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£500 phono - Croft? NJC? Second hand? Argh!

T

_Tom_

New Member
Hello all, first post here.

I'm getting tied up in knots trying to decide on a phonostage upgrade in the £500 region. Currently run an Edwards Audio Apprentice MM, which is very nice for what it is, however I am conscious that my AT-VM95SH cartridge has more to give if paired with a higher spec stage and correct capacitance loading (100-200pH total, the Apprentice is 150pH not including cables).

I really like the look of the NJC reference phono, the Croft RIAA and the Moon 110 LPv2. Of these, I'm leaning towards the NJC for its ease of adjustment, apparent build and component quality, and the warm feeling of supporting a small British company (especially now).

Since I've been impressed by the Apprentice, I have been looking at nicer Edwards Audio options too. There is a bizarre lack of information on these however, with barely even a picture of certain models to be found. I'm sure the MC6 is a great preamp, but there's just so little information about it. Anyone have any experience with one?

Lastly, second hand is an option. I've seen models that go for £1000+ popping up for around £500 such as the Lehmann Audio black cube and the Rogue Audio Triton, so it seems silly to discount this route.

Even writing this has got my head spinning again. I'll just say that I listen to a wide range of music so the preamp needs to be a solid all rounder, and £500 really is the top end of my budget. Your suggestions would be more than welcome.
 
Loads of people like the Croft - I use one here (as part of a Micro) but fed from a head amp' or SUT and it sounds very very good even with a few £1000's gear feeding it.

Don't forget the Arkless as well - I've not heard it but well received by quite a few.
 
How long does the cable from your TT to the phono stage need to be? With some low capacitance cables you ought to be able to stay below the recommended 200pF loading, provided your cables can be kept to just a couple of feet long.

I'm very happy with my EAR834P (clone) with an MM cartridge.
 
I've got the original version of the Moon 110 and like it. The only downside with that version is that you need to open it up to make any adjustments although it's pretty straightforward. I think the V2 version is easier as the dip switches are accessible from the bottom of the case. I've used it with MM, high output MC and low output MC cartridges and it was good with them all.
 
Croft RIAA is a great option. Email Dave at Radlett Audio and he might be able to give you a good price on one.
 
Mike P said:
How long does the cable from your TT to the phono stage need to be? With some low capacitance cables you ought to be able to stay below the recommended 200pF loading, provided your cables can be kept to just a couple of feet long.

I'm very happy with my EAR834P (clone) with an MM cartridge.
Click to expand...

Only 0.5m or so, but it's the wiring in the tonearm + the phono stage which I understand needs to be accounted for? Assuming it's 100-150pF in the tonearm I am quite a way over the recommended amount atm
 
However, the Edwards Audio Apprentice MM is an excellent phono stage for the price,
at the same level of a Rega Fono MM or a Rega Aria (MM section).
Differences are subtle.
 
I bought a used original Moon 110LP and returned it because I thought it was faulty, it really didn't sound great. The shop checked it and said it wasn't but lent me a brand new Moon 110LPv2. That was a lot better, not a slight difference but still quite coloured and sang with some types of music but wasn't very inspiring with others. So they got that back too. I preferred the cheaper Cambridge I started with.

After that I bought a Graham Slee Jazz Club. This is fundamentally the same as the Era Gold but comes with the better PSU as standard. That's a really nice MM phono stage with a very smooth musical sound. Dynamics are not great though and the sound stage is so narrow I actually sent it back to Graham Slee to check that it was ok. It was. Despite that I still rate it highly and the service you get from Graham Slee is outstanding.

Next I bought a Rega Aria, I had that and the Jazz Club at the same time. I liked both but the Rega won because it's a MM and MC stage and sounds great. Best way to describe it is to say it doesn't sound like anything. Big, wide dynamic sound but no character of its own. It just sounds transparent, clear and clean. I don't have any desire to change it.

Just my experience.
 
_Tom_ said:
Only 0.5m or so, but it's the wiring in the tonearm + the phono stage which I understand needs to be accounted for? Assuming it's 100-150pF in the tonearm I am quite a way over the recommended amount atm
Click to expand...
I00-150pF would be a helluva lot just for the tonearm. I'd expect the tonearm to be more like 25pF.
 
Just as an update, I opted for the NJC in the end. It is a bit of a coin toss in these times where auditioning is difficult etc, but after a few days with the unit now I am more than happy. Depth, clarity and precision have taken a significant step forward and it feels like the AT-VM95SH is being allowed to express itself to the fullest. I am especially pleased with the quality and extension of low bass frequencies, the NJC delivers it all cleanly and powerfully whereas the Edwards Audio was rich but slightly loose in comparison.
This phono stage seems able to place sounds in a 3D sphere in front of you, whereas the Edwards Audio was more of a flatscreen TV, if that makes sense.
I haven't done any critical listening on the differences between running a 47K and 100K resistance load, although the supplied measurement graphs suggests it is possible to improve extension out to 20Khz in 100k mode and remove the upper treble kink/roll off inherent in some MM cartridges. For now I'm just enjoying playing all my records!
The gain switch is proving very useful for headphone listening as my amplifiers headphone out is a bit anemic, so switching into high gain fleshes it out nicely without having to push the volume dial way up.
Lastly, the inclusion of a hefty power transformer as standard is a big plus for me. I understand it, but I get put off by the ploy you often see where an expensive phono stage is sort of undermined by the manufacturer saying 'it's OK now, but you can make it really good with this additional (£3-400) power unit!'. I like knowing that what comes in the box as standard will enable the unit to perform to its best.
Anyway, thanks for the input and suggestions in this thread, and to myles who offered me a good deal on a Simaudio unit, that was very tempting but I'm relieved to have made a decision at last.
 
_Tom_ said:
Just as an update, I opted for the NJC in the end. It is a bit of a coin toss in these times where auditioning is difficult etc, but after a few days with the unit now I am more than happy. Depth, clarity and precision have taken a significant step forward and it feels like the AT-VM95SH is being allowed to express itself to the fullest. I am especially pleased with the quality and extension of low bass frequencies, the NJC delivers it all cleanly and powerfully whereas the Edwards Audio was rich but slightly loose in comparison.
This phono stage seems able to place sounds in a 3D sphere in front of you, whereas the Edwards Audio was more of a flatscreen TV, if that makes sense.
I haven't done any critical listening on the differences between running a 47K and 100K resistance load, although the supplied measurement graphs suggests it is possible to improve extension out to 20Khz in 100k mode and remove the upper treble kink/roll off inherent in some MM cartridges. For now I'm just enjoying playing all my records!
The gain switch is proving very useful for headphone listening as my amplifiers headphone out is a bit anemic, so switching into high gain fleshes it out nicely without having to push the volume dial way up.
Lastly, the inclusion of a hefty power transformer as standard is a big plus for me. I understand it, but I get put off by the ploy you often see where an expensive phono stage is sort of undermined by the manufacturer saying 'it's OK now, but you can make it really good with this additional (£3-400) power unit!'. I like knowing that what comes in the box as standard will enable the unit to perform to its best.
Anyway, thanks for the input and suggestions in this thread, and to myles who offered me a good deal on a Simaudio unit, that was very tempting but I'm relieved to have made a decision at last.
Click to expand...
That’s great to hear. I’ve wanted one for ages. I’ve got the headphone amp and I’m going to get the money together for the phono stage. Thanks for the review
 
_Tom_ said:
Just as an update, I opted for the NJC in the end. It is a bit of a coin toss in these times where auditioning is difficult etc, but after a few days with the unit now I am more than happy. Depth, clarity and precision have taken a significant step forward and it feels like the AT-VM95SH is being allowed to express itself to the fullest. I am especially pleased with the quality and extension of low bass frequencies, the NJC delivers it all cleanly and powerfully whereas the Edwards Audio was rich but slightly loose in comparison.
This phono stage seems able to place sounds in a 3D sphere in front of you, whereas the Edwards Audio was more of a flatscreen TV, if that makes sense.
I haven't done any critical listening on the differences between running a 47K and 100K resistance load, although the supplied measurement graphs suggests it is possible to improve extension out to 20Khz in 100k mode and remove the upper treble kink/roll off inherent in some MM cartridges. For now I'm just enjoying playing all my records!
The gain switch is proving very useful for headphone listening as my amplifiers headphone out is a bit anemic, so switching into high gain fleshes it out nicely without having to push the volume dial way up.
Lastly, the inclusion of a hefty power transformer as standard is a big plus for me. I understand it, but I get put off by the ploy you often see where an expensive phono stage is sort of undermined by the manufacturer saying 'it's OK now, but you can make it really good with this additional (£3-400) power unit!'. I like knowing that what comes in the box as standard will enable the unit to perform to its best.
Anyway, thanks for the input and suggestions in this thread, and to myles who offered me a good deal on a Simaudio unit, that was very tempting but I'm relieved to have made a decision at last.
Click to expand...

thanks for the review. am really tempted by one as I'm using the phonoe stage in my roksan amp. one query, how long is the supplied cable between the phono stage and the power supply ? i haven't got much rack space left so the power supply would have to go on the floor.
 
Gza said:
thanks for the review. am really tempted by one as I'm using the phonoe stage in my roksan amp. one query, how long is the supplied cable between the phono stage and the power supply ? i haven't got much rack space left so the power supply would have to go on the floor.
Click to expand...

Hi, it's about 135cm end to end. If that isn't enough it would be worth enquiring with the guys at NJC as they can probably supply whatever length you need.
 
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