1. Things you need to know about the new ‘Conversations’ PM system:

    a) DO NOT REPLY TO THE NOTIFICATION EMAIL! I get them, not the intended recipient. I get a lot of them and I do not want them! It is just a notification, log into the site and reply from there.

    b) To delete old conversations use the ‘Leave conversation’ option. This is just delete by another name.
    Dismiss Notice

Your loudspeaker holy grail

Discussion in 'audio' started by James, May 26, 2021.

  1. Mike P

    Mike P pfm Member

    I'd never heard of this model before but I just Googled it.

  2. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    Probably the passing of time added to my fond memories of hearing these so raising them to the status of 'holy grail'. They all large require a big room to work in and suitable amplification to drive them.
    Magnapan Tympani IVA
    Sound Lab A3
    Beverage Model 2SW
    Dayton Wright XG8 (stacked pair)
    Apogee Scintilla (1 Ohm version).
    At the time I would have the bought the Scintilla's. I spent quite a bit of time listening to pairs of them, but there was no way they would have worked in my room. :(
    Darren likes this.
  3. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Wow #2. New one on me too. I’m not usually a fan of speakers with so many drivers so far apart, but I’d love to hear a pair. Very interesting looking things. Here’s a pair on HiFiDo to save folk searching.
    Garrard 401 and joe9407 like this.
  4. Yank

    Yank Bulbous Also Tapered

    All I want is something that sounds like Quad ESLs but with more extension top and bottom, with the dynamics and sensitivity of a Klipschorn. Is that really too much to ask?
  5. chartz

    chartz If it’s broke fix it!

    Probably yes. ;)
    I’d like that too, of course.
  6. deserter

    deserter pfm Member

    Shahinian Diapasons. Heard once, the perfect speaker with a competent amplifier.

    Oh, and a house big enough
    TimF, Simon s and Tigerjones like this.
  7. Tigerjones

    Tigerjones Bagpuss

    Yes, great choice. And you’re right about the house.
  8. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    If one contemplates the theoretical ideal loudspeaker design I suspect you’d end up with a single driver point source with a ruler flat frequency response from 20Hz to 20kHz with close to zero mass and close to 100% efficiency (we can debate whether the point source should be a sphere or front-firing, both have merit). It is clear loudspeaker design, even the absolute state of the art best of it, is still in kindergarten compared to the rest of audio. The closest we’ve ever got to this ideal to my mind is likely the Quad ESL 63, but they are clearly inefficient and lacking in dynamic range.

    You hit the current dilemma right on the head. So many of the very best speakers in existence excel at one area at the expense of another. The ones that don’t just tend to do nothing exceptionally well. All speakers are obviously compromised, so it is a matter of finding a compromise that doesn’t impede your musical taste in your room. This being why no one will ever agree on speakers, nor what to drive them with as much of the time they need some priority assisting or even some fault-masking. I describe this as ‘system synergy’!
    Garrard 401 and Yank like this.
  9. davidjt

    davidjt pfm Member

    I have a pair of '57s with Townshend super-tweeters and REL subs, so the extension and dynamics are there if not the sensitivity. But I still wonder occasionally if 2905s wouldn't be an improvement. Or even Martin Logans - a faulty pair had to go back years ago but even with one dodgy panel I could hear how great they should have been. Yet to scratch the Tannoy or Klipschorn itch and probably won't get there now. Most fun so far? Probably still the Lx-minis.
  10. Del monaco

    Del monaco Del Monaco

    Bigger Maggies.
    Miss Ariel, davidjt and Amber Audio like this.
  11. ToTo Man

    ToTo Man the band not the dog

    I'd love to hear a pair of Celestion Ditton 88 to compare to my 66. I was a whisker away from owning a pair around 10 years ago but was outbid in the dying seconds, which is probably just as well as I would have been a huge punt. I've only seen one pair for sale since and those too went for more than I'd be comfortably paying. TBH almost all of speaker purchases have been 'educated punts' as in most cases I did not have the means of auditioning before buying. That's part of the fun, or at least it was in the early days when I loved to box swap and hopefully earn a small profit along the way. I don't have the motivation or stamina for that these days, and it's becoming increasingly difficult to re-home big ugly boxes. I've learned to be content with what I've got, which is what some would probably consider a speaker collection vast enough to open a small shop! :D
    Last edited: May 27, 2021
    Nytechy likes this.
  12. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    That’s another new one on me, though looking at pics it wouldn’t surprise me if it wasn’t a cost cutting exercise as it doesn’t replicate the 66s dome mid, which I suspect is where much of the magic lies. It would be interesting to hear the differences. If anything the 88 looks more like a 44 with a passive radiator.
    ToTo Man likes this.
  13. Miss Ariel

    Miss Ariel pfm Member

    Me too Del.
    20.1's blew me away.Have never heard such transparancy...if I ever get that lotto win....:)
    Del monaco likes this.
  14. Fatmarley

    Fatmarley Agnostic

    ToTo Man likes this.
  15. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Hook and Fatmarley like this.
  16. Yank

    Yank Bulbous Also Tapered

    Sorry, but a single snare drum strike at levels the K-horns would take in stride would have the Quads shooting sparks. There's no way anything using Quad 57s as a component could approach realistic dynamics.
    Gervais Cote likes this.
  17. mandryka

    mandryka pfm Member

    Why do you say they are lacking in dynamic range? With the Krell (only 50W pc) they do loud and they do quiet.

    They may not be so inefficient either, there's quite a bit of discussion about this. I can drive mine with a 25W Radford valve amp.
  18. sq225917

    sq225917 Bit of this, bit of that

    Oh yeh. Take an ns1000m on steroids and mix it with the kef maidstone.
  19. tpetsch

    tpetsch pfm Member

    When set up "correctly" I have had very positive experiences with LINN Aktiv -w/NAXO- DMS. ...Passive too.
  20. sean99

    sean99 pfm Member

    I'd be very interested to here the genelec dual concentrics
    Never heard any maggies or quads. Heard some MLs but they seemed very vague.
    Would also like to hear some big Audio Physics since they have such a good reputation for disappearing.

Share This Page


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice