fegs
pfm Member
They certainly do! I paid £999 for mine almost 20 years ago, which for me was a very big spend
B&W speakers. Underrated?
- Thread starter Allaboutmusic
- Start date
They certainly do! I paid £999 for mine almost 20 years ago, which for me was a very big spend
I have ATCs myself, they just sound right to me but would never dismiss B&W in the way others do.
Del monaco
Del Monaco
I heard some ATCs up in Gateshead some years ago. I was really taken with the ‘live’ sound they presented and coveted them really. Sadly they were well outside of my financial capability.maybe one day.
tuga
Legal Alien
The "depth of that soundstage" is the result of the dip in the presence region (perhaps the little peak in the middle adds a tad of "crispness"):
This is H.D. Harwood (the father of Harbeth) describing the BBC dip:
Del monaco
Del Monaco
Interesting analysis tuga.The "depth of that soundstage" is the result of the dip in the presence region (perhaps the little peak in the middle adds a tad of "crispness"):
This is H.D. Harwood (the father of Harbeth) describing the BBC dip:
TimF
pfm Member
Yes, this does seem to be the case often here, and could be why I found some of the B&W's that I listened to, boring. So I may just be getting things all wrong here, as I really can't say I much care for McIntosh amps in general. I would still like to visit the 705 S2 on my own amps and in my own room, to get a better feel for them, as there seems to be much to potentially like about these stand mounters. Although I certainly do not need another speaker to play with now!
toprepairman
pfm Member
Bought a pair of DM15's in the late 80's second hand.
Loved them then, still do, still have them, listen to them almost daily.
Loved them then, still do, still have them, listen to them almost daily.
Colin L
High-tech low-life
The "depth of that soundstage" is the result of the dip in the presence region (perhaps the little peak in the middle adds a tad of "crispness"):
This is H.D. Harwood (the father of Harbeth) describing the BBC dip:
Are you referring to the CM9's specifically, or B&W's generally?
This is the FR for the B&W 800 D2. I'm not seeing a significant dip in the presence region.
The full measurements by John Atkinson, who really knows how to interpret speaker measurements, are here...
https://www.stereophile.com/content/bampw-800-diamond-loudspeaker-measurements
Going back to the original question, in my book overrated. I listened to several pairs in the B&W demo at the 2019 Bristol show and the 606 in particular sounded great. Listened to the same models in my dealer’s demo room and they were poor – thin and bright with little or no bass. The speakers I eventually bought (ProAc) sounded great in the demo room and at home.
I have a pair DM4 which occasionally is used with similar vintage Quad amplication.
Heard the DM2a several times too, they are even better.
Previously owned DM6 and DM7, both had their pro's and con's
Would love a pair of early 801/802 non-ported.
The few more recent B&W's i've heard didn't move me much.
I agree some of them looks odd
Heard the DM2a several times too, they are even better.
Previously owned DM6 and DM7, both had their pro's and con's
Would love a pair of early 801/802 non-ported.
The few more recent B&W's i've heard didn't move me much.
I agree some of them looks odd
Del monaco
Del Monaco
Not my experience with the CM8s and they sounded great in the demo room and now sound even better in my own room. Your experience shows the importance of the room and placement.
wow&flutter
pfm Member
Interesting, I don’t remember a DM15. The DM12, DM14, DM16 & DM17 I know ok but not a 15, any more info?
wow&flutter
pfm Member
I’ve had many Worthing speakers over the years. DM4 and DM5 I’ve revisited in the past 10 years with the DM5 being the sweet spot. DM2 and DM2/2 were ok, DM7 an acquired taste but the DM7 mk2 was lovely.
DM12 was amazing for its size, the original 801 I never heard in a big enough room to do them justice but hey the guys at Abbey Rd can’t be wrong!
I heard the more recent DM 600 (I think it was an S3) which was a great little speaker.
B&W Worthing must have been one of the earlier user of lasers to map cone behaviour as well as their (unique at the time) live vs recorded demo which I was fortunate to catch around 1980.
DM12 was amazing for its size, the original 801 I never heard in a big enough room to do them justice but hey the guys at Abbey Rd can’t be wrong!
I heard the more recent DM 600 (I think it was an S3) which was a great little speaker.
B&W Worthing must have been one of the earlier user of lasers to map cone behaviour as well as their (unique at the time) live vs recorded demo which I was fortunate to catch around 1980.
tuga
Legal Alien
Are you referring to the CM9's specifically, or B&W's generally?
This is the FR for the B&W 800 D2. I'm not seeing a significant dip in the presence region.
The full measurements by John Atkinson, who really knows how to interpret speaker measurements, are here...
https://www.stereophile.com/content/bampw-800-diamond-loudspeaker-measurements
There's a dip with a sharp peak in the middle (at 3.5kHz) which is the result of a cone breakup resonance:
Fig.7 B&W 800 Diamond, 1/6-octave smoothed, averaged response of left and right speakers at 1m in KR's listening room (blue);
spatially averaged LF response of left speaker at listening position (4m) in KR's room (red).
The speaker's cumulative spectral-delay plot (fig.9) is very clean in the region covered by the tweeter, but less so in the upper midrange.
There is a slight ridge of delayed energy centered on 3.5kHz that coincides with the slight peak in the on-axis frequency response.
The effect of this is difficult to predict, but I suspect that it might increase the feeling of increased resolution of detail.
Fig.9 B&W 800 Diamond, cumulative spectral-decay plot on tweeter axis at 50" (0.15ms risetime).
.
Bowers & Wilkins 802 D3
Fig.3 B&W 802 D3 Diamond, anechoic response averaged across 30° horizontal window on tweeter axis at 50",
corrected for microphone response, with complex sum of midrange, woofer, and port responses plotted below 300Hz.
Fig.7 B&W 802 D3 Diamond, cumulative spectral-decay plot on midrange axis at 50" (0.15ms risetime).
.
Bowers & Wilkins 805 D3
The woofer's response is relatively even (though with a couple of small peaks and dips visible) up to 3.3kHz, where it crosses over to the tweeter (green trace).
Fig.3 Bowers & Wilkins 805 D3, acoustic crossover on tweeter axis at 50", corrected for microphone response,
with nearfield responses of woofer (blue) and port (red),
respectively plotted in the ratios of the square roots of their radiating areas below 300 and 500Hz.
Fig.7 Bowers & Wilkins 805 D3, spatially averaged, 1/6-octave response in JA's listening room.
Colin L
High-tech low-life
Tuga,
You missed out JA's summary of the testing in your search for graphs to support your conclusions from listening to speakers 25 years ago.
"Overall, the B&W 800 Diamond's measured performance suggests that its balance has been optimized by listening; the various small departures from neutrality tend to balance one another".
You missed out JA's summary of the testing in your search for graphs to support your conclusions from listening to speakers 25 years ago.
"Overall, the B&W 800 Diamond's measured performance suggests that its balance has been optimized by listening; the various small departures from neutrality tend to balance one another".
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
About 81-82 ish here... George Hooley on clarinet.
wow&flutter
pfm Member
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
/\ Just clarinet here. Source was a Studer R2R, B62 or B67 IIRC
tuga
Legal Alien
I always miss the summary since JA often dismisses all but the most blatant shortcomings as "character" or inconsequential or to someone's taste... You don't bite the hand that feeds you.