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Carillion

ks.234 said:
Listening to Today this morning it seems that Hedge funds have been betting on .....Carrion..... going bust for a while now..
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Freudian slip? A very good one, as 'carrion' will become quite relevant, I feel.

The hedge funds have been shorting Carillion for about a year, and are to a fair extent responsible for the share price fall and subsequent price collapse last summer. With a low share price, Carillion's debts mounted and it was (almost) unable to get credit to continue. Overall, though, it's bad management, I suppose. Just two years ago, this company was a share pick.

The entire support services section of the FTSE 250 hasn't been too wonderful for some time, while the FTSE generally has been on the up and up. A lot of fingers burnt and a big mess to clear up.
 
You've all missed the main point. Following the Brexit vote, the appropriate government departments have been disrupted to such a degree that contract signings / updates / renewals, payments and other administrative procedures to keep the wheels turning have been neglected.

Thanks to Brexiteers we are now looking at potentially 20,000 people on the dole. It's all their fault. It's an absolute disgrace.
 
Mike Reed said:
The hedge funds have been shorting Carillion for about a year, and are to a fair extent responsible for the share price fall and subsequent price collapse last summer. With a low share price, Carillion's debts mounted and it was (almost) unable to get credit to continue. Overall, though, it's bad management, I suppose. Just two years ago, this company was a share pick.
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Seems to me to be as a result of the hedge fund managers (bankers), yet we prefer to blame the
government.

Smacks of George Soros and the ERM crisis of 1992.

Just seen the above post, I should have realised it has been caused by Brexit, as is the cold snap arriving tomorrow.
 
Carillion primarily failed because it was over-burdened with debt, which is a result of incompetent governance.
Putting the blame on short sellers is incorrect, and lets those actually responsible off the hook.
 
richgilb said:
.

Thanks to Brexiteers we are now looking at potentially 20,000 people on the dole. It's all their fault. It's an absolute disgrace.
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Actually, it shows that leaving the EU will have no effect on how badly our country is run. Money will continue to be funnelled into the private companies run by Tory donors.

These companies put in unrealistically low bids that are designed to drive the companies who provide realistic costings to the wall. Then when fan and faeces come together the directors walk away with millions and the tax payer picks up the tab.

Stephen

(PS I know you were being sarky).
 
Maybe the people in charge of Carillion could build one more prison and throw themselves in it!
 
Philip Green (oh no, not another one) chairman of Carrilion, was an advisor to David Cameron and a is Tory donor, he also has a CBE.
 
richgilb said:
You've all missed the main point. Following the Brexit vote, the appropriate government departments have been disrupted to such a degree that contract signings / updates / renewals, payments and other administrative procedures to keep the wheels turning have been neglected.

Thanks to Brexiteers we are now looking at potentially 20,000 people on the dole. It's all their fault. It's an absolute disgrace.
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How wrong you are. It is clearly the fault of the Tories who are trying to give all their rich pals more money in the private sector.
 
Carillion contracts such as PFI and others will probably have clauses built in that will trigger in the event of the company failure. News is already in where some contracts have been taken in house. It remains to be seen what will happen to the rump of the company after that.
 
Rodrat said:
I dont suppose governments will ever learn that putting public sector work in the hands of the private sector is a recipe for disaster.
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The biggest problem is not the principle of privatising out stuff, it's the application. Public sector contracts are pathetically weak; if you contract out, they should hold the risk nut IME, the contractor never has to bear the pain when it all goes t*ts up. The root causes are numerous but the two I can think of straight away are:

1 - Allowing a company to go to the wall causes unemployment and is a vote loser.
2 - People who can write good contracts end up working for the contractors who pay better.
 
dweezil said:
Exactly, I thought this was made illegal years ago but obviously not.
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Just to be clear, this isn't about money going missing from the fund but the funds that have been put in not matching the actuarial cost of the benefits accrued in a final salary scheme. Still rubbish for the members, just not illegal.
 
Seeker_UK said:
The biggest problem is not the principle of privatising out stuff, it's the application. Public sector contracts are pathetically weak; if you contract out, they should hold the risk nut IME, the contractor never has to bear the pain when it all goes t*ts up. The root causes are numerous but the two I can think of straight away are:

1 - Allowing a company to go to the wall causes unemployment and is a vote loser.
2 - People who can write good contracts end up working for the contractors who pay better.
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In my experience, no matter how good the contract, if one of the parties goes bust then the other party is stuffed. You can try to construct the contract in such a way as to mitigate potential losses either way, but once a party becomes insolvent the contract is as good as void. Third party guarantees are hugely expensive and often impossible to obtain and difficult to enforce. Carillion took the risk and have gone bust. All parties will be losers.
 
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