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TeddyCap vs HiCap DR for Naim Supernait2

Hello! I have owned all of Naim's power supplies and all of of Teddy's.

Here is my observation:

Teddy Power supplies:
flat sounding, wide soundstage,ultra low noise,light tight bass
low maintenance, cost effective,compact

Naim power supplies:
more dynamic,more air, fatter bass,more top end shimmer,"creamier",more depth ,more room decay,need recapping, hum from case,clumsy

It boils down to components,room acoustics,etc.. I think adding any power supply to a SN2 defeats the purpose of having an integrated amp. But if going that route I would choose Hicap DR. The Teddy I tried didnt seem to improve the sound. It was just different.
 
In my case the Teddy PSU turned out to be better than the HCDR with my SN2. But I have the TeddyPardo I80A anyways...and my SN2 sits on a shelf as a backup.
 
ryder said:
Since you now have the Teddycap Mk3, you are able to determine whether the unit will bring any difference to your Naim Supernait2 isn't it? From my experience, the Teddycap will surely bring some benefits, a cleaner and more refined sound. The real question is the difference between the Teddycap and Hicap DR.

Perhaps after getting the Hicap DR and comparing it with the Teddycap in your system, you can then let us know on the differences?

Cheers.
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Supernait 2 has a clean refined sound, add ons IMO a total waste of money.
 
analogmusic said:
You have Sn2 which has internal DR Hicap DR will sound like the SN2 alone.
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So are you saying that the addition of a Hicap DR is not an upgrade?

I thought the additional psu gave separate power supplies to the pre and the power sections ofthe SN2 to improve the performance. .
 
Minio said:
So are you saying that the addition of a Hicap DR is not an upgrade?

I thought the additional psu gave separate power supplies to the pre and the power sections ofthe SN2 to improve the performance. .
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That has been a real lengthy discussion on the Naim Forum. Community there agrees that it is an upgrade but not so much as with the previous SN2. In my case - as I said - it has been an upgrade, but it also costs money, needs to sit on a different level or a different rack and so on. It needs to run in, you should keep it running 24/7. All in all not worth it and with the Pardo Integrated Amp being a lot better, there is no reason for any of these two PSUs.
 
Then there is the Avondale'd TPR4 Snaps, which may or may not be better than all of them. I like Porridge, but this morning i had Muesli.
 
Chris68 said:
... it has been an upgrade, but it also costs money, needs to sit on a different level or a different rack and so on. It needs to run in, you should keep it running 24/7. All in all not worth it and with the Pardo Integrated Amp being a lot better, there is no reason for any of these two PSUs.
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I use a Teddycap with my SN2 and enjoy the extra refinement. I know what you mean in that extra boxes become a bit boring after a while, what with the extra rack space, extra power consumption, cables etc.

It's always been the Naim way though. There must surely be a SN3 in the future. I wonder if the same upgrade philosophy will come with that!
 
I've done this comparison with the original SuperNait back in the day. I've also compared Naim XP5XS with TeddyXPS on my Naim DAC. Currently I use SN2 + HCDR.

So I used to have the original SN with DualTeddyCap as my first Naim gear around six years ago. Then I got HiCap2 for comparison and ended up buying it.

As someone said here earlier, Teddy's PSU's change the sound and to my ears, sound more hifi than Naim. Naim's own PSU's just enhance the already great sound of SN/2 and is more faithful to the original sound. Also it's BS that it's waste of money to go for a PSU upgrade on SN/2 amplifiers. It fully depends on your speakers and how easy load they are for the amp. With my ATC SCM40v2 speakers, HCDR is a must. I recently tried to unplug it and lost tons of control on the low end. The setup came unlistenable. ATC is very power hungry so without the PSU upgrade, SN2 doesn't have enough juice for them. But as a combo, they drive my speakers very nicely. If you have more sensitive speakers then bare SN2 is probably more than enough to drive them.

With XP5XS and TeddyXPS it was a much closer call. I'd say I slightly preferred TeddyXPS then. It had better overall control of the sound and low end was tighter. I still ended up keeping my Naim DAC bare without PSU. This way the sound is best balanced in my setup.
 
Definitely an improvement in bass control with the TC added. I've just plugged this upgrade back in and I'm quite surprised at the improvement I'm getting using Spotify for source.- not the most aspiring of source choices.

My Momentums are fairly demanding so I could be experiencing the same effect as Patu. The improvement is quite significant. Bass control being essential to timing.
 
As someone who doesn't want to (or can't afford) going the NAIM separates route, then the HiCapDR becomes perhaps a tempting idea as a SN2 owner. Many past SN2 owners are either still happy or have gone the N272 or 282 + 250DR route. Some have also gone the SN2 + 250DR route. The 250DR is a stretch for me, so future upgrades for me are limited most likely to the HiCapDR (or Teddy equivalent), the eventual SN3, or even going full Teddy.

One reason I have not jumped on the HiCapDR wagon is the constant back and forth: with or bare or the Teddy option. Seems to be very little consensus.

Continued feedback here is welcome.
 
I had an SN2 and the Hicap DR definitely does improve it. For me, it wasn't the bass that improved, but it added a level of three dimensionality and depth of tonal colour that the bare SN2 lacked.

But then you have a very expensive two box amplifier and at that price there are a lot of other options out there that you may like better.

I didn't like mine enough to keep it, so I sold it and went in another direction.
 
I know this will rise some eyebrows, and discussions will arise, but nonetheless, since I can't stand hypocrisy:

Months ago, a good friend of mine, who runs a precision metal manufacturing company decided to start building excellent stands for the Harbeth line, and opened a thread here to make people aware of his products.

He was immediately reproached by a few members, who prompted him to move to the trade forum and register as trade member. In short, he had a very cold welcome, without even being able to say anything about his beautiful stands.

But I see that Teddy Pardo – and, occasionally, Les @ Avondale – are always allowed to take part in discussions regarding their products here in the Audio forum, without any limit or control, which, in my view, constitutes a serious conflict of interest and a violation of good taste in business. Now Teddy has posted a whole 'review' from a customer, which I suppose will be considered as 'technical information'. Sometimes ago I opened a thread asking who had familiarity with a certain product, which I don't even remember, and the third reply was a nasty innuendo at my possible personal interest in the trade. So, how does it work..?

I have nothing personal vs either Pardo or Les, but I can't accept that discriminations of whatever kind are done. And, if of general interest and to prevent remarks, I have done the very same kind of claim on the Naim forum, where members of the trade have sometimes – but not nearly as much, and with such impunity, as here – free space to talk about their own business.

Or perhaps there are members and members?
 
Patu said:
May I ask, what was this direction and why?
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First, I should explain that I bought the SN2 in an attempt to downsize from my Exposure system of MCX preamp and 16 mono power amps, which are three large and heavy boxes. I knew there would be some compromises but the SN2 was just too big a downgrade.

I found the SN2 to be rather thin and monochrome sounding, even with the HCDR. It had decent bass but there was no fullness of sound. The defining moment for me was when I was listening to a very familiar Mozart piano concerto, and was wondering where the orchestra had gone. With my Exposure amps the orchestra sounds full and rich, and the massed violins have body and texture. With the SN2 the violins sound papery and skeletal. I knew then that the SN2 was not for me. In addition, going from the SN2 to the Exposure amps was like going from black and white to technicolor.

I also have a Tron Seven preamp and have just ordered the Convergence mono amps to go with it. The Tron gear is a little different again, but very colourful and highly musical.

The cost of an SN2 and HCDR should buy you an amplifier competitive with anything out there. But it doesn't. I know you can achieve much better sound going further up the Naim hierarchy, but the prices become obscene and even then, frankly, it's not all that good. Again, you can get much better sound for less elsewhere.
 
SN2 = very good Amp
SN2 + HCDR = not bad, slight improvement
SN2 + TeddyPSU = clear improvement
Teddy Pardo I80A = better than any of the above

I have owned them all, ran detailed comparisons, sold all the PSU, still keep the SN2 as a backup and happily run the I80A at 2800,-€ vs. 4500,-€ for the SN2 only.

So what's the point anyways? Just kidding...

Chris
 
Thanks Chris

I am also quite interested to try Teddy's PR 1 preamp and ST60 power amp, but does the your I180 boogie as much as the Supernait 2?

Which source are you using with your SN and also with your Teddy amp, and which speakers, which speaker cables?

How is the I180 better than SN2?
 
Chris68 said:
SN2 = very good Amp
SN2 + HCDR = not bad, slight improvement
SN2 + TeddyPSU = clear improvement
Teddy Pardo I80A = better than any of the above

I have owned them all, ran detailed comparisons, sold all the PSU, still keep the SN2 as a backup and happily run the I80A at 2800,-€ vs. 4500,-€ for the SN2 only.

So what's the point anyways? Just kidding...

Chris
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My experience with the HCDR vs Dual Teddycap Mk3 is they sound different rather than one sounding better than the other. In my case both Naim and Teddy power supplies were used with the NAC 282 and NAP 250 DR rather than the Supernait 2.

One thing that I concur is the Teddy gear represents great value for money. Good to know the Teddy I80A is working out for you.
 
This just shows how different we all are in terms of our musical preferences etc. I have a SN2 and it was greatly improved by the addition of a HCDR - it was certainly not lacking in body or fullness before, but with the HCDR it's much more an elegant, sweet yet muscular performer. This is into KEF LS50s.

RossB said:
First, I should explain that I bought the SN2 in an attempt to downsize from my Exposure system of MCX preamp and 16 mono power amps, which are three large and heavy boxes. I knew there would be some compromises but the SN2 was just too big a downgrade.

I found the SN2 to be rather thin and monochrome sounding, even with the HCDR. It had decent bass but there was no fullness of sound. The defining moment for me was when I was listening to a very familiar Mozart piano concerto, and was wondering where the orchestra had gone. With my Exposure amps the orchestra sounds full and rich, and the massed violins have body and texture. With the SN2 the violins sound papery and skeletal. I knew then that the SN2 was not for me. In addition, going from the SN2 to the Exposure amps was like going from black and white to technicolor.

I also have a Tron Seven preamp and have just ordered the Convergence mono amps to go with it. The Tron gear is a little different again, but very colourful and highly musical.

The cost of an SN2 and HCDR should buy you an amplifier competitive with anything out there. But it doesn't. I know you can achieve much better sound going further up the Naim hierarchy, but the prices become obscene and even then, frankly, it's not all that good. Again, you can get much better sound for less elsewhere.
Click to expand...
 
RossB said:
I had an SN2 and the Hicap DR definitely does improve it. For me, it wasn't the bass that improved, but it added a level of three dimensionality and depth of tonal colour that the bare SN2 lacked.

But then you have a very expensive two box amplifier and at that price there are a lot of other options out there that you may like better.

I didn't like mine enough to keep it, so I sold it and went in another direction.
Click to expand...

I found the standard SN2 to be excellent , so would be interested to know what you have ended up with.
 
analogmusic said:
Thanks Chris

I am also quite interested to try Teddy's PR 1 preamp and ST60 power amp, but does the your I180 boogie as much as the Supernait 2?

Which source are you using with your SN and also with your Teddy amp, and which speakers, which speaker cables?

How is the I180 better than SN2?
Click to expand...

. I very much doubt if the SN2 can be bettered by any other integrated amplifier especially one using jfets using accurate natural sounding speakers.
 
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