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New ATCs!

B

bec143

pfm Member
Here is a follow up to my recent “Crank it Up” thread. We went to dem speakers today, after getting annoyed with my old Audio Physic Virgos during my recent TT foray. Thanks to my better half for her patience. Here is what we heard:
  • Harbeth SHL5+: I was excited about these- It is why we went. Half price off due to some small dings and I had read great things. But- a let-down. Engaging midrange but could not see these long term. Just kind of sleepy. Fine but just OK.
  • Spendor A7; These were awesome! Went back and forth several times with them and almost got them. Really nice- they sound so big and full and extended for a medium 2-way.
  • ATC SCM40 v2. These were also great- bigger than the A7s with an extra driver. Didn’t sound much bigger than the A7s, but more presence overall. And very natural sounding from vocals and up and down.
  • Spendor D9.2. These were the biggest disappointment- there was a new pair in a discontinued finish for the same price as the Spendor A7s, when they list for nearly twice as much. So a huge bargain. But despite 4 drivers and twice the size, they were not pleasant to listen to. Boxy and very directional- and very bright. I thought we would get these when I saw they were still around. But the A7s were so much better And the D9s cost $14K new!
  • DynAudio Contour 50- These were bizarre- so bass-heavy that it wasn’t really listenable. Well-rated but bad today.
  • Paradigm – something very big from 15 years ago. My wife wanted to hear something much cheaper and these were only a grand. Great VFM- filled the room across the spectrum. Bass was a bit slow and thudding and overall not so refined. But not bad at all!
So… I bought the ATCs home- after thinking for a minute about a pair of used active ATC 19s. Set them up and they are a big improvement on the Virgos. Anyway- in my attempt to cheaply get some vinyl, I ended up with new speakers. UK built stuff isn’t a great bargain here, but they sound great. I have 7 days to return but they sound like keepers.
 
Nice report!

Frankly, I’m pretty shocked that the VIRGOs are not satisfying.

What are they missing for you in the sound department?
 
SONDEKNZ said:
Nice report!

Frankly, I’m pretty shocked that the VIRGOs are not satisfying.

What are they missing for you in the sound department?
Click to expand...
Maybe I have just become tired of the Virgos- they are some of the very first original Virgos. They have excel at imaging and accuracy and soundstage- but just don't fill the room at normal volumes and sound a bit anemic with terrible bass extension (despite the fact they are supposed to be 35 Hz - 3dB). Both the Spendor A7s and the ATCs are better in these respects.

I bought the ATCs and have a week to decide while listening at home. So far, so good. They do require some watts, and that was an initial concern. But my amp is 100W into 8 ohms and seems t be doing just fine.
 
Could you have tried a subwoofer or 2 with the Virgos? They may have solved the bass extension and given you a more room filling sound.
 
bec143 said:
Maybe I have just become tired of the Virgos..
Click to expand...
It's simple physics. Look at the size of the space your speakers are sitting it. That's a lot of air to move. Now look at the size of the Virgo drive units trying to move it! What you want is a civilized PA speaker and big ATCs are much closer to that.

Again, it underlines how important it is for you to audition things at home. A speaker which sounds great in a small dem roon could be totally lost in your listening room.
 
I auditioned the ATC 40's with Naim NSC222/NAP250/NPX300.
It sounded great.
I went for the active ATC 50s with NSC222 instead - dispensing cost of power amp and power supply.
I'm not sure my newly bought 50 active/222 sounds better than the ATC 40s.

So - enjoy your new purchase!
 
bec143 said:
Here is a follow up to my recent “Crank it Up” thread. We went to dem speakers today, after getting annoyed with my old Audio Physic Virgos during my recent TT foray. Thanks to my better half for her patience. Here is what we heard:
  • Harbeth SHL5+: I was excited about these- It is why we went. Half price off due to some small dings and I had read great things. But- a let-down. Engaging midrange but could not see these long term. Just kind of sleepy. Fine but just OK.
  • Spendor A7; These were awesome! Went back and forth several times with them and almost got them. Really nice- they sound so big and full and extended for a medium 2-way.
  • ATC SCM40 v2. These were also great- bigger than the A7s with an extra driver. Didn’t sound much bigger than the A7s, but more presence overall. And very natural sounding from vocals and up and down.
  • Spendor D9.2. These were the biggest disappointment- there was a new pair in a discontinued finish for the same price as the Spendor A7s, when they list for nearly twice as much. So a huge bargain. But despite 4 drivers and twice the size, they were not pleasant to listen to. Boxy and very directional- and very bright. I thought we would get these when I saw they were still around. But the A7s were so much better And the D9s cost $14K new!
  • DynAudio Contour 50- These were bizarre- so bass-heavy that it wasn’t really listenable. Well-rated but bad today.
  • Paradigm – something very big from 15 years ago. My wife wanted to hear something much cheaper and these were only a grand. Great VFM- filled the room across the spectrum. Bass was a bit slow and thudding and overall not so refined. But not bad at all!
So… I bought the ATCs home- after thinking for a minute about a pair of used active ATC 19s. Set them up and they are a big improvement on the Virgos. Anyway- in my attempt to cheaply get some vinyl, I ended up with new speakers. UK built stuff isn’t a great bargain here, but they sound great. I have 7 days to return but they sound like keepers.
Click to expand...
What sort of amps and other kit were the SCM40s demoed with?
 
Mr Pig said:
It's simple physics. Look at the size of the space your speakers are sitting it. That's a lot of air to move. Now look at the size of the Virgo drive units trying to move it! What you want is a civilized PA speaker and big ATCs are much closer to that.

Again, it underlines how important it is for you to audition things at home. A speaker which sounds great in a small dem roon could be totally lost in your listening room.
Click to expand...
Toaster said:
What sort of amps and other kit were the SCM40s demoed with?
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this Mr. P. Things are not bad near field but it's a big room. Nonetheless I lived with the Virgos for 20 years and enjoyed them. But then moved mostly to Sonos/streaming for everyday listening.

The ATC demo at the store was mostly with a SuperNait 3 but also 222/250. Sources were NSC222, a CD5si, and a Rega p6 (and a little with a Thorens TD-125).

At home I have a YBA Passion Integre, which is a 100W integrated that was their top of line a the time, but is also a bit long in the tooth. Front end is CD5/Hicap, p3/HanaEL/Rega Fono, or Squeezebox+/Benchmark DAC1 (need another shelf for that now).

I will not start upgrading everything again, but wanted something a bit more than the Virgos, which I think I have found withe the SCM40s.
 
dalryc said:
I auditioned the ATC 40's with Naim NSC222/NAP250/NPX300.
It sounded great.
I went for the active ATC 50s with NSC222 instead - dispensing cost of power amp and power supply.
I'm not sure my newly bought 50 active/222 sounds better than the ATC 40s.

So - enjoy your new purchase!
Click to expand...
Thanks! I did think a lot about going active, since my amp is old. Glad to hear the sound is comparable although I love the bigger ATCs. I once had older active 50s at home for a dem.

What do you do about spikes- use them? I have hardwood floors and had my Virgo's on concrete blocks, although not sure any of that made a diferenve,
 
The grills, although a bit ugly, do improve the sound. ATC make great speakers, my system has never sounded better since I went active. Quite simply, it just plays whatever I throw at it, doesn’t tear recordings apart, great at all volumes.
 
bec143 said:
Thanks! I did think a lot about going active, since my amp is old. Glad to hear the sound is comparable although I love the bigger ATCs. I once had older active 50s at home for a dem.

What do you do about spikes- use them? I have hardwood floors and had my Virgo's on concrete blocks, although not sure any of that made a diferenve,
Click to expand...
I've never used the spikes. The speakers are too heavy to move them about. They've been left in same position that the great guys from the shop left them in.
 
bec143 said:
Thanks! I did think a lot about going active, since my amp is old. Glad to hear the sound is comparable although I love the bigger ATCs. I once had older active 50s at home for a dem.

What do you do about spikes- use them? I have hardwood floors and had my Virgo's on concrete blocks, although not sure any of that made a diferenve,
Click to expand...

I have my active 40’s on granite slabs, outriggers removed. Windhoeks rubber bumpers. They sound great!
 
JezmondTutu said:
I have my active 40’s on granite slabs, outriggers removed. Windhoeks rubber bumpers. They sound great!
Click to expand...
Thanks. I assume the outriggers are just for added stability using spikes?

the active 40s seem a great value if you have a amp you want to part with. Although needs a pre
 
bec143 said:
Thanks. I assume the outriggers are just for added stability using spikes?

the active 40s seem a great value if you have a amp you want to part with. Although needs a pre
Click to expand...

Yes, the outriggers are there for stability.

You need to spend a lot of money to get a power amp capable of getting anywhere near to the performance of the active versions, hence they are pretty remarkable value,
 
bec143 said:
I did try two REL subs years ago, never really integrated the way I liked. So far the ATCs seem much better. We'll see..

One question I have is spikes or not on wood floor? I jhad teh Virgos n stone slabs and no spokes. Seemed fine. ATC suggests spikes, which are a pain IMO.

https://flic.kr/p/2pCJDCu
Click to expand...
I love ATCs!

However I must mention that your turntable is WAY TOO CLOSE to the right hand speaker. I hope you don't have problems with LF feedback.
 
chris geary said:
I love ATCs!

However I must mention that your turntable is WAY TOO CLOSE to the right hand speaker. I hope you don't have problems with LF feedback.
Click to expand...
I know- it's temp until I figure out a better setup. Nothing noticeable really but it does have to move. Also need to sort the rack- discontinued color but need a few new shelves fro DAC/streamer and to raise TT.
 
Mr Pig said:
It's simple physics. Look at the size of the space your speakers are sitting it. That's a lot of air to move. Now look at the size of the Virgo drive units trying to move it! What you want is a civilized PA speaker and big ATCs are much closer to that.

Again, it underlines how important it is for you to audition things at home. A speaker which sounds great in a small dem roon could be totally lost in your listening room.
Click to expand...
One thing about the drivers- not so unequal as they look. The ATCs have one 6.4" woofer while the Virgos have two side firing 6" woofers. Abs the Virgos are measured at -3dB down to 35Hz, and the ATC at -6Db at 48 Hz. So the Virgos should really do more bass but they don't, after 20 years of fiddling,

We had the Virgos and ATCs side by side (I know not ideal) for extended A-B-A, mostly at conversational levels (although nothing drives people away like AB testing, so no actual conversations).

What is clear, in my room: The ATCs have more extended bass and that fills out the overall presentation quite a bit. The Virgos are more lifelike with more presence and separation in mid-range on vocals, acoustic instruments, chamber music, etc, despite their old metal tweeter . Overall - Virgos were much better than expected head-to-head and got me thinking again about a sub-Virgos combo again. Which is cheaper and possibly better if well executed.

But I don't want to spend more time on this and will likely sell the Virgos and move on.
 
Got to agree with you regarding the Spendor A7s, I really enjoed a half hour demo of them. Enjoy your new speakers, never heard passive ATCs but love the active ones I've heard.

Cheers BB
 
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