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Cartridge Re-tip?

T

Tony. B

obsessed by music
Hi All,
Derek Jenkins, the 'Main Man" of LP12 turntable set-up, told me a while back that my Shelter 901 cartridge could do with a re-tip. It seems that there are three places to send it. Expert Stylus, Goldring and Northwest Analogue. I've heard mainly good and a the odd bad reports of Esco and Goldring but almost nothing about Northwest. I know that turn-around time is a problem with Esco.

Where would you send your cartridge?

I would be grateful for any advice.
Tony. B
 
ESCO have got quite a long waiting time but that to me indicates they are getting a lot of work in so is a good indicator.

Know nothing of NWA apart from a thread here a while ago where someone had a nightmare with them and they refused to refund.
 
Tony. B said:
Hi All,
Derek Jenkins, the 'Main Man" of LP12 turntable set-up, told me a while back that my Shelter 901 cartridge could do with a re-tip. It seems that there are three places to send it. Expert Stylus, Goldring and Northwest Analogue. I've heard mainly good and a the odd bad reports of Esco and Goldring but almost nothing about Northwest. I know that turn-around time is a problem with Esco.

Where would you send your cartridge?

I would be grateful for any advice.
Tony. B
Click to expand...

Trade it in for a new one. An oem re tip inevitably changes the authenticity of the cartridge. Of course it costs more, but you get more....a genuine new Shelter cartridge.
It is different when the cartridge is out of production, then a retip makes sense.
 
Yes, that was a very unfortunate thread which shouldn't have been aired, i.m.o. Dominic Harper (NWA) has recently produced his own £5K moving coil cart., and a member of this parish has one and loves it, so he must at least be highly competent.

there's a thread about Goldring on here at the mo'

ESCo are by far and away the most prevalent repairers, but as B B says above, there ALWAYS seems to be a long waiting time; something which doesn't seem to have been addressed in recent years.

It would be interesting to know how many hours your Shelter has on it and whether they operate a px system like Lyra and others.
 
I used Northwest Analogue last year. The only problem was the length of time it took, but I think they are very busy so I had expected a delay anyway.

Communication was good, I didn't pay until the work was done and I am more than happy with the results.
 
What do Shelter recommend?

If it's a current cart, and you've enjoyed it buy a new one, give someone else the risk (and expense) of a re-tip. Too many grumblings and mixed messages for me to put money into them.
 
You could also consider sending it to Peter Lederman at Soundsmith.

I have an ESCO re-tipped Koetsu Urushi, re-tipped before I bought it. Fab cartridge. Will send to NWA next time, simply because Dom has a good reparation for Koetsu. I would trust both equally.
 
Soundsmith in the States seem to get very good press and prices seem very reasonable, only hassle is the shipping/return.
 
<moderating>

A few pages of moronic and predictably cyclic ego-blather removed. Some folk seriously need to raise their game. Some perfectly legitimate posts caught in the crossfire, but as ever my advice is not to waste time responding to trolls.
 
Tony. B said:
I know that turn-around time is a problem with Esco.
Click to expand...

This is true, but it's well worth the wait. I've been using them for about 14 years, and the cartridges that I've had retipped by them have always come back sounding better than they did when new. It helps to have a spare cartridge in reserve, so that you can rotate them as the tip wears out.

A solid thumbs-up for ESCO.
 
Soundsmith are good. Also, they don't require an inspection fee and don't charge if the cartridge is beyond repair.

You should pay VAT for the service, but this amount is dwarfed by what the handling agents charge.
 
Don't forget VDH.
Never had one myself but heard a couple and the reputation is good.

Where possible I would suggest the tip only is replaced. Anything else and you really don't have the same cartridge any more. Fine if you want something different and know what to expect.
 
divedeepdog said:
What do Shelter recommend?

If it's a current cart, and you've enjoyed it buy a new one, give someone else the risk (and expense) of a re-tip. Too many grumblings and mixed messages for me to put money into them.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. They rarely sound the same, other bits can still be knackered, and their value is gone....It also causes problems for people buying second hand. I am sure people on pfm are honest, but you might be surprised that some retipped cartridges are sold as originals. How can people know what they are buying? I couldn't tell, can you?
This is not about pushing new cartridges...it's about weighing up the pros and cons. The argument is not clear cut.
First, I would have a long think about costs and value. If I can't afford a posh cartridge I won't buy one...simple as that. There are good cartridges are lower prices. Look after it, keep the records clean, use a good arm, and you should get long, trouble-free mileage. Then buy a replacement at the discount price. Well, that is what I would suggest.
 
Curious thought.

Actually I can afford a posh cartridge and have bought them, but the one I currently get most satisfaction from is an Esco re-tipped Ortofon MC20. For comparison I also own an Esco re-tipped Linn troika (now a bit long in the tooth) and two original Ortofon kontrapunkt b's.

Cartridge technology hasn't really moved on much in 20 years other than maybe at the ridiculously OTT price point so why wouldn't you re-tip?

Sure it might sound slightly different from the original if a different profile of tip is fitted but the good re-tippers will usually make it sound better!

I have only excellent experience from Esco, however I am less impressed with Goldring. They did my Troika many yonks ago and although I was happy with it until the diamond fell off after 4 years later the subsequent Esco re-tip was in an entirely different league.
 
I agree that there can be risks purchasing second hand cartridges.

When I purchased my Urushi, third hand, it had been retipped by ESCO 6 months earlier, and I was told it had hardly been used since.

The basis of the sale was that the seller returned it to ESCO for examination and ESCO sent me their new certificate direct. They also said it was one of the best ones they's seen. The seller also kindly paid the £35 fee. I then went and collected and paid for it.

I was delighted with it then and am still delighted with it now, and I am listening to it as I type.

I paid £1,400. It retails for £4,100. I thought, and still think, it was a good deal. Tell me I'm wrong.
 
You knew what you were buying, and were happy with that, and you took real care. So you can't be 'wrong.' But, the other side of the coin is that you don't own a cartridge which Koetsu would accept as genuine, or indicative of what their cartridges can do. It might be better, might be worse. Certainly different.
Oddly enough, my last Koetsu was indeed a Urushi, for which I paid the full £4000. I now find I prefer moving magnet designs,I use a £70 Shure 97xe and a Grado moving iron, 0.5 output, into a music first step up. I Prefer the Grado to the Urushi. It cost me £600. No doubt I will now be accused of promoting Grado, but the real point is that getting the right cartridge for your taste is the key. Obviously you are happy with your cartridge, so you have made the right choice for you.
And that, we can all agree, is what this is about.
Writing this, it occurs to me that I haven't bought any second hand kit for years now. I try to buy ex-dem and then keep it for many years. I went off used stuff when someone sold me a Krell amp with the wrong transformer fitted......he seemed such a nice guy too.
 
paskinn said:
You knew what you were buying, and were happy with that, and you took real care. So you can't be 'wrong.' But, the other side of the coin is that you don't own a cartridge which Koetsu would accept as genuine, or indicative of what their cartridges can do. It might be better, might be worse. Certainly different.
Oddly enough, my last Koetsu was indeed a Urushi, for which I paid the full £4000. I now find I prefer moving magnet designs,I use a £70 Shure 97xe and a Grado moving iron, 0.5 output, into a music first step up. I Prefer the Grado to the Urushi. It cost me £600. No doubt I will now be accused of promoting Grado, but the real point is that getting the right cartridge for your taste is the key. Obviously you are happy with your cartridge, so you have made the right choice for you.
And that, we can all agree, is what this is about.
Writing this, it occurs to me that I haven't bought any second hand kit for years now. I try to buy ex-dem and then keep it for many years. I went off used stuff when someone sold me a Krell amp with the wrong transformer fitted......he seemed such a nice guy too.
Click to expand...

I heard a couple of Koetsu's before I purchased and I heard the unit I purchased before I paid for it.

My deck has two arms and the second arm has either a Goldring 2500 or a 2m Mono. The Goldring is good for rock - it is a bit deeper and darker than the Urushi, but doesn't come close to the refinement of the Urushi on classical, jazz and vocal. I have tested with both playing at the same time, as my phono stage is dual input.

I used to buy ex-dem. All my current main system is new as I intend to keep it, except the Koetsu and my amplifier which were second hand. The Koetsu was certified and the amplifier (Art Audio) was from Emporium, so guaranteed, but I have upgraded it. The only items I have purchased new in 15 years and sold were a Bryston amp and a pair of PMC speakers. I bought a UnitiQute2 a few weeks ago, 2nd hand reduced from £1,295 to £800, but so new the guarantee was not even registered and it is now registered in my name.
 
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