That's correct. And the trannies I've tried all run quietly and coolly given a reasonable spec
Ali Express 'clone' amps...great stuff!!
- Thread starter rontoolsie
- Start date
jtgofish
pfm Member
I own a Dartzeel NHB108 and FM Acoustics 300A power amp copies.The Dartzeel copy took ages to break in [the real ones do too] and the FM copy has a slight buzz which was fixed by buying an IFi Gnd Defender plug/thingy.These are both wonderful sounding amplifiers .Much better than say a Rotel Michi,Almarro 318B and a Musical Fidelity A5CR I have owned.As well as various Accuphases,Luxmans Yamahas I have also owned.Probably equal of my Bakooon AMP 5521 which is a remarkable sounding amp.Once you hear SS amps of this quality you lose the desire to listen to valve amps.There is just something "right"sounding about them.These are old designs on which the patents have lapsed.Anybody is free to make copies/clones of them.Nelson Pass has made that statement about some of his older designs that have been copied [the Usher R1.5 is a Threshold/Pass design for example.
If you want to dip your toes into this [murky ] water I suggest though that you try the FM Acoustics 155 preamp copies first.They are cheap as chips and sound mind boggling good.They also match really well with the FM Acoustics and Dartzeel copy amps I have mentioned.The closest modern model to these is the FM255.Which will cost you 50,000 quid.
If you want to dip your toes into this [murky ] water I suggest though that you try the FM Acoustics 155 preamp copies first.They are cheap as chips and sound mind boggling good.They also match really well with the FM Acoustics and Dartzeel copy amps I have mentioned.The closest modern model to these is the FM255.Which will cost you 50,000 quid.
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Zaiden
pfm Member
I am going back to China in September this year.
I've listened to a lot, but not quite at the £10,000+ mark in terms of amplifiers (have heard some speakers North of this mark though).
If I can find a hifi shop during my time in China, and get the chance to audition or listen to these clone speakers/amplifiers (it's certainly on my agenda provided I can find an outlet or store), I'll let people know how they sound compared to the stuff I can recall listening to.
I've listened to a lot, but not quite at the £10,000+ mark in terms of amplifiers (have heard some speakers North of this mark though).
If I can find a hifi shop during my time in China, and get the chance to audition or listen to these clone speakers/amplifiers (it's certainly on my agenda provided I can find an outlet or store), I'll let people know how they sound compared to the stuff I can recall listening to.
Interesting. In terms of:
What do you mean here by "cheap as chips"? Do you mean a couple of hundred or is it modern hifi "Only £3000 for this preamp that easily outperforms my MoreMoneyNSense XYZ Plutocrat SE at £35k"? If the former, hmm, interesting. If the latter, yeah, right, I got better things to do with £3k. Say 2 weeks in Italy living like a king. Or a month living as I normally do.
I went straight to AliExpress and looked at FM Acoustics 155 preamps after that post and it looks like they sit around the £150-250 point with an LPSU to boot. Not sure if they are the ones he was referring to.
Edited to add: the lower end of thet price bracket were 220v models, at the top end they were 230v.
That's cheap enough, for sure. Edit - are they all in that hideous gold that you generally see sprayed all over $50k handbags? Barf.
Colin L
High-tech low-life
Prompted by this I went and had a look too.
Jeez guys, I don't know what you think you are getting buying this stuff but it sure ain't anything like they claim it is, sonically or otherwise.
Searched on Dartzeel and it came up with a strange Dartzeel pre and MBL frankenamp.
If its too good to be true... etc.
Madness..
S-Man
StrivingON
Well I suppose you have to hope so, if you’ve bought into the genuine Frankenstuff.
Not always madness. Sometimes they can pop up remarkably good stuff. I have a 3 channel plus BT preamp from China, it really is as good as it needs to be, and it cost tenners. It was on the recommendation of a mate, it's a great thing.
jtgofish
pfm Member
You need to understand how these copies have come about.The process starts by somebody buying the real thing and pulling it apart and copying the circuit design as closely as possible.Then having the circuit boards manufactured which in china can be done very economically.Sure some of the cheaper copies are not close but some are extremely close to the originals.The FM Acoustics copies seem to be extremely close to the real thing .They claim a 99% clone. The components used might be different brands but they closely match the original specs.The circuit design is the critical part.
I can understand the skepticism.I was very skeptical myself but have been incredibly impressed by the sound quality.And I have some very high resolution speakers -Dynaudio C5 for example which will tell exactly how amps really sound.
jtgofish
pfm Member
They are extruded aluminium plate anodized that colour.Like the originals.It is a bit of a high end Swiss look.Not too different to classic gold Rolex watches.The Dartzeel especially.
The 220/230 volt thing is probably just marketing the same thing to different countries.I suspect they are all the same and all come from the same factory.They are 220-240 volt.Probably more like 230 volt to suit both.
The gold is horrible. The 220/230V thing is indeed an attempt to market to various territories, if designed properly it's no problem, but a lot of the Chinese stuff is designed for 220 and the UK s 240 with periods of 250 just fries it.
jtgofish
pfm Member
No problem with those nominally 230 volt units here.And we get the occasional 260 volt spikes.
I don't mind the gold colour.In the flesh they look pretty nice.Beats boring black.
As others have said, it's the valve gear that you have to watch because of the HT being stepped up from mains. Tranny gear is less critical because if you have a 40-0-40 internal power rail and your mains voltage is 10% too high, it goes to 44-0-44. No big deal. Now do the sums with vakves.
rontoolsie
pfm Member
If I had the funds, I would have purchased the clone FM711mk2 monoblocks. Very, very close clones of the original, 24 kg per side in construction, that with shipping come in around $5k. Which is on the very high end of what most Chinese amps sell for. But they probably perform to within 90-95% of the original.
The originals sold for $70,000 back in the late 1990s. AND it was a stereo amp. The AliExpress ones split them physically into 2 monoblocks, which for me is preferable.
What power amps could you get at your dealer for $5k? A new series Naim 250 is $9k, and I would be very suprised if it came anywhere even close to these Ali Clones.
Add to these monoblocks the $2500 FM255 preamp clone and for $7500 you have a massive pre-power combo that probably competes with amps 5-10x the price. If not more.