you mean I have made the same point before, of course. Just as all the rest of you have.
People routinely ask similar questions, of course they get similar replies. The fact that you think differently is neither here nor there.
It is just like trying to 'repair' a Rolex by sticking a Timex mechanism in it the watch will work well enough, but it certainly isn't a Rolex anymore. Worse, people buyings second-hand cartridges has to ask themselves, ' How do I know what I am actually buying? '. People on PFM are honest, but a lot of other people may not be. I know of several people who got their fingers burnt. I would not touch a used cartridge unless I knew and trusted the owner.
Fortunately, I now use a cheap MM so it's one problem I no longer have.
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The reality is that Koetsu's are one of the most popular of cartridges when it comes to re-tipping (particularly the older, more sought after, ones). Unfortunately, whilst the owners of said cartridges are happy, Koetsu retailers are less so as they make no profit and so are keen on promoting negative re-tipping FUD.
Paskin, wasn't it your Koetsu selling dealer mate who got caught out on the forums pretending to be his own, 'wildly impressed', customer - I seem to remember it was? Didn't you rush in with personal reassurances that he was completely innocent only to be embarrassed to find he was, in fact, completely guilty?
To be honest, your stance on this subject (in fact, most audio subjects) reads like a thinly disguised advertisement/promotion for said dealer 'friend'.
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The reality is that Koetsu's are one of the most popular of cartridges when it comes to re-tipping (particularly the older, more sought after, ones). Unfortunately, whilst the owners of said cartridges are happy, Koetsu retailers are less so as they make no profit and so are keen on promoting negative re-tipping FUD.
Worse, people buyings second-hand cartridges has to ask themselves, ' How do I know what I am actually buying? '. People on PFM are honest, but a lot of other people may not be. I know of several people who got their fingers burnt. I would not touch a used cartridge unless I knew and trusted the owner.
There's probably a very good reason for this, as they know that any Sugano San cart. which goes back to Koetsu comes back as an effectively brand new Sugano Son cart. and at great cost and inconvenience, so they're on a hiding to nothing anyway.
Personally, I think the more modern Koetsus are probably better than the older ones, but there's a groundswell of opinion from old Koetsu lags that the old ones are the best ones; however, nothing lasts forever, and re-tipping is the ONLY show in town if you're a purist.
He also did the Supex carts and early Linn MC carts. The only time I liked the LP12 was my unmodified table with Ittok and Troika. Never heard a Supex but keep looking out for one to try.
All my cartridges from 1964 until about six years ago were new from wholesalers, manufacturers or dealers, the latter two usually being part of a t/t package or traded in.
My first (Koetsu) was bought used relatively locally and I heard it in his system. That served me well and is probably still serving the next buyer.
My second (Koetsu) was virtually new from a dealer at a surprisingly low price, and has given me four years of great pleasure.
I've just bought my third (a Benz) from an utterly reliable vinyl afionado as an experimental departure from Koetsu, and at first listen I am very impressed.
My fourth is yet to come, but probably soon, and will be a used one again.
When you get to that kind of territory, and you want to taste other flavours, buying new, with 20% to the government regardless of any discount and then running it in, is okay for the well-heeled or those who couldn't care tuppence about depreciation and cost of use, although you do get that initial peace of mind.
Even buying new from a dealer, how do you know that what you're buying is going to float your boat and be compatible with your system? Affixing and properly setting up a higher level cart. is one of the trickiest and time-consuming functions of any dealer who will do so, and he'll want his pound of flesh (and rightly so).
Buying used hifi is not without risk, but due to the extremely delicate and fragile nature of cartridges, this risk is, i.m.o., exacerbated to quite some degree. Therefore, building a relationship based upon information and trust is vital prior to transacting, especially if buyer and seller are poles apart geographically.
Luckily, there are quite a few genuine, approachable and dedicated audiophiles out there; long my that continue.
Linn were the importer/distributor of Grace and Supex. When they introduced the Asak and Ittok the Grace/Supex agency transferred to Russ Andrews. I think there were some nice Grace MM carts (F9E?) that date from that period. Koetsus started appearing at about the same time as the Asak, but via Absolute Sounds, which obviously meant they were crap and worse than a Linn Basik (which were rebranded AT carts).Knew about the Supex but not about the early Linn cart's. The only moving coil I remember was the Asak, which was very UN-Koetsu-like. Think the Supex was the first m/c sold with early LP12s, but I stand to be corrected.
Linn were the importer/distributor of Grace and Supex. When they introduced the Asak and Ittok the Grace/Supex agency transferred to Russ Andrews. I think there were some nice Grace MM carts (F9E?) that date from that period. Koetsus started appearing at about the same time as the Asak, but via Absolute Sounds, which obviously meant they were crap and worse than a Linn Basik (which were rebranded AT carts).
IIUC the Asak/Karma/Troika were manufactured by the same business that made Supex cartridges. So, if Sugano was responsible for early Supex designs there may be some Koetsu DNA in them.
The Troika is a very fine cart given a compatible arm, and seems to respond well to retipping and servicing by the likes of Expert.
Paul
The Grace MM arrived after Linn passed on the agency. I don't know if Linn ever distributed Grace products beyond the G707 arm. Or Supex other than the SD900.I thought the Grace was a tonearm, Paul, before they introduced their Basic and Tiktok ones (which were imported anyway).
Had a Karma for a few years; nice cart. but surely not a Koetsu tonally, if my memory serves.
Yep, looks like mine.
Just chatted to Wyndham at ESCo: they're on holiday until the 11th August, but it will most likely go back then. Third time lucky...