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The 2017 F1 Thread

merlin said:
From a purely personal perspective Ian, I'd like zero engineer to driver communication during the race, either audio or via a dash display. Pit boards allowed to advise on safety grounds and race data.
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I can understand why you would want that. It would cause confusion and hence less predictability and so would give viewers more things to talk about. So from a viewing perspective, which is clearly very important, could be a good thing to do.

I appreciate fully, that to you as an engineer, it is a fairly repugnant idea and that it will never come to pass. I'd like the engineers to have no influence on the outcome of the race once the flag drops.
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Mike, we see it as a team competition and so everyone wants to help the team win in whatever way they can, within the rules. Seems odd to to us say it is a team sport until the flag drops and then it is down to the race driver and the pitstop mechanics.
 
merlin said:
He wasn't Tony and I would hope that they have got the formula right this year. I still won't personally feel the need to shell out for a Sky subscription. I never have and I never will.

They've had to change the model this year from what I understand due to falling audiences world wide. I therefore find solace in not being alone :)
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Ah, Sky.
I would never give money to anything to do with the dreaded Murdoch.
It's Freeview for me and I'm staying with it.
I have no interest in sport which
increasingly seems to be on satellite channels.
 
IanW said:
Mike, we see it as a team competition and so everyone wants to help the team win in whatever way they can, within the rules. Seems odd to to us say it is a team sport until the flag drops and then it is down to the race driver and the pitstop mechanics.
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The problem is that it doesn't really work as a team sport when most of the team is sitting in a backroom somewhere (in many cases on a different continent) doing things that none of the spectators are allowed to see or understand.

If you want to make it a team sport, then as a minimum the backroom team's input has to be visible to the spectators. And at the end of the day it is the spectators that are paying for you to do it.
 
Good discussion.

I think pit to car comms is a key area. I hated drivers getting driving advice from the pits and would vehemently reject that for F1 but I can definitely see the benefit of radio advice helping a driver reset the electronics so that a race can be completed rather than seeing a DNF. I hate seeing cars stopping for technical reasons, even Rosberg ;-) as I want to see an on track battle always.
 
They tried (last year?) to ban almost all comms, and it'd just didn't work. How on earth could you enforce it? Ban anyone, anywhere on the circuit making any gesture whatsoever?

No adjustments to the car by the driver? Why? My last three, and current car have/had adjustments. Why pander to a dinosaur minority?

Yes, I'd love cars to have a manual gearbox, 6 speed, no shark fins, a mechanical throttle, blah blah blah. It ain't gonna happen. So I just get on with trying to enjoy what is shown free to air. Works for me. WRC is better to now, if a little too fast!

The new owners of F1 seem to want F1 much more easily available to all, so Sky's grip might loosen one day. How long is the Sky F1 contract? Yep, no Sky here either, just Freesat.
 
Tony Lockhart said:
Yes, I'd love cars to have a manual gearbox, 6 speed, no shark fins, a mechanical throttle, blah blah blah. It ain't gonna happen. So I just get on with trying to enjoy what is shown free to air. Works for me.
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Glad you are still enjoying it Tony. It sadly doesn't hold my attention these days and I do put the loss of free live races on a Sunday afternoon down as a major reason for that.

I fully understand the team aspect as mentioned by Ian - and it's more an army seemingly than a team these days. For me we have a constructors championship for them and a drivers championship for driving. Old fashioned I know.

I think I was also spoilt by witnessing the turbo F1 era with up to 1400bhp and manual control. Villeneuve horribly out of shape exiting Rascasse feathering a remarkably crude throttle. Real battles between real people with less of the corporate facade that they have to hide behind these days.

It seems every effort to improve the on track action has failed. I gather this years cars are even more difficult in dirty air (hardly surprising) making overtaking more of a challenge. I'd personally rather see a faster car and driver able to overtake than lap records broken.
 
The cars might still have aero problems while in line astern, but this year's Pirellis are hopefully much more durable. Following close behind should be possible for much longer, and that 'might' enable forced errors.

Yep, Merlin, my first two GPS were in 86 and 87. The height of Turbo power. Loved the sound of those engines.
 
Patrick Dixon said:
If you want to make it a team sport, then as a minimum the backroom team's input has to be visible to the spectators. And at the end of the day it is the spectators that are paying for you to do it.
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If the TV companies really wanted to film what went on then I cannot see any real problems with that, but it would be pretty boring to watch.

There is still no clear view what spectators want so whilst they do pay for us to do what we do, there is no direct link. Mercedes funds Mercedes F1 based on what it wants to get from a marketing perspective. They have continued to fund the F1 team and so they must believe that they are making sales and hence money out of their investment.
 
I said their input not their faces! It's a technical sport and if the technical staff are part of the team, then give the public access to all the tools and data so they can see what's going on. But of course the teams don't want that, because they are all busy protecting their advantage over presenting their sport.
 
I doubt very much whether there'd be much demand for much info past tyre pressures. Even that is too geeky for most people. Minute adjustments to brake balance from 20 cars might just detract from on track action.

I think the critics need to give the new F1 owners a chance. Last year's cars are dead and forgotten, as are all previous championships.
 
Tony Lockhart said:
I doubt very much whether there'd be much demand for much info past tyre pressures. Even that is too geeky for most people. Minute adjustments to brake balance from 20 cars might just detract from on track action.
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Exactly, most of it is far too geeky to be of interest to most viewers. And actually most of it is a waste of time, but has the benefit from the team perspective that more people are involved and have a better idea as to what is going on.
 
Patrick Dixon said:
I said their input not their faces! It's a technical sport and if the technical staff are part of the team, then give the public access to all the tools and data so they can see what's going on. But of course the teams don't want that, because they are all busy protecting their advantage over presenting their sport.
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I meant in the general sense!

Motorsports (and other sports, bar Premier League Football and most likely the Spanish league) worldwide are losing market share to other entertainments. With more and more things on offer for people to do and with the internet, easier ways to find access them, this is going to pose problems for all sports for years to come.

I don't think that showing the public the results of some analysis conducted back at the factory is going to be that enticing to solve this problem!
 
IanW said:
I meant in the general sense!

Motorsports (and other sports, bar Premier League Football and most likely the Spanish league) worldwide are losing market share to other entertainments. With more and more things on offer for people to do and with the internet, easier ways to find access them, this is going to pose problems for all sports for years to come.

I don't think that showing the public the results of some analysis conducted back at the factory is going to be that enticing to solve this problem!
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It would give Sky's F1 channel more filler to pad out coverage until the next race. Haha!
 
IanW said:
I don't think that showing the public the results of some analysis conducted back at the factory is going to be that enticing to solve this problem!
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That's not what you'd show them. You would show them where the team thinks the pit stop windows are, what is going into the strategy calls, where the car is in terms of engine modes and performance, tyre position, fuel levels etc, etc.

F1 is a technical sport and I think a fair proportion of the viewers want access to the technological aspect. Otherwise just do away with it and go back to unsophisticated cars that are just fast ... but then you don't need so much of a team.
 
Patrick Dixon said:
F1 is a technical sport and I think a fair proportion of the viewers want access to the technological aspect. Otherwise just do away with it and go back to unsophisticated cars that are just fast ... but then you don't need so much of a team.
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I personally don't think there are enough people interested to justify the budgets required.

Hardcore fans are one thing but F1 needs much broader appeal to be financially viable.

The broader appeal has to come from image and action IMHO. Image has been built up but it's relied on growth and there doesn't appear to be the growth there anymore. The casual viewer (who is representative of the audience the sport needs I would imagine) really doesn't want to see Ian and his mates twiddling with their knobs.
 
Patrick Dixon said:
That's not what you'd show them. You would show them where the team thinks the pit stop windows are, what is going into the strategy calls, where the car is in terms of engine modes and performance, tyre position, fuel levels etc, etc.

F1 is a technical sport and I think a fair proportion of the viewers want access to the technological aspect. Otherwise just do away with it and go back to unsophisticated cars that are just fast ... but then you don't need so much of a team.
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Tens of thousands would switch off.
Most don't give a toss about the specs.
 
Bob McC said:
Tens of thousands would switch off.
Most don't give a toss about the specs.
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Bob, for them there are already the twitter feeds from all the teams and the drivers that are full of platitudes written by representatives who know little about the actual sport.

If F1 is going to continue to be a technological sport, then the technology needs to be more to the fore at least for those who are interested. And the manufacturers are only spending all this money to promote their technology - there are plenty of other motor racing series without it.
 
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