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MQA arrives on Tidal

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It has also been pointed out that for much (most?) recent pop music, it will not be possible to identify a single ADC, as the recording/producing of each instrument will have been done separately, using different equipment and often even in different studios.

A lot (most?) of the MQA recordings would have originally been recorded in analogue not digital.

My hunch is that most of the MQA albums that were recorded digitally are classical, and so wouldn't be affected by a mix of original recordings combined into one final master.
 
A lot (most?) of the MQA recordings would have originally been recorded in analogue not digital.

My hunch is that most of the MQA albums that were recorded digitally are classical, and so wouldn't be affected by a mix of original recordings combined into one final master.

They will almost all have gone through some digital pre-processing and been passed between locations in digital form. Most stuff recorded since the '80s has.

In any case, I suspect Werner's hunch is correct: the compensation for the original ADC is probably a pretty crude 'either X or Y' and quite a bit more basic than the marketing might lead one to believe.
 
A lot (most?) of the MQA recordings would have originally been recorded in analogue not digital.

My hunch is that most of the MQA albums that were recorded digitally are classical, and so wouldn't be affected by a mix of original recordings combined into one final master.
Hmmm are there fewer classical releases or post 1985 rock releases in the mqa catalogue, tough call looking at the tidal masters list.
Of course we then have to wonder whether the old analogue rock recordings have much above 16 khz.

I was googling for a spectrum of the doors and found an archived thread about the doors in hi rez incidentally where you posted this.
http://www.steveunsworth.co.uk/Misc/Break_on.png

Frustratingly I couldn't see whether you had managed to get the spectrum plot above 15khz
 
Hmmm are there fewer classical releases or post 1985 rock releases in the mqa catalogue, tough call looking at the tidal masters list.
Of course we then have to wonder whether the old analogue rock recordings have much above 16 khz.

I was googling for a spectrum of the doors and found an archived thread about the doors in hi rez incidentally where you posted this.
http://www.steveunsworth.co.uk/Misc/Break_on.png

Frustratingly I couldn't see whether you had managed to get the spectrum plot above 15khz

The benefits of MQA are not only meant to extend to the frequency response. It is also supposed improve the transient behaviour - this is not my area of expertise by any means.

Apologies for not having any more information about the screenshot I posted, I think it was a while ago when I posted it.
 
Maybe "MQA" have come up with an algorithm that has a go at fixing a track that has already been mixed.

Or maybe they can only do tracks where the original multi-track masters still exist?

Here's a thought. Perhaps what MQA does in the decoding is to pulse the DAC in such a way that it produces an additional sine wave simultaneously which supplements and/or cancels the flaws in the "master wave"?

Maybe a little bizarre but it would explain is why it has to be on the playback side, too, and why it has to be hardware based.

Both 'unfolding' and 'bitstacking' require a decoder. That much is clear from the info made public in the MQA patents and papers.

The problem with making assumptions about how the originals were recorded and 'guess the ADC' pretty much ensures, I suspect, most times they'd be wrong. Too many variables.

Trying to do so by analysis of the results falls into what signals engineers know as the 'deconvolution problem'. You can sort out trivial cases, but not complex one like real music.

If the ADC matters, so does the choice of microphones, their placement, the amps and cables, etc, etc. They could all affect the timing alignment. And analogue recorders vary. On that topic old-time recording engineers could probably tell some tales! Plus in pop/rock areas the people making and balancing may well have fiddled with everything in sight to get what they decided 'sounded good'. Perhaps with no idea what some of the sliders or boxes did. Possibly not noting down all the details.


The 'additive pulse' idea isn't really different from describing the process in other ways. Mathematically, you can define these things in various ways.

Personally, I suspect the 'orgami' process does, indeed, simply add a burst of HF which produces a result that isn't the same as what went in to the encoder, but 'adds salt' to make it sound similar. But this is simply a suspicion I have.

However so far as I can tell, the 'unfolding' (MQA decoding) will still leave the spurious anharmonics it used to 'hint at' the folded down into.

In itself, the above seems fine if people prefer it *and* they are being told what is going on. However, beyond the obvious question of what they are preferring it *to* not being the actual sorce version, it brings me back to the more basic question:

Since you can make similar reductions in the required stream rate or file size by 'open and free' methods that *preserve* the input HF timing alignment, etc, *without* any need for a 'decoder' or 'folding down the HF, what's the point MQA? Why have something that mimics the source when you could have the source?

I can see why the *music companies* might prefer MQA here. They can sell people the same music yet again whilst clutching the source to their hearts until they start offerring something 'better than MQA' in the next decade. But why would end-users prefer this merry-go-around *given any say in the matter*?
 
The benefits of MQA are not only meant to extend to the frequency response. It is also supposed improve the transient behaviour - this is not my area of expertise by any means.

Apologies for not having any more information about the screenshot I posted, I think it was a while ago when I posted it.
I've downloaded from Quobuz and done a spectrograph - actually it looks as though there might be material up there. Anyone?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/801nf1vwlb0gd3t/CropperCapture[1].jpg?dl=0
 
Found a quick method to get anything in the 2L store into Tidal in MQA from your iPad.
Go to the 2L Music Store, pick an album, select MQA as if you are buying it, press one of the purple buttons with the wiggley line. This will open it in the Tidal app, this will be the MQA version, favourite it. It will now appear in Roon as the MQA version. All without using the desktop app.
 
I've downloaded from Quobuz and done a spectrograph - actually it looks as though there might be material up there. Anyone?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/801nf1vwlb0gd3t/CropperCapture[1].jpg?dl=0
There is a lot of harmonics which might be real or might be harmonic distortion.
Also see some isolated bursts of >30kHz as 1:20 and 5:55 which I cannot think of any real explanation for unless there was a bat in the studio. An aliasing or DRM artifact is more likely
 
There is a lot of harmonics which might be real or might be harmonic distortion.
Also see some isolated bursts of >30kHz as 1:20 and 5:55 which I cannot think of any real explanation for unless there was a bat in the studio. An aliasing or DRM artifact is more likely
focussing on the spectrum around 1:20
https://www.dropbox.com/s/p16og56fj6201uq/spectrum.jpg?dl=0

Is 17-35khz noise or signal? 35khz upwards looks weird.
 
Too 'peaky' to be signal?
Do you mean the stuff about 35khz it seems odd to have it in isolation with not much below. I've no idea what it means. Anyway I just wanted a peak at the regular doors stuff on 24/96. It certainly wasn't brickwalled at 22khz but beyond that I'm not sure what conclusion to draw.
 
Do you mean the stuff about 35khz it seems odd to have it in isolation with not much below. I've no idea what it means. Anyway I just wanted a peak at the regular doors stuff on 24/96. It certainly wasn't brickwalled at 22khz but beyond that I'm not sure what conclusion to draw.

All the way up from 35kHz to 50kHz: it's a series of sharp peaks and valleys that look more like artefacts than signal to me.
 
Switched mode power supply noise maybe or someone was using a cellphone near some badly shielded electronics?
You could filter the LF out and then pitch shift down by a factor of 4 to see if it is music related, but I doubt it
 
Wrote up a few observations on my blog:

http://gadgets.itwriting.com/3540-more-on-mqa-and-tidal-a-few-observations.html

One of the things I find interesting is that the Tidal master of Remain in Light seems to be different and superior to any of my CDs. I don't know if for example HD Tracks has an equally good master.

Tim

Looks like I made a slightly unfortunate choice, in that Remain on Light on Tidal is a different mix, possibly a fold-down from the 5.1, which accounts for it sounding different from the CD! It is still OK as a demo of MQA though.

Tim
 
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