New ATCs!

[Patu]

I auditioned the ATC 40's with Naim NSC222/NAP250/NPX300.
It sounded great.
I went for the active ATC 50s with NSC222 instead - dispensing cost of power amp and power supply.
I'm not sure my newly bought 50 active/222 sounds better than the ATC 40s.

So - enjoy your new purchase!

How do you like the 50's with NSC222? This a nice combination and a very simple setup. Would be interesting to demo NSC222 with the 50's.

I run my 50ASL's with T+A DAC200 (streamer is Holo Red) and upsample everything to DSD256 with HQPlayer. Simply a superb sound quality with a very simple setup.

 

[JezmondTutu]

One thing about the drivers- not so unequal as they look. The ATCs have one 6.4" woofer while the Virgos have two side firing 6" woofers. Abs the Virgos are measured at -3dB down to 35Hz, and the ATC at -6Db at 48 Hz. So the Virgos should really do more bass but they don't, after 20 years of fiddling,

We had the Virgos and ATCs side by side (I know not ideal) for extended A-B-A, mostly at conversational levels (although nothing drives people away like AB testing, so no actual conversations).

What is clear, in my room: The ATCs have more extended bass and that fills out the overall presentation quite a bit. The Virgos are more lifelike with more presence and separation in mid-range on vocals, acoustic instruments, chamber music, etc, despite their old metal tweeter . Overall - Virgos were much better than expected head-to-head and got me thinking again about a sub-Virgos combo again. Which is cheaper and possibly better if well executed.

But I don't want to spend more time on this and will likely sell the Virgos and move on.

My 40’s have prodigious amounts of bass. Far more so than any other speaker I’ve owned which is nuts given they are sealed cabinets. I believe they are equivalent to most 8” bass drivers btw.

 

[bec143]

My 40’s have prodigious amounts of bass. Far more so than any other speaker I’ve owned which is nuts given they are sealed cabinets. I believe they are equivalent to most 8” bass drivers btw.

Thanks. the bass is quite good and balanced - didn't mean to say otherwise. My room is just tough. Your actives also bring more control to the driver I am sure.

 

[JezmondTutu]

Thanks. the bass is quite good and balanced - didn't mean to say otherwise. My room is just tough. Your actives also bring more control to the driver I am sure.

I don’t honestly know. Mine are a bit too near the wall and my listening position is a bit too near the rear wall so that does re-enforce the bass sometimes. Even so, they are very powerful sounding speakers, more so than the likes of Shahinian Obellsks that I have owned before,

 

[Patu]

I used to own 40 passives with Naim gear and then changed to 40A's... there was way more bass with the actives. But it's quite obvious when you think of it. Active amplification with ~235W of power per speaker compared to a integrated amplifier (Naim SN2) with 2x80W power. Active 40's were a first time I had problems with bass in my room back then. They just hit so hard with so much power that it overpowered the room and woke up the room mode. No such problems with the passives, but then again the bass was weaker and loose compared to the actives.

 

[dalryc]

How do you like the 50's with NSC222? This is an interesting combination and a very simple setup. Would be interesting to demo NSC222 with the 50's.

I run my 50ASL's with T+A DAC200 (streamer is Holo Red) and upsample everything to DSD256 with HQPlayer. Simply a superb sound quality with a very simple setup.

I originally demo'd a NSC222 with NAP250 plus NPX 300 with passive ATC 40s.
I wanted active but wasn't convinced about spending £6k on a PSU so upgraded to the 50s instead.
It doesn't sound as exciting as the original combo so I may try a home demo of the NPX300 - but still £6k on a power supply that still buzzes and hums is pretty poor in my opinion.

 

[Patu]

I originally demo'd a NSC222 with NAP250 plus NPX 300 with passive ATC 40s.
I wanted active but wasn't convinced about spending £6k on a PSU so upgraded to the 50s instead.
It doesn't sound as exciting as the original combo so I may try a home demo of the NPX300 - but still £6k on a power supply that still buzzes and hums is pretty poor in my opinion.

Well I think you made a right choice with the 50's. I've owned 40, 40A and now 50ASL. Classic series is a clear step up, even though 40A's are extremely good speakers and value for money.

 

[dalryc]

Well I think you made a right choice with the 50's. I've owned 40, 40A and now 50ASL. Classic series is a clear step up, even though 40A's are extremely good speakers and value for money.

For the money, 40's ARE exceptional.
I think the 50's are a more accurate to the real sound.

I come from liking planar speakers - big Quads, big Maggies - but found them unusable with cats around thinking they are scratch posts.

 

[Woodface]

ATC are honest with their specs, not sure other brands are. They do go low.

 

[Henricus]

It's simple physics. Look at the size of the space your speakers are sitting it. That's a lot of air to move. Now look at the size of the Virgo drive units trying to move it! What you want is a civilized PA speaker and big ATCs are much closer to that.

Again, it underlines how important it is for you to audition things at home. A speaker which sounds great in a small dem roon could be totally lost in your listening room.

That space is not too large for the Virgos. It probably has to do with incorrect placement.
Audio physic setup

 

[Patu]

For the money, 40's ARE exceptional.
I think the 50's are a more accurate to the real sound.

I come from liking planar speakers - big Quads, big Maggies - but found them unusable with cats around thinking they are scratch posts.

The biggest difference going from 40A to 50ASL was the power and authority... realism. You can really feel the music in your body with this size speakers. 40A couldn't quite deliver in this regard. You can hear the similarities between the two though.

 

[bec143]

That space is not too large for the Virgos. It probably has to do with incorrect placement.
Audio physic setup

Right. I spent a lot of time on all that AP setup info years ago. It does help with the holographic image stuff, although that's easy to dial in, albeit that requires listening from a pretty restricted spot..

Didn't do the bass much good- I had the Virgos the proscribed distance from a back wall most of the time, which they say is the key for bass response. I didn't find that to be the case over the past 20 years. Although it was better when listening from the back wall. The room configuration I need to live with one side wall is open on one side (see pic). That may not help reinforce bass, bu sure doesn't hurt the imaging.

Maybe the Virgos were never the ideal speaker for me but I liked them plenty for a long time.
Regardless, the SCM40s are handling the room much better with a much tighter and lower and pronounced low end.

https://flic.kr/p/2pBC29C

 

[Rosie]

Smooth open fast musical and detailed with succulent satisfying bass , try AE Corinium . If I understood it right tweeter and mid driver in a vented sealed box , I know that's a contradiction it's a vent hole rather than a port and the slot on the bass section has a unusual loading . I could go on but it's a stonker .

 

[Alex S]

I don’t think you’ll do better than the SCM40s in that space, apart from active ones. If you did go active, there are options, some of which have room correction.

 

[Woodface]

The biggest difference going from 40A to 50ASL was the power and authority... realism. You can really feel the music in your body with this size speakers. 40A couldn't quite deliver in this regard. You can hear the similarities between the two though.

I will do a home audition of these when time & funds allow. As much as I love the 40s it was 50s that I really wanted but couldn’t stretch to.

Unfortunately they are pretty much twice the cost.

 

[JezmondTutu]

I used to own 40 passives with Naim gear and then changed to 40A's... there was way more bass with the actives. But it's quite obvious when you think of it. Active amplification with ~235W of power per speaker compared to an integrated amplifier (Naim SN2) with 2x80W power. Active 40's were a first time I had problems with bass in my room back then. They just hit so hard with so much power that it overpowered the room and woke up the room mode. No such problems with the passives, but then again the bass was weaker and loose compared to the actives.

Interesting as I have the same issue on some tracks. On most music they just sound awesome though!

 

[Featsdont]

I recently acquired second hand ATC SCM40A’s which I’m feeding with a Linn Selekt Organik preamp.

So far I’m really enjoying them. They replace Sonus Faber Sonetto V and Naim NAP 300DR - which were physically too big for the room (the speakers!) and which I was finding too bass heavy.

The ATCs are detailed but not as analytical as I expected. There’s plenty of bass where needed but no bloat.
I’m still running through my playlists but very happy so far. They also impose on the room less being shorter and less deep than the Sonus F.

 

[Patu]

The ATCs are detailed but not as analytical as I expected. There’s plenty of bass where needed but no bloat.
I’m still running through my playlists but very happy so far. They also impose on the room less being shorter and less deep than the Sonus F.

40's are actually quite an easy listen with the ATC in-house tweeter and always so lovely ATC midrange element. Two-way models are more analytical sounding IMO, though my experience is limited to 19A's.

I will do a home audition of these when time & funds allow. As much as I love the 40s it was 50s that I really wanted but couldn’t stretch to.

Unfortunately they are pretty much twice the cost.

It's quite a leap. I got a great exchange deal from my dealer but it was still a huge investment. 50's are pretty much an endgame speakers for me so it's an investment for future

Interesting as I have the same issue on some tracks. On most music they just sound awesome though!

Originally I used Linn's space optimisation to help with the room modes, but later on I actually measured my setup with REW and UMIK-1 and have made DSP filters which tackle the room mode issue with precision. I use an advaned DSP method called Virtual Bass Array. Linn's Space Optimisation wasn't that good when I measured what it actually does to the response.

 

[Woodface]

40's are actually quite an easy listen with the ATC in-house tweeter and always so lovely ATC midrange element. Two-way models are more analytical sounding IMO, though my experience is limited to 19A's.

It's quite a leap. I got a great exchange deal from my dealer but it was still a huge investment. 50's are pretty much an endgame speakers for me so it's an investment for future

Originally I used Linn's space optimisation to help with the room modes, but later on I actually measured my setup with REW and UMIK-1 and have made DSP filters which tackle the room mode issue with precision. I use an advaned DSP method called Virtual Bass Array. Linn's Space Optimisation wasn't that good when I measured what it actually does to the response.

I’m in the same mindset, they will be endgame for me.

 

[tenpercenter]

The active 20’s sounded better balanced compared to active 40’s in a medium sized room when I listed to them recently. Bass timed better with a variety of different music