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Your road to audio serenity

Remembering it is about the music first.


is it REALLY though? i guess if i think back honestly and recollect ... of course i was into music before hifi and it was sort of the pretext or excuse to start listening to hifi ... i remember going into a particularly well outfitted dealer and spending HOURS on saturdays listening to music (that i admit i didn't particularly like - e.g. ricki lee jones and supertramp among others) - but it was a total revelation to me ... there was something VERY NEW here going on that certainly had a relationship to music - but i think part of what fuelled my run in hifi over the last forty odd years was something 'else' maybe ... a sensuatlity that i didnt' know existed ... something new for the senses ... in a way it's probably not so far removed from the romance of people addicted to shortwave radio ... maybe the medium IS the message ...?

just a thought ...
 
Probably the wrong person to be responding to this thread having stated categorically in another thread less than 2 weeks ago that I wouldn't be replacing my JR149's or Leak ST20 I've just bought some Harbeth P3ESR's. Absolutely amazing & 1 step nearer to audio nivarna (plus, can relegate the sub to Ebay, no longer needed), now just need to sort TT out, will probably be Planar 8, haven't decided on cart yet. Phono stage either Dynavector PH75 or Verture Phono 1 then I should be just about there (unless a cheap Leben CS300F comes along, been itching to try one for ages). Audiolab 8300CD & Allo Digione into Mytec Liberty DAC on the digital front. Late night listening taken care of by Woo Audio Fireflies & matching PSU + Focal Elear headphones.
 
Another recent convert to Meridian DSP-5000 's - same basic motivation -worth a try for the money and most pleasantly surprised that this is the best / most pleasant sound to come off of my CD's ever (OK -standard quibble -some CD's sound awful the first time you play them and will likely still sound awful after the sun has cooled -nothing -fixes bad recordings) and to my bewilderment -a $15 A2D is doing a remarkably credible job feeding my analog sources into these same speakers. I had a heard a pair of the early networked? self powered Meridians at Chicago CES decades ago -way out of my $ reach then-really love digital depreciation.
 
especially when you run it on a dedicated spur...

Contradiction in terms. Dedicated radial circuit, yes, but a spur cannot be electrically dedicated as it comes off an existing circuit. I've no idea what a (hifi) volcano is, though, nor one connected to reefers.:)
 
OK, dedicated radial then. Terminology is slightly different on opposite sides of the pond; in North America it's simply called a dedicated line.
 
Horizontal in a dark room and wearing massive headphones. Music on the headphones is a bonus, but am quite happy to lie here with nothing playing. Having my head hugged by big, comfy leather pads; just so long as I don't have to do or think about anything much in particular.
 
This is blokes, willies and wedge. No room here for Mother Theresa.

The Prince met a beggar on the road. Seeing that the beggar had a wooden flute, he showed him his noise cancelling headphones that were customised to his ears. And played the beggar some high definition files. The beggar was much impressed, and in return for his praise of the Prince and his headphones he received several masaka from the Prince.

On leaving the beggar, the Prince heard him play the most beautiful music he had ever heard on the simple wooden flute.
 
OK, dedicated radial then. Terminology is slightly different on opposite sides of the pond; in North America it's simply called a dedicated line.

Ah, the States. Then you have radials anyway as your domestic electricity supply, not ring mains like us. Your 'dedicated line' is (presumably) one radial from the consumer unit direct to hifi. Once you take feed from that radial, it becomes a spur, or maybe it splits into a hydra for difference pieces of kit.
 
In an interesting twist, now that there is nothing at all wrong with my set up I have decided that it sounds too good and is distracting me from the music.

The true definition of a conundrum. I guess you have reached the end point...
 
Probably the wrong person to be responding to this thread having stated categorically in another thread less than 2 weeks ago that I wouldn't be replacing my JR149's or Leak ST20 I've just bought some Harbeth P3ESR's. Absolutely amazing & 1 step nearer to audio nivarna (plus, can relegate the sub to Ebay, no longer needed), now just need to sort TT out, will probably be Planar 8, haven't decided on cart yet. Phono stage either Dynavector PH75 or Verture Phono 1 then I should be just about there (unless a cheap Leben CS300F comes along, been itching to try one for ages). Audiolab 8300CD & Allo Digione into Mytec Liberty DAC on the digital front. Late night listening taken care of by Woo Audio Fireflies & matching PSU + Focal Elear headphones.

The Leben has maximum power output of 15w
https://lebenhifi.com/products/cs300f.html
P3ESR (I have a pair) says minimum 15w
https://www.harbeth.co.uk/hifi-speaker/11/Harbeth-P3ESR-loudspeaker

Harbeth minimum power specs will not give you the full potential of the speakers. For a fraction of the cost you can get a power amp that will drive them much better, with or without values (Rega, Croft, Quad Solus). Harbeth are not designed with valves or really for valves.
 
The Leben has maximum power output of 15w
https://lebenhifi.com/products/cs300f.html
P3ESR (I have a pair) says minimum 15w
https://www.harbeth.co.uk/hifi-speaker/11/Harbeth-P3ESR-loudspeaker

Harbeth minimum power specs will not give you the full potential of the speakers. For a fraction of the cost you can get a power amp that will drive them much better, with or without values (Rega, Croft, Quad Solus). Harbeth are not designed with valves or really for valves.
Speaker manufacturers quote recommended minimum amplifier power outputs to discourage people from overdriving low output amps into the speakers thus causing clipping which is extremely damaging to speakers. Valve amps don't clip when overdriven they just start to sound compressed. This is not damaging to the speakers (probably not good for the amp though). There is a lot of nonsense around which speakers work with which kind of amp, if it sounds good it is good. Valve & SS amps both produce an electrical signal to drive the speaker, there is only one kind of electricity.

I seem to recall one review of the P3ESR (think it was Stereophile but I may be mistaken) in which the reviewer speculated that Alan Shaw may have used a Quad Classic amp when developing the speakers because he felt they were so well matched.
 
Probably the wrong person to be responding to this thread having stated categorically in another thread less than 2 weeks ago that I wouldn't be replacing my JR149's or Leak ST20 I've just bought some Harbeth P3ESR's. Absolutely amazing & 1 step nearer to audio nivarna (plus, can relegate the sub to Ebay, no longer needed), now just need to sort TT out, will probably be Planar 8, haven't decided on cart yet. Phono stage either Dynavector PH75 or Verture Phono 1 then I should be just about there (unless a cheap Leben CS300F comes along, been itching to try one for ages). Audiolab 8300CD & Allo Digione into Mytec Liberty DAC on the digital front. Late night listening taken care of by Woo Audio Fireflies & matching PSU + Focal Elear headphones.

The Leben has maximum power output of 15w
https://lebenhifi.com/products/cs300f.html
P3ESR (I have a pair) says minimum 15w
https://www.harbeth.co.uk/hifi-speaker/11/Harbeth-P3ESR-loudspeaker

Harbeth minimum power specs will not give you the full potential of the speakers. For a fraction of the cost you can get a power amp that will drive them much better, with or without values (Rega, Croft, Quad Solus). Harbeth are not designed with valves or really for valves.

Well I’ve been using a Leben CS300XS with my Harbeth P3ESR for more than 3 years now, and it’s a lovely combination when played at low to moderate levels in a small room. Even when played loudly it still sounds very nice, if not quite so balanced. Yes, more power would be beneficial in some ways and I’ve thought about the Leben CS600 at 32Wpc but I’m so happy with the CS300XS that I don’t think I’ll change.
 
Speaker manufacturers quote recommended minimum amplifier power outputs to discourage people from overdriving low output amps into the speakers thus causing clipping which is extremely damaging to speakers. Valve amps don't clip when overdriven they just start to sound compressed. This is not damaging to the speakers (probably not good for the amp though). There is a lot of nonsense around which speakers work with which kind of amp, if it sounds good it is good. Valve & SS amps both produce an electrical signal to drive the speaker, there is only one kind of electricity.

I seem to recall one review of the P3ESR (think it was Stereophile but I may be mistaken) in which the reviewer speculated that Alan Shaw may have used a Quad Classic amp when developing the speakers because he felt they were so well matched.

Alan Shaw has stated that he quotes a minimum power that is sufficient so people don't feel obliged to go out and buy expensive amps. I've never heard him be concerned about driving them to destruction, and I've been to demos with very powerful amplifiers used. The analogy is you wouldn't buy a car with too little power, but you would buy a car with more power than needed and drive it sensibly.

He's made his views known about valve amps over the years. He has mentioned that he has a pile of Quad amps that he has used for decades and gets serviced. They have also used Hegel for demo purposes. So I reckon he didn't count on people going out and buying expensive low power valve amps.

When I got Harbeth SHL5+ I had a very expensive 20w SET and the bass was woolly and basically rubbish. Bought a Quad 909 for £500 and they came to life. A change to 909 Mono and QMP had some minimal benefit, but Devialet 250 Pro gave them more speed (with less power than the Quad, but still more than enough).

I use my P3ESR with a 40w Audiolab M-One which is fine for low listening levels in my office and with headphones. So I agree with NagraBoy on that, except my unit cost £650 new and also has an excellent DAC. I used to use a 909 with them that came from my main system. Again, the P3ESR come alive in a larger room with more power. With less power they will go loud, but with flabby bass. If you keep the bass sharp down to its limit of about 55-60Hz and add a 300w sub, Bob's your uncle.

It is a crying shame that people invest in Harbeth speakers, which are not exactly cheap, and use an expensive amplifier that they think will make them sound better, but when pushed actually makes them sound worse. I think people, Stereophile included, get a little beguiled by the midrange and don't really appreciate how good the bass can be from the 8" Radial2, even the 5" in the P3's.
 


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