference was too small to be relevant in day to day use. AIUI (happy to be corrected if necessary) toslink isn’t suitable for connecting an m scaler and Chord DAC at maximum data rate and using ferrite festooned connecting cables is one of the few times that I’ve found cables make a difference, as acknowledged by Rob Watts who described it as the surface of the icing on a cake.
4) The 2Qute had a 3v output, the Qutest has a choice of 1v, 2v or 3v. iirc the TT2 in dac mode has an output of 2.5v but a bit pointless buying a TT2 unless making use of the preamp and or headphone facilities.
For myself I just want a DAC that doesn’t distract from my enjoyment of music at which Chord and maybe Meridian (although haven’t used my Meridian kit for years) are very good in a way that other makes I’ve tried aren’t - ymmv. Dicking around with stuff aimlessly? A bit rude and not something I’m particularly interested in but if folk like doing that sort of thing then that’s fine. It’s not for you or I to say or cast aspersions on how people go about their hobby.
Tony L
Administrator
As a really simple clear example my remote doorbell buzzes very loudly if close to the little switch-mode PSU for my Panasonic wireless phone. Move it to another area and it is silent. To a much lesser extent the Chord DSX does create some noise in my system, a very low level ‘whine’ audible regardless of input selected or volume setting, my guess is something in the valve preamp is picking up RF from it somewhere. I’ve no idea if the DSX has a switch-mode PSU (I’ve not pulled it to bits yet!), though I strongly suspect it has.
Go back to the 1980s when the BBC Micro came out and there was all manner of concerns regarding RF from the switch-mode supply. Even more so in the USA where home computers were required by law to be in fully screened within metal shielding. It is definitely a thing, though we have become relaxed to it with every home being full of cheap disposable switch-mode wall-warts for everything. I’m sure they have got quieter over the years, but my doorbell says far from quiet enough.
camverton
pfm Member
Interesting, but one thing I don’t understand is that for all these improvements to have an added discernible effect on the sound quality the sound must have been dire in the first place - was it? Perhaps you could say what your equipment is so that we can better understand where you are coming from.
I very much doubt that a change of fuse would give any gain to “anyone else’s ears”, but if it works for you fair enough.
camverton
pfm Member
Life was much simpler when I had an all Quad system with 57 stats and before I even had a computer. The only thing I had to worry about was the occasional hum from a 303 and iirc that the inputs into the 33 weren’t ideal for connecting one of those new fangled CD players. A 606 amp solved the first and a 44 pre the second but it was a bit of a relief when things became standardised with the 66/67 series - well, at least until the 67 pre motherboard had to be replaced a couple of times (something to do with problems with pin through circuit boards iirc).
Progress? Hmm, every solution seems to create another problem to be solved!
I can suggest trying it yourself before dismissing it.
Isotek power conditioning. Sotm streamer, with Sbooster, upgraded cables and Surprise surprise Hifi tuning fuse and I just remembered Synergistic Research fuse in the plug. Qutest Dac with Sbooster and the same upgrades and fuses. Naim Xs2 , REL T9x x2 and PMC 24 speakers. I am also tight as the come ( possibly being Scottish has something to do with it) haha and I can assure you I wouldnt waste my money if I wasnt hearing improvements.
camverton
pfm Member
Well, there are no end of things to try, many at great expense, and if I spent my life trying out every claim I wouldn’t have time to sit down and be engrossed by music as opposed to listening to and worrying about sound.
You didn’t answer my question which is if all these tweaks make such an effect in the sound how awful was it to start with. Logically there are only so improvements you can make before the system is beyond improvement, unless it was naff to start with in which case the phrase polishing a turd comes to mind! Your system looks pretty decent so I can’t quite see the need for experimenting with fuses etc but if that is part of your hobby that’s fine.
One thing does intrigue me though. In what way is your system deficient that you need to spend time on tweaking things?
That is just complete nonsense. Sounds like an engrained view that will never change and stuck in their ways. I find it hard to have a discussion with someone who has plenty of opinions but yet never tried things. I recently heard the newest Magico's with some Dan D'Agustino amps. Infact I heard dozens of top systems recently and head the demos and changes in power cables/ interconnects/ filters all sorts and if you cant hear it, you better go up the doctors I'm afraid. To suggest their equipment is not up to scratch is farcical but yet you can still hear it with your own ears. It speaks volumes as the saying goes.
camverton
pfm Member
Wow! Nice rant.
Was that in response to my post? I tried to answer your points as to why I wouldn’t bother experimenting with fuses, but you don’t seem to want to answer mine, questions which were genuine, not looking for an argument. I’m not suggesting your equipment isn’t up to scratch, on the contrary I described it as pretty decent which is why I’m interested to know why the need to do so much tweaking, presumably to improve the system. For the record I used to own a pair of PMC speakers, have witnessed various demos of cables usually by salesmen and came to the conclusion that unless there was a real problem to be solved money is better spent on more appropriate and better quality equipment or more music and time is better spent enjoying music or gardening or stroking the cat.
Still, if spending time on money on power supplies, cables, fuses or whatever is your thing that, as I said before is fine and no need for you to defend so aggressively. There’s plenty of room for all approaches in this hobby.
Its not a rant. You said you very much doubt fuses will make a difference. No point telling you otherwise by the sound of it then. Then as you said, it might be poor in the first place. Amazing systems and equipment all do the same. Im struggling to undertand how you fail to grasp any of that going by your questions. Its almost like you dont believe us or them or dont want to. I personally find it quite patronising when I read comments like ...
I very much doubt that a change of fuse would give any gain to “anyone else’s ears”, but if it works for you fair enough.
Id just shared my experience and you said that.
What does that even mean? Im imagining things or something? Its just me? What does it mean?
I just cant be bothered to get into it with folk that have blinkered opinions, its bores me. No rant there or Intended.
Mike Hughes
pfm Member
Same here. The theory is that the M-Scalar makes the TT2 sound more realistic whilst it’s essential for the Dave. The detail and smoothness of the Dave is impressive but I’ve never found it that engaging. More hifi and less music. Goes very well with Chord amps, for which I have no taste i.e. further emphasises detail and smoothness but at the cost of the energy of live music which the TT2 and Qutest do have.
camverton
pfm Member
OK, clearly no point in discussing anything with you, and that’s fine. Hope you find plenty of people here to engage with who you’ll enjoy conversing with.
Mike Hughes
pfm Member
Incorrect on multiple fronts:
1) can you name a manufacturer who puts all their work in the public domain? I don‘t care whether the filter is secret and/or orthodox. How does it sound? I like it. I buy it. I am happy.
2) as has been observed above, many who swap the wallwart out cannot evidence what has been impacted and many simply return to the original. Most owners have stuck with what Chord provided and remain happy. So, no, the majority do not think he‘s wrong.
3) he has no overall preference and has made it repeatedly clear that each DAC has differences which matter. USB on the TT2 is also a preference for example. Again then, given that he’s never genetalised about all his devices as you have wrongly suggested, he is not wrong.
4) I agree re: 3V.
I listened to his DACs and bought one. Connected via USB at his suggestion on another well known forum. Never been tempted to change the power supply. Enjoy music.