I was up to speed with the rest of it, I just didn't know if this was a full time project or a sideline whilst he designed/made kit for other brands etc.
The John Westlake/Lakewest MDAC/FDAC, VFET and Detox
- Thread starter Tony L
- Start date
I was up to speed with the rest of it, I just didn't know if this was a full time project or a sideline whilst he designed/made kit for other brands etc.
Stunsworth
pfm Member
It's been a sideline. John has designed other products - I own one of them, a Pro-Ject S2 Pre DAC.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
That's how it has turned out. It's not exactly how it seemed at the beginning.
Stunsworth
pfm Member
Indeed, my original assumption was that it was going to be a full time project with relatively short timescales.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
Just to clarify. No one actually has any idea what John has or has not been doing for the last 6 years. In the ealry days I remember with amusement that we were told from time to time that he had been (almost literally) slaving away working all night to finish the project. It's baffling.
JohnW
pfm member
We have a listening session arranged for the DevDAC verse the Chord Dave (completely different price bracket) the last weekend in January so I have a very fixed / immovable timeline to have the DevDAC ready for listening.
Jareks midway though exams at Uni so has not been able to complete the software that I need for testing of the latest hardware... although once he has time free-up we can move quickly.
I'm very sorry for this delay - beyond my control - but I have made good progress with the FDAC.
I expect Jarek to work basically fulltime over the Christmas period so we can issue the Production version PCB first week in January - giving me a month to build and test for the listening session at the end of the month.
Jareks midway though exams at Uni so has not been able to complete the software that I need for testing of the latest hardware... although once he has time free-up we can move quickly.
I'm very sorry for this delay - beyond my control - but I have made good progress with the FDAC.
I expect Jarek to work basically fulltime over the Christmas period so we can issue the Production version PCB first week in January - giving me a month to build and test for the listening session at the end of the month.
JohnW
pfm member
Not sure what this is in reference too, but DevDAC is DAC/Pre with no internal streamer, this will be ready and January for listening sessions...
JohnW
pfm member
Indeed the chassis has been very problematic - however we met a vendor in HK / China a few months ago that seems very keen so I'm counting on this route for the DevDAC chassis.
I dont want to say the issues of chassis has been resolved, but atleast I have a promising option.
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
But -if the production version PCB is going to be ready in the first week of January then what is being done to get on with get on with actually producing it and the chassis?
What needs to be done and what is being done to bring this about? Where is the spec for the chassis, what would the rice be, when could it be delivered?
What has the listening session in January got to do with it? Will all the PCB's be in production by then or Is it just a chance to decide to change the PCB again?
What needs to be done and what is being done to bring this about? Where is the spec for the chassis, what would the rice be, when could it be delivered?
What has the listening session in January got to do with it? Will all the PCB's be in production by then or Is it just a chance to decide to change the PCB again?
You could be in for a positive surprise. I had the DAVE at home - twice - compared against my current discrete DAC (1/4th of DAVE price) + only half decent usb streamer + HQPlayer at the time. DAVE could not keep up in many respects but still very decent performance.
To be honest I would have preferred the DAVE to outdo that combo for simplicity alone...
killie99
pfm Member
We need something better than a 'promising option' or else this is going to turn out to be the show stopper that grinds this project to a halt. The chassis needs to be spec'd , priced and samples built ASAP. The sample will probably have to be redone at least once before we have a production ready unit and this all takes time, in my experience LOTS of time.
Mikas
pfm Member
Glad to see a new fresh thread. Thanks Tony!
Anyway, one more year has come and almost gone.
Even if the project produces something, I admit I'm not at all comfortable having to add to the £400 already invested, another £250 - £300 or whatever for the PCB to see the final product.
I suspect that the initial funding was long gone (I see it as R&D, design, lab costs) and any product hardware manufactured will now have to be totally covered by that PCB extra budget.
As good as the design may be, I'm not sure it will get the deserved quality parts including PSU, box, buttons, display, DSP, software design, assembly, etc for the extra £250~£300.
Michael
Anyway, one more year has come and almost gone.
Even if the project produces something, I admit I'm not at all comfortable having to add to the £400 already invested, another £250 - £300 or whatever for the PCB to see the final product.
I suspect that the initial funding was long gone (I see it as R&D, design, lab costs) and any product hardware manufactured will now have to be totally covered by that PCB extra budget.
As good as the design may be, I'm not sure it will get the deserved quality parts including PSU, box, buttons, display, DSP, software design, assembly, etc for the extra £250~£300.
Michael
JohnW
pfm member
Glad to see a new fresh thread. Thanks Tony!
Anyway, one more year has come and almost gone.
Even if the project produces something, I admit I'm not at all comfortable having to add to the £400 already invested, another £250 - £300 or whatever for the PCB to see the final product.
I suspect that the initial funding was long gone (I see it as R&D, design, lab costs) and any product hardware manufactured will now have to be totally covered by that PCB extra budget.
As good as the design may be, I'm not sure it will get the deserved quality parts including PSU, box, buttons, display, DSP, software design, assembly, etc for the extra £250~£300.
Michael
MIchael,
The initial funding is the the "Development sponsorship" it helps to partially fund the development, which as you rightly say it has ... It has always been that the development sponsors would then have a production slot reserved for the PCB / product "At Cost".. this "At Cost" is EXTRA to the development sponsorship... this has ALWAYS been the case, and the situation has not changed.
If you would rather wait for early feedback from the first units then this is understandable - I'm expecting the first production batch to be 20 - 30 pcs...
Pleas don’t start the development fee again .
¨
I’m sure everybody knew that they where participating in a crowd funding project. We played some cash (some of us a lot) and hoped to get a product. That is the risk of participating in crowd funding. Of course we all hoped for the world best dac/amp delivered within 10 days, but things takes time.
It has taken longer than expected, but great to hear that someone can review the dac next month.
¨
I’m sure everybody knew that they where participating in a crowd funding project. We played some cash (some of us a lot) and hoped to get a product. That is the risk of participating in crowd funding. Of course we all hoped for the world best dac/amp delivered within 10 days, but things takes time.
It has taken longer than expected, but great to hear that someone can review the dac next month.
JohnW
pfm member
This is TOTALLY incorrect; the development sponsorship for the DAC/ Detox has ALWAYS been this – a development sponsorship, there has never a change in this policy. The development sponsor then has the right to purchase the DAC "At Cost" - there has NEVER been a suggestion of a "deposit" – only in the fact that a “At cost” production slot is reserved for the development sponsor…
This is a valid point which I really hope will not happen.
Further refinements must be left to FDAC.
Space is the Place
pfm Member
I think context is everything.
If you'd have said at the start you wont see a return on your investment/sponsorship, or a product until two years time you'd have had Zero sponsors.
That it's 5 or 6 years now... and some -like the gentlemen above who's a pensioner and quite a few more on this thread- have invested thousands in products (VFET's) that are no nearer completion is just plain wrong.
We've been offered the "moon on a stick" and we've not even got the stick yet
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ti33er
pfm Member
“I am concerned that the "January listening session" may reveal "shortcomings" that require serious reconfiguration of the design and redirection of the project.”
I suspect John will listen to the final A03 spin before this time; and as version A02 is the predecessor (on the PnP machine being pressed out currently as I understand things) it should just be a refinement of A02?
...so long as the DevDAC sounds a bit better than the MDAC, that was the goal from the outset; after all this time it’s likely so let’s try get into the Christmas spirit and Santa might bring us a Chinese New Years present ;-)
I suspect John will listen to the final A03 spin before this time; and as version A02 is the predecessor (on the PnP machine being pressed out currently as I understand things) it should just be a refinement of A02?
...so long as the DevDAC sounds a bit better than the MDAC, that was the goal from the outset; after all this time it’s likely so let’s try get into the Christmas spirit and Santa might bring us a Chinese New Years present ;-)