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Brexit: give me a positive effect... XII

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Brian said:
What I find hilarious is your continued ignorance. You’ve been pinning blame on one day in 2016 since the day it happened. Then you complain about being told where responsibility actually lies.
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No I don't find it at all amusing that people are so reluctant to inform themselves.

You are always accusing others of your own shortcomings and ignorance is certainly up there. "Being told" by you eh?

I know where the responsibility lies and it's not with people who voted against Brexit and Johnson, it lies with the people who voted for them and those who won't admit to how they voted, so they can then troll this thread playing both ends against the middle.
 
SteveS1 said:
No I don't find it at all amusing that people are so reluctant to inform themselves.

You are always accusing others of your own shortcomings and ignorance is certainly up there. "Being told" by you eh?

I know where the responsibility lies and it's not with people who voted against Brexit and Johnson, it lies with the people who voted for them and those who won't admit to how they voted, so they can then troll this thread playing both ends against the middle.
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LOL. The ‘troll’ accusation appears again. It’s really tough to cope with, isn’t it? People who don’t agree with your opinion...

So people who won’t announce to the pfm massive how they voted in a referendum are to blame for Brexit?

The conditions for brexit didn’t just happen out of thin air in 2016 and there were plenty of opportunities to avoid the type of brexit we have now. You can be in denial all you like but it won’t alter the facts.

Here are 3 questions for you and those who like every snipe you post.

Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2015 would brexit have happened?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2017 would there be a soft brexit rather than where are now due to the tories?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2019 would there have been a second referendum?

There are 3 chances right there to avoid brexit/hard brexit. All not taken.

The first made more difficult by the hypocritical nationalists in Scotland who now want to do the same again. Utterly insane. The second and third, spurned by the anti-democratic, hard remainers who wanted to ignore the referendum completely.

You and the pfm massive need to understand over 16m people who voted remain do not take your ‘Trumpian’ attitude of ignoring a vote.
 
Brian said:
LOL. The ‘troll’ accusation appears again. It’s really tough to cope with, isn’t it? People who don’t agree with your opinion...

So people who won’t announce to the pfm massive how they voted in a referendum are to blame for Brexit?

The conditions for brexit didn’t just happen out of thin air in 2016 and there were plenty of opportunities to avoid the type of brexit we have now. You can be in denial all you like but it won’t alter the facts.

Here are 3 questions for you and those who like every snipe you post.

Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2015 would brexit have happened?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2017 would there be a soft brexit rather than where are now due to the tories?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2019 would there have been a second referendum?

There are 3 chances right there to avoid brexit/hard brexit. All not taken.

The first made more difficult by the hypocritical nationalists in Scotland who now want to do the same again. Utterly insane. The second and third, spurned by the anti-democratic, hard remainers who wanted to ignore the referendum completely.

You and the pfm massive need to understand over 16m people who voted remain do not take your ‘Trumpian’ attitude of ignoring a vote.
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What a complete load of twaddle. Yes Brian you are a troll and anyone witnessing your constant twisting of people's words as in this little outburst can be in no doubt.

The Tories are there because a faction of them saw how successfully immigration was being weaponised by UKIP and nicked their clothes. People were not forced to go along with that, they chose to. I noted with interest that Keith (KS) was "one of the good guys" until he disagreed with you, then he was subjected to your usual carping and insults. So have many others, if you don't like the troll handle then stop acting like one.

The Scot Nats are no more hypocritcal than Brexiteers denying them the same twisted logic that they justified Brexit with. Both ideas are self harm and should be voted against. The problem is that by voting for one, the case against the other is compromised.
 
SteveS1 said:
What a complete load of twaddle. Yes Brian you are a troll and anyone witnessing your constant twisting of people's words as in this little outburst can be in no doubt.

The Tories are there because a faction of them saw how successfully immigration was being weaponised by UKIP and nicked their clothes. People were not forced to go along with that, they chose to.

The Scot Nats are no more hypocritcal that Brexiteers denying them the same twisted logic that they justified Brexit with. Both ideas are self harm and should be voted against.
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You just get worse. You want to see twaddle just read your own post.

Here’s a tip. Stick with what you actually know, not stuff you make up.
 
Brian said:
You just get worse. You want to see twaddle just read your own post.

Here’s a tip. Stick with what you actually know, not stuff you make up.
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I won't be taking lessons from you on anything, so you can try not wasting your breath. I understand why you don't stick to what you know because you'd have nothing to say.
 
Brian said:
LOL. The ‘troll’ accusation appears again. It’s really tough to cope with, isn’t it? People who don’t agree with your opinion...

So people who won’t announce to the pfm massive how they voted in a referendum are to blame for Brexit?

The conditions for brexit didn’t just happen out of thin air in 2016 and there were plenty of opportunities to avoid the type of brexit we have now. You can be in denial all you like but it won’t alter the facts.

Here are 3 questions for you and those who like every snipe you post.

Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2015 would brexit have happened?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2017 would there be a soft brexit rather than where are now due to the tories?
Q. If Labour had won the General Election in 2019 would there have been a second referendum?

There are 3 chances right there to avoid brexit/hard brexit. All not taken.

The first made more difficult by the hypocritical nationalists in Scotland who now want to do the same again. Utterly insane. The second and third, spurned by the anti-democratic, hard remainers who wanted to ignore the referendum completely.

You and the pfm massive need to understand over 16m people who voted remain do not take your ‘Trumpian’ attitude of ignoring a vote.
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In response to your 3 questions, if my auntie had bollocks she’d be my uncle.

The fault for not voting for Labour lies with Labour for being a shit opposition party and not giving the voters a credible option. It lies not with remainers, but with English voters, many hard of thinking northern types who bought into right wing agitated xenophobia and believed the lies about Brexit and Tory “economic competence”.
 
Brian, the democracy king castigates remainers for being anti-democratic for not accepting a dodgy referendum.
Brian, the democracy king castigates non-labour voters and doesn't accept that Tories, who have won the last 3 general elections, are the peoples choice as government.
Cognitive dissonance anyone?
 
It looks like the other ones in Hartlepool are are going to give their old party a good Brexit-style kicking tomorrow. No yeah but/ no but/ you said/I said- they’re going to put a big X in the Conservative Party box ( once they’ve found it).
 
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eisenach said:
So, it's out tomorrow in French, and in October in translation; Barnier's diary of the Brexit negotiations.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ls-betrayals-uk-post-brexit-future-barnier-eu

Sounds like it might be a fun read. :)

Amazon UK's only got it in the Kindle edition so far: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B092RFK9C4/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21
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This bit stuck out
Barnier never saw the point of Brexit, he confesses, and, visiting a capital a week in a marathon effort to forge and maintain EU27 unity, gives the notion of “Global Britain” short shrift. “I do wonder what, until now, has prevented the UK from becoming ‘Global Britain’, other than its own lack of competitiveness,” he writes. “Germany has become ‘Global Germany’ while being firmly inside the EU and the eurozone.”

The trolls on this thread are exactly like the UK politicians all Tory involved in the negotiations. Just bang the same monotonous drum again and again. Disappear from the thread when the conversation verges on difficult subjects but then re-emerge to drone on about irrelevant nonsense. Deny reality, repeat ad nauseam.
 
This site contains affiliate links for which pink fish media may be compensated.
Colin L said:
In response to your 3 questions, if my auntie had bollocks she’d be my uncle.

The fault for not voting for Labour lies with Labour for being a shit opposition party and not giving the voters a credible option. It lies not with remainers, but with English voters, many hard of thinking northern types who bought into right wing agitated xenophobia and believed the lies about Brexit and Tory “economic competence”.
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They've also bought into Boris's magic money narrative - something about levelling up.
 
These bits resonated with me, too:

He confesses to being frankly “stupefied” by the Lancaster House speech in which May laid out the early UK’s red lines. “The number of doors she shut, one after the other,” he marvels on 17 January 2017. “I am astonished at the way she has revealed her cards … before we have even started negotiating.”

Ending the jurisdiction of the European court of justice, halting free movement, leaving the single market and customs union, ending EU budget payments: “Have the consequences of these decisions been thought through, measured, discussed? Does she realise this rules out almost all forms of cooperation we have with our partners?”
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As late as May 2020, Barnier records his surprise at the UK’s continued demands for “a simple Canada-type trade deal” while still retaining single market advantages “in innumerable sectors”. There remains “real incomprehension, in Britain, of the objective, sometimes mechanical consequences of its choices”, he writes.
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It must sometimes have felt like negotiating with a toddler.
 
eternumviti said:
"Barnier never saw the point of Brexit."

No shit Sherlock.
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With what he witnessed, hardly surprising. Your PM....

"When one of Barnier’s 60-member team explains to Britain’s new prime minister the need for customs and quality checks on the Irish border, Barnier writes, it was “my impression that he became aware, in that discussion, of a series of technical and legal issues that had not been so clearly explained to him by his own team."

Raaab.

“There is something in his look that surprises me,” writes Barnier of Raab. “He is no doubt fired up by his mission, but I am not sure we will be able to go into the detail of the negotiation with him, take account of facts and realities.”

May

He confesses to being frankly “stupefied” by the Lancaster House speech in which May laid out the early UK’s red lines. “The number of doors she shut, one after the other,” he marvels on 17 January 2017. “I am astonished at the way she has revealed her cards … before we have even started negotiating.”

But the problem was Barnier eh?
 
tonerei said:
This bit stuck out
Barnier never saw the point of Brexit, he confesses, and, visiting a capital a week in a marathon effort to forge and maintain EU27 unity, gives the notion of “Global Britain” short shrift. “I do wonder what, until now, has prevented the UK from becoming ‘Global Britain’, other than its own lack of competitiveness,” he writes. “Germany has become ‘Global Germany’ while being firmly inside the EU and the eurozone.”

The trolls on this thread are exactly like the UK politicians all Tory involved in the negotiations. Just bang the same monotonous drum again and again. Disappear from the thread when the conversation verges on difficult subjects but then re-emerge to drone on about irrelevant nonsense. Deny reality, repeat ad nauseam.
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Well, the big new idea is paying for a new royal yacht to show global Britain is back. People are quite rightly questioning how a nation as wealthy as Britain can still have its citizens living off 2.5 million emergency food parcels last year but still expect them to pay through their taxes for a royal yacht.

Maybe they’ll buy it from a shipyard in the world’s third largest exporting nation- Germany.
 
tonerei said:
"I do wonder what, until now, has prevented the UK from becoming ‘Global Britain’, other than its own lack of competitiveness,” he writes. “Germany has become ‘Global Germany’ while being firmly inside the EU and the eurozone. "
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Perfectly reasonable point, one worthy of its own thread.

tonerei said:
The trolls on this thread are exactly like the UK politicians all Tory involved in the negotiations. Just bang the same monotonous drum again and again. Disappear from the thread when the conversation verges on difficult subjects but then re-emerge to drone on about irrelevant nonsense. Deny reality, repeat ad nauseam.
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I don't think difficult subjects make me 'disappear' from the thread, Tony, though I have to say that I've seen you do the bunk on a pretty regular basis.

Incidentally, referring to someone as a 'troll' simply because they happen to disagree with you is borderline, if not actual, bigotry.
 
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