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Labour Leader: Keir Starmer VII

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droodzilla said:
Russ Jones (aka The Week in Tory) has a good explanation of the Natalie Elphicke business:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788596363275509853

Essentially, Starmer is playing 5D chess, while his critics mistakenly belive he's playing draughts.
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Labour has policies? What will they do in the 1st hundred days to define their new Government? Set a Tory budget!
They're all such lightweights that it will take them at least two years to learn what their ministries really do, by which time voters will have had enough!

The policies that people associate with Labour are the policies of the left - that's the great irony.
 
droodzilla said:
Russ Jones (aka The Week in Tory) has a good explanation of the Natalie Elphicke business:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788596363275509853

Essentially, Starmer is playing 5D chess, while his critics mistakenly belive he's playing draughts.
Click to expand...
To be fair, *if* Labour were pursuing the populist economic policies that Tory voters like but haven’t been voting for because of teh Tribalism, then this would at least make sense.

But Labour *aren’t* following those economic policies, would rather die than follow them: they are simply adding right wing populist social policies to their (unpopular) right wing economic policies in timeworn neoliberal fashion, and there is no strategy beyond pwning Sunak and giving the finger to their own supporters.

Is that a good and sustainable strategy? I don’t know, I see some potential problems with it long term, but WTF would I know, I supported Corbyn who LED LABOUR TO ITS BIGGEST DEFEAT SINCE 1935.
 
droodzilla said:
Russ Jones (aka The Week in Tory) has a good explanation of the Natalie Elphicke business:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788596363275509853

Essentially, Starmer is playing 5D chess, while his critics mistakenly belive he's playing draughts.
Click to expand...
While people like Elphicke might be thick enough to vote for a Corbyn policy if presented by Starmer, I see no reason to believe that Starmer has any intention of delivering anything Labourish. Any step towards anything Labourish will be accompanied by two steps in the other direction.
 
As was to be expected, the Elphicke defection is being used to drag Labour policy to the right: it wasn’t just a bit of harmless panto, much less cover for their left wing policies (lol):

“'It is significant to be here with Natalie Elphicke, who as Dover's MP has seen the consequences of dangerous boat crossings.'

@YvetteCooperMP adds 'she has concluded that Sunak's approach is not working and is supporting Labour's approach'”

 
Seanm said:
As was to be expected, the Elphicke defection is being used to drag Labour policy to the right: it wasn’t just a bit of harmless panto, much less cover for their left wing policies (lol):

“'It is significant to be here with Natalie Elphicke, who as Dover's MP has seen the consequences of dangerous boat crossings.'

@YvetteCooperMP adds 'she has concluded that Sunak's approach is not working and is supporting Labour's approach'”

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Labour has adopted a policy of cruelty no matter he cost.

Strange how easily Labour’s ironclad fiscal rules are applied and ignored according to a right wing economic agenda
 
Seanm said:
As was to be expected, the Elphicke defection is being used to drag Labour policy to the right: it wasn’t just a bit of harmless panto, much less cover for their left wing policies (lol):
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Purely and simply to give Sunak a bloody nose. She’s standing down anyway and couldn’t give a feck how it plays with Tory or Labour voters. The fact that Starmer welcomed her with open arms though…

I wonder if there’s going to come a time when Nandy, Rayner et al realise they’ve been played like fiddles? It’s gonna be shit. Really, really shit.
 
gavreid said:
Labour has policies?
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... if you don't like them…well, they have others.

2488.jpg
 
I think the current Labour ethos is: come join the party, the more the merrier, but no antisemites (=bad press) and be a part of the winning team.

lol
 
Minio said:
I think the current Labour ethos is: come join the party, the more the merrier, but no antisemites (=bad press) and be a part of the winning team.
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The most antisemitic thing one can possibly do in the current climate is to conflate and associate Jewish people with the extreme-right genocidal apartheid bloodbath of Israel, yet our our political mainstream and their press seem determined to do so. History will eventually recognise it as the deeply racist far-right propaganda rhetoric it is. It is as ugly as any racist caricature in Der Stürmer or whatever.
 
Finnegan said:
Purely and simply to give Sunak a bloody nose. She’s standing down anyway and couldn’t give a feck how it plays with Tory or Labour voters. The fact that Starmer welcomed her with open arms though…

I wonder if there’s going to come a time when Nandy, Rayner et al realise they’ve been played like fiddles? It’s gonna be shit. Really, really shit.
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I don't think Nandy or Rayner had to be tricked into any of this, they're very enthusiastic participants, nothing half-hearted about the way they've shafted their ostensible allies on the left. It's possible they thought they *were in on the trick*, when it was left wing members being lied to, and didn't expect to get shafted themselves. But really how thick would you have to be.

 
Tony L said:
The most antisemitic thing one can possibly do in the current climate is to conflate and associate Jewish people with the extreme-right genocidal apartheid bloodbath of Israel, yet our our political mainstream and their press seem determined to do so. History will eventually recognise it as the deeply racist far-right propaganda rhetoric it is. It is as ugly as any racist caricature in Der Stürmer or whatever.
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It's quite interesting that we don't see opinion polls regarding support or otherwise among UK Jews for the destruction of Gaza. I have had a pretty good look my guess is that numbers are not as strongly supportive as the likes of the Jewish Chronicle would wish them to be.

We do know that there was a strong feeling in the past that Jewish people felt that they were held responsible in some way for the actions of Israel.
 
She disgraces herself and the past. I'm not sure that John Pisspot or even Mandy or Derek Draper would have played footsie with the likes of Oakeshot on the telly.
 
Seanm said:
I don't think Nandy or Rayner had to be tricked into any of this, they're very enthusiastic participants, nothing half-hearted about the way they've shafted their ostensible allies on the left. It's possible they thought they *were in on the trick*, when it was left wing members being lied to, and didn't expect to get shafted themselves. But really how thick would you have to be.

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Yes of course, I was more kinda wondering if there will come a time they’ll realise they sold their souls for nothing. Nandy is, to be frank, a bit dim. She was probably just excited that she got to play with the big boys. Rayner knows better, she has deliberately renounced her background to climb the slippery slope. Maybe she is aware that Starmer and Rees simply keep her as an adorable little working class lap dog and, beneath the veneer, have nothing other than contempt for her.
 
gavreid said:
We do know that there was a strong feeling in the past that Jewish people felt that they were held responsible in some way for the actions of Israel.
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The definition of racism as I understand the term is assigning collective attributes, behaviours or mindsets to a whole race of people, and our establishment is right up to its neck in that at present.

By deliberately conflating criticism of Netanyahu’s unhinged far-right child-killing bloodbath with antisemitism the UK state has debased us all and placed our own Jewish population at great risk.

I’m genuinely ashamed of the way the UK has behaved throughout this whole situation. I see what the country I live in actually is far clearer now than at any point in my life. I have little if any remaining respect for it or those who falsely claim to represent us in leading it. They do not speak for me and many millions of others. Making us all complicit in another nation’s genocide and ethnic cleansing has to be as low as a political class can possibly stoop. Vile grifters like Cameron and Sunak standing there with their wallets open whilst children are butchered and a whole environment is destroyed by absolute monsters debases us all. Every last one of us is stained by their actions. The hollow man Starmer is more to blame than anyone. A man given a vast platform and too cowardly to use it. Even to save children. I’m sick of the lot of them. Absolute scum.
 
The problem with Owen Jones is that he’s generally wrong. If Labour do the opposite of what he says they will be in Government.

I’m not a fan of Lammy cosying up to Trumps team, ultimately it’s just what every British government does, keep America onside.
 
Woodface said:
The problem with Owen Jones is that he’s generally wrong. If Labour do the opposite of what he says they will be in Government.

I’m not a fan of Lammy cosying up to Trumps team, ultimately it’s just what every British government does, keep America onside.
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Come to that, any recent, say post the 7th, examples of him being wrong?
 
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