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Beolab 50 - addressing the speaker/room interface.

I appreciate your perspective.

We shall have to agree to disagree: I didn't find the 5's, 9's, 8000's, or the aforementioned 150s (Which are a large standmount, regardless of how many or how big the drivers were, to the other chap who felt this compromised my comparison to the Heybrook HB3's) to be not very good VFM and really, on the whole, not terribly satisfying as complete systems.

I haven't heard the 90's or the 50's. But from what I've read, and seen, these represent a different magnitude of hi-fi experience to their previous stuff over the past 3 decades.

I don't know why this has become a great debate here: the 8000's were simply overpiced lifestyle products. Nice looking. Great reliability. And no better than a Nakamichi Receiver/CD changer/and some KEF bookshelves for 1/4 the cost. Or less.

I don't think the same can be said for the 90's. that's what I'm saying.

Audiophiles seldom agree on different brands/marques of kit, and some have very entrenched views - I well remember the time I received a most unusual PM on this very forum; having dared to publicly state that my then new Sony amp was superior to my existing Naim electronics, this particular PM invited me to 'come out the back to sort it out' - i.e. fisticuffs. Naturally I would've preferred pistols at dawn, but unfortunately 'he' was in England and I'm in Australia. So the invitation was politely ignored..lol.

If I've learned anything over many decades being involved in Hifi and the audiophile world, it's that apart from speakers, most kit sounds far more alike than different - regardless of the sales and other hype associated with it.

So yes, with respect to the Beolab 9's, 3's and 5's, we politely disagree and that's fine. If there was a perfect HiFi system, we'd all have it and nothing else.

Having said that, many style conscious people wouldn't let much audiophile kit have house space either, no matter how good it was acoustically, and one needs to respect that, as Hifi is after all, lifestyle consumer goods - even the most vaunted brands - despite what some marketeers try and have you believe.

Have you heard the Beolab 90's BTW?

Cheers.
 
You're not wrong. Possibly slightly upmarket Bose. When we used to get their electronics through our workshop they were full of Philips made pcbs and parts.

Seeing as B&O are reputed to make some of the best HiFi speakers today it would be interesting to see how many on this forum actually owned a pair!

A pair of Beolab 9's

A V1-40 TV

Oh, and three Becom telephones

Cheers
 
Are these current models with all the tech as discussed earlier in the post, i.e Beolab 50?



Having the the most advanced loudspeaker research and test facilities in the world doesn't mean you are going to produce the best sounding loudspeakers. A lot of audio companies today like B&O are marketing equipment based on advanced technology and that does not always equate to a realistic reproduction of music.

FWIW quite a lot B&O dealers in the south east have closed up shop and gone.

Interesting perspective.

Geoff Martin was the gentleman in the video I linked to explaining the features and design philosophy of the new Beolab 50.

He has a Bachelor of Music degree in Pipe Organ performance, another degree as a Tonmeister, a Doctorate (PhD) in Acoustics, and was a University lecturer before being head hunted by B&O.

Eminently qualified as both an musician of the highest calibre, as well as an acoustic engineer in the design of the Beolab 90 & 50 in my view.

Cheers
 
You're not wrong. Possibly slightly upmarket Bose. When we used to get their electronics through our workshop they were full of Philips made pcbs and parts.

Seeing as B&O are reputed to make some of the best HiFi speakers today it would be interesting to see how many on this forum actually owned a pair!

Graham: I have tremendous respect for your products and (be reputation) your service. But I'm surprised about your perspective on certain things:

1) the new 90's. These aren't in the same caliber/league of their previous offerings over the past multiple years. Come on. It's obvious. Scan speak drivers, attention to detail, and while the general hi-fi journalism world can be wrong, when they ALL agree on something, there's usually something to it. I'm the first person to say that a pair of 8000's were crapola for big bucks....but this is something different. No? Thoughts?

2) Saying that their demographic is small and that people in the big-bucks side of things would sooner get a pair of Magico....to my mind runs completely contrary to reality. MOST people with bazingo bucks (male or female with either gendered spouse who may themselves be either golddiggers or simply bring their own cash to the table) want convenience and simplicity and familiarity over anything. They buy B&W's based on knowing the brand and never test driving. They buy boats and don't use them. They buy cottages for one month of the year. Unless they happen to be audiophiles with money (note: a small sliver of the venn diagram AP(Int)MON) they'd much sooner, when time to get a system for the lounge/great-room/new condo/house/living room/Dahling new Summer home Dahling, simply drive to a B&O store, look at the speakers that have sex appeal, and say "I'll take that".

I'm sorry but our experiences as retailers runs very contrary if you feel that most people in the "have money need audio system" market would be sooner jumping for Dan D'agostino and Avant Gardes.

And again, I'd like to clarify, I have the fullest respect for your components and service.
 
Audiophiles seldom agree on different brands/marques of kit, and some have very entrenched views - I well remember the time I received a most unusual PM on this very forum; having dared to publicly state that my then new Sony amp was superior to my existing Naim electronics, this particular PM invited me to 'come out the back to sort it out' - i.e. fisticuffs. Naturally I would've preferred pistols at dawn, but unfortunately 'he' was in England and I'm in Australia. So the invitation was politely ignored..lol.

If I've learned anything over many decades being involved in Hifi and the audiophile world, it's that apart from speakers, most kit sounds far more alike than different - regardless of the sales and other hype associated with it.

So yes, with respect to the Beolab 9's, 3's and 5's, we politely disagree and that's fine. If there was a perfect HiFi system, we'd all have it and nothing else.

Having said that, many style conscious people wouldn't let much audiophile kit have house space either, no matter how good it was acoustically, and one needs to respect that, as Hifi is after all, lifestyle consumer goods - even the most vaunted brands - despite what some marketeers try and have you believe.

Have you heard the Beolab 90's BTW?

Cheers.


I have absolutely not heard them. And I'd like to. I am judging them solely based on what I've read, seen, and my experience in terms of analyzing design vs. performance. I absolutely will withold final judgement until I've heard them.

I have heard the 8000's, 150s, 9's, 3's, and 5's.
 
I have absolutely not heard them. And I'd like to. I am judging them solely based on what I've read, seen, and my experience in terms of analyzing design vs. performance. I absolutely will withold final judgement until I've heard them.

I have heard the 8000's, 150s, 9's, 3's, and 5's.

Regarding earlier B&O speakers, I don't have a lot of experience/knowledge - I first became aware of them in the early 80's, when as a newcomer to Australia I discovered a dealership in the city.

I absolutely adored the style, but also knew a great deal less than I know now about what works and what doesn't in HiFi, so wasn't really in a position to make an 'educated' assessment of them. I did think though that their TV's were ahead of anything else I'd seen in terms of picture and especially sound quality.

At the time I owned a Rait amplifier (copy of a Radford) TD 125 Mk11/SME 3009/V15 Shure TT & a pair of B&W DM2a's, and whilst visiting interstate heard in a friends home a B&O system of speakers which were similar size to the DM2a's (no idea which model) a B&O TT with the tangential arm, and the Beomaster amp - I think the 5000 - silver front with the clear perspex sliding controls for bass/treble etc - this was in the very early 80's.

I thought the sound very similar to my own setup - certainly on par if not better in some areas, and not as good in others, so similar, but different, but certainly very good.

If my memory serves correctly, at one point in the intervening decades, Philips owned majority shares in B&O, albeit in due course B&O bought those shares back, but that may part explain the earlier point made about Phillips PCB's etc being in the products and less than stellar build quality.

My experience and real appreciation (apart from the amazing style) of B&O began with the Lab 5.

I've now heard the Beolab 90 around 4 times - first at a dealership and lastly at a recent HiFi show - held as usual in a large hotel.

What was interesting about that was the array of competition: JBL Everests, B&W 800D's, a Naim system with Focal speakers and amplification costing circa A$100k, Quad Electrostatics, various horns and other exotic high end speaker designs such as one usually only sees at a high end audio show, all resplendent with the obligatory wrist thick speaker cables and shiny gadgets etc.

Some of it sounded great, others sounded dire - as usual the 'room' was given as the problem in some rather 'difficult' demonstrations.

I attended with a friend who has a good ear and owns electrostatics; both of us felt that when it came to the most authentic sound at the show, by which I mean which system most realistically portrays music with authentic and natural tonal timbre, transient response and dynamics to afford the most realistic involvement in the emotional message of the music, and spatial perspectives reminiscent of live performance, along with stunning resolution, it was the Beolab 90's by a country mile.

They dynamics and scale of something like a JBL Everest, with the sense of utter neutrality, clarity and finesse of something like the B&W 800D is one way of describing the sound.

The other is that speaking as a trained classical musician, the Beolab 90 is without doubt the most authentic sounding speaker I have ever heard, and at any price.

Notwithstanding of course the likes of Steinway Lyngdorf systems, or MBL Radialstrahler, neither of which I have heard, but I have little doubt the Beolab 90 is up in that league.

Do try and have a listen if you can - they're more about revolution than evolution when it comes to HiFi as we have known it. And now we have the new Beolab 50 offering a great deal of what the Beolab 90 offered, but at a much more approachable price.


Cheers
 
Here are some pictures of the new Beolab 50 as posted on Beoworld forums - this with a 75" Avant.


IMG524065810.jpg



The wooden lamellas are mounted on a frame which can be detached - other finishes including aluminium are in the works apparently.


IMG524065875.jpg



Front view, grill off


IMG524065898.jpg



Side view


IMG524065919.jpg



Top view showing lens



IMG524065936.jpg




And again



IMG524065950.jpg



Pictured with 55" TV



IMG524079190.jpg



Back view; do note that in plan view the speaker is semi triangular - that is three faces; the back two faces have an additional 10" woofer in each, in addition to the one in the front.

So three woofers, three midrange drivers and one tweeter. Each woofer and each midrange driver has it's own amplifier, DAC and DSP with respect to active room compensation and acoustic 'beam' width (or polar response) control of the speaker.

The tweeter also has it's own amplifier and DAC, as well as the effective dispersion of the ALT lens being variable by adjustable/motorised cheeks in the lens.


IMG524079210.jpg



Trust that I'm not inadvertently breaking any interforum protocols by linking these pictures from Beoworld forums, posted as they are by members there; admins please delete if any issues.

Otherwise, thought you all might like some pictures in situ so to speak - the early comments as to the sound from those who have heard them, are shall we say, very exciting.

Enjoy

Cheers
 
I had the tom to buy what I wanted in speakers .. the speaker that I *really* wanted to hear compared to my Giya G1 spirits was the Beolab 90 .. none on the ground here in South Africa..such a pity..on paper it looked like the business.
 
Graham: I have tremendous respect for your products and (be reputation) your service. But I'm surprised about your perspective on certain things:

1) the new 90's. These aren't in the same caliber/league of their previous offerings over the past multiple years. Come on. It's obvious. Scan speak drivers, attention to detail, and while the general hi-fi journalism world can be wrong, when they ALL agree on something, there's usually something to it. I'm the first person to say that a pair of 8000's were crapola for big bucks....but this is something different. No? Thoughts?

2) Saying that their demographic is small and that people in the big-bucks side of things would sooner get a pair of Magico....to my mind runs completely contrary to reality. MOST people with bazingo bucks (male or female with either gendered spouse who may themselves be either golddiggers or simply bring their own cash to the table) want convenience and simplicity and familiarity over anything. They buy B&W's based on knowing the brand and never test driving. They buy boats and don't use them. They buy cottages for one month of the year. Unless they happen to be audiophiles with money (note: a small sliver of the venn diagram AP(Int)MON) they'd much sooner, when time to get a system for the lounge/great-room/new condo/house/living room/Dahling new Summer home Dahling, simply drive to a B&O store, look at the speakers that have sex appeal, and say "I'll take that".

I'm sorry but our experiences as retailers runs very contrary if you feel that most people in the "have money need audio system" market would be sooner jumping for Dan D'agostino and Avant Gardes.

And again, I'd like to clarify, I have the fullest respect for your components and service.

I didn't realise you were in the 'trade ' Yucky?
Keith
 
Thanks for the pics, Jonboi - they look great, and certainly impressive from a technological POV.

Still too expensive for me, but perhaps there is a Beolab 30 coming along at some point.
 
Have B&O ever designed and manufactured a loudspeaker drive unit? IIRC even in the stratospherically expensive 90s you are buying off-the-shelf SEAS. Nothing wrong with that as they are damn good drivers, but when you think of all the companies that can design and make everything (Quad, Tannoy, JBL, Kef, B&W, Klipsch etc etc etc) the fanboism seems a little odd.
 
Regarding earlier B&O speakers, I don't have a lot of experience/knowledge - I first became aware of them in the early 80's, when as a newcomer to Australia I discovered a dealership in the city.

I absolutely adored the style, but also knew a great deal less than I know now about what works and what doesn't in HiFi, so wasn't really in a position to make an 'educated' assessment of them. I did think though that their TV's were ahead of anything else I'd seen in terms of picture and especially sound quality.

At the time I owned a Rait amplifier (copy of a Radford) TD 125 Mk11/SME 3009/V15 Shure TT & a pair of B&W DM2a's, and whilst visiting interstate heard in a friends home a B&O system of speakers which were similar size to the DM2a's (no idea which model) a B&O TT with the tangential arm, and the Beomaster amp - I think the 5000 - silver front with the clear perspex sliding controls for bass/treble etc - this was in the very early 80's.

I thought the sound very similar to my own setup - certainly on par if not better in some areas, and not as good in others, so similar, but different, but certainly very good.

If my memory serves correctly, at one point in the intervening decades, Philips owned majority shares in B&O, albeit in due course B&O bought those shares back, but that may part explain the earlier point made about Phillips PCB's etc being in the products and less than stellar build quality.

My experience and real appreciation (apart from the amazing style) of B&O began with the Lab 5.

I've now heard the Beolab 90 around 4 times - first at a dealership and lastly at a recent HiFi show - held as usual in a large hotel.

What was interesting about that was the array of competition: JBL Everests, B&W 800D's, a Naim system with Focal speakers and amplification costing circa A$100k, Quad Electrostatics, various horns and other exotic high end speaker designs such as one usually only sees at a high end audio show, all resplendent with the obligatory wrist thick speaker cables and shiny gadgets etc.

Some of it sounded great, others sounded dire - as usual the 'room' was given as the problem in some rather 'difficult' demonstrations.

I attended with a friend who has a good ear and owns electrostatics; both of us felt that when it came to the most authentic sound at the show, by which I mean which system most realistically portrays music with authentic and natural tonal timbre, transient response and dynamics to afford the most realistic involvement in the emotional message of the music, and spatial perspectives reminiscent of live performance, along with stunning resolution, it was the Beolab 90's by a country mile.

They dynamics and scale of something like a JBL Everest, with the sense of utter neutrality, clarity and finesse of something like the B&W 800D is one way of describing the sound.

The other is that speaking as a trained classical musician, the Beolab 90 is without doubt the most authentic sounding speaker I have ever heard, and at any price.

Notwithstanding of course the likes of Steinway Lyngdorf systems, or MBL Radialstrahler, neither of which I have heard, but I have little doubt the Beolab 90 is up in that league.

Do try and have a listen if you can - they're more about revolution than evolution when it comes to HiFi as we have known it. And now we have the new Beolab 50 offering a great deal of what the Beolab 90 offered, but at a much more approachable price.


Cheers
oh so you have not compared in the same room with the same source the beaolab, Everest or 800d and you think you can make a serious assesment on how the beolab compares.
worst, you base your opinion of speakers of such quality based on show conditions.

and, you havent heard the beolab 50 yet you are able to say stuff like "Beolab 50 offering a great deal of what the Beolab 90 offered, but at a much more approachable price."
 
The Beolab 50 does share much of the same 'controlled directivity' technology as the 90, I would expect it to measure similarly while perhaps not extending bass control as extensively as the 90.
Keith
 
I'd have expected the 'controled directivity' to be hugely limited in comparison given it has a single horn/wave-guide loaded tweeter rather than the hugely complex multi-driver arrangement of the big ones.
 
True (assuming they are horn or wave-guide loaded) but I thought the whole point was to be able to user-select to taste between a big wide omni presentation, highly focused narow dispersion and all places in between.
 
The 90's are indeed capable of three modes, narrow, wide and 'omni' the Kii's focus on the highest sound quality possible, which is narrow dispersion.
I will have to read the full specs on the 50's.
Keith
 


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